To find this revelation from an NHS carer shocking?

[Lizzie523]

I have a very vulnerable family member that I have not seen since covid. She is now in the late stages of alzheimers and have been starting to wonder if I will ever see her again.

Recently her carers had been visiting her whilst also going to look after a person with covid at the same time. Their highers up explicitly told them they must not inform us or other family members this was happening/the risk to her.

So far she has not caught covid but I dont feel confident about it not happening in future. AIBU to be beside myself with worry?

I agree with you Vivana, 12 hours a day or night, having to wear ppe all the time.

[quote baublesbaubleseverywhere]@Retiremental that's not accurate. Residential / nursing home fees are expensive and are means tested.
Social care in the community is also means tested and clients have to pay, though of course someone would not be expected to sell their house to pay for it.
If someone meets the criteria for CHC funding, then their care is funded by the NHS, whether at in the community or in a home, but the threshold is very high, and even someone with end stage dementia may not need it.
NHS input, be it district nursing, therapy etc, is always free because that that the NHS, thank god.

When I meet families at the point of trying to make the difficult decision of placing their relative into a home, financial issues are one of many. And it's fairly rare that I see loss of inheritance as a major driver. [/quote]
How patronising.
You do realise that different areas of the UK have different funding criteria and that there are many other people ( myself included) who have significant experience in this area?
And issues around funding/inheritance are much more prevalent than you would like everyone to believe?

@Retiremental it wasn't meant to be patronising. It was just supposed to show that social care is not free everywhere. It's great to hear that it still is in some places. I guess inheritance issues are going to be more prevalent where the option is between free home care and self funded residential care, which isn't the case in any the areas I've worked over the last 15years.

Additionally, lots of people with advanced dementia as well as all sorts of other disabilities don't want to move into a care home, they'd rather stay in their own home.

[quote slipperywhensparticus]@ChestnutStuffing

Her family member is elderly and vulnerable you have just patronised her for being concerned about an illness that primarily effects the old and vulnerable when that's her exact issue?[/quote]
No, I've suggested that she is way out of proportion in terms of the response she thinks is appropriate for this virus.

The elderly and vulnerable are more likely to be affected by any number of viruses, not just Covid. Behaving as if all of them require the highest level of biosecurity is not only impossible, it's not useful, and it would even be even cruel because it would require significant isolation. Covid is already making the lives of many elderly, vulnerable people hell, and causing deterioration of their health as they are separated from a normal life and their loved ones.

Different biohazards are treated differently in medical practice, in line with their nature - how serious they are. That's not decided randomly.

Honestly, I don't think the people on this thread are intending to knock carers.

I think they honestly are ignorant and naive about disease and prevention of transmission.

It's the same with every infectious disease. We assume everyone has HIV, and so wear gloves and sterilise everything appropriately.

There are a number of elements of the public response that remind me a lot of the behaviour at the beginning of the HIV crises, where people wanted to have HIV positive people in separate hospitals, children kicked out of schools, and so on.

@Motorina It may be incorrect where you work but it’s not incorrect at the trust where I work.

@ChristmasUserName2020 PHE only recommends FFP3 for AGP's. It's good to hear some trusts are offering it for all covid +ve, but it's certainly not the norm. And it's very unlikely that social care staff would be given FFP3 masks (but I'm happy to be told some are).
I think it's important that people understand that the paper surgical masks are what is deemed adequate PPE for non AGPs, so personal care etc. Otherwise clients and relatives will feel more nervous about how safe they are.

@DontStopThinkingAboutTomorrow

Someone mentioned Covid+ people being on Covid- wards. Yes, it happens. But the nursing and HCAs caring for those with Covid don't go anywhere near the bays with those who don't have it. And vv.

You are joking? Last time I was in hospital, one nurse and 1 HCA were caring for 12 patients. If one of them tested positive (which happens fairly regularly I believe, even on negative wards), the nurse and HCA can't just stop caring for the other 11 because one is positive in one bay or side room.

I'm not joking. My daughter is a ward sister and that's exactly how they're operating. Bays are set aside for those with Covid and staff are in two teams, one for those with Covid and one for those neegative.

They would only be disclosing someone else's data, and as such breaching GDPR if they were to disclose the name or any identifiable data about the Covid patient/s. I don't think that is the case in this instance???

If they are wearing full PPE and following infection control they don't have to disclose that information. As there should be no chance of passing the virus on. Whether that should be the way or not is different. But no they don't have to tell you.

How did you find this out?

Community nurses treat COVID positive in the community then treat non Covid positive, enter care homes aswell.

No you don’t have the right to know who carers treat, they will be trained in donning and doffing ppe, Hand hygiene and are likely to be tested twice weekly themselves for Covid, by now these hero’s carers will likely have had their first vaccination.

This is happening everywhere. We are being lied to

No one is lying to anyone

I dont know why you are shocked really. Loads of prople have covid. Who do you expect to look after them? Carers cant refuse to care for someone with covid because theyre looking after people without the virus? Im looking after covids and non covids. Thats the job.

As a care worker I completely understand your frustrations but sadly people with COVID also need care. I can guarantee you they will be using correc PPE and hand washing as they will also not want to take it home to their families. It’s a tough one and I totally understand how worrying it is but just think how many people have COVID and don’t know so the risk is there every day anyway. Big hugs to you. It’s such a hard time. I hope you get to see her soon

FGS we are doing our bloody best, what do people want BLOOD.

Whilst I think it’s perfectly reasonable to be told that someone has tested positive, it’s unreasonable for you to believe that you will be able to find someone not in contact. You might not even know because the person is asymptomatic. You could have had it and not know. That’s the whole issue. Yes you should know ‘someone’ has tested positive but you aren’t going to be able to guarantee that you will know if they have or have had Covid if they don’t know it themselves. If it was that easy we wouldn’t be in this mess necessarily.

This is quite normal, and that is what PPE is for. They also shouldn’t be discussing patients. Before covid, community staff (nhs and private) would attend patients with other infectious diseases e.g. c diff, mrsa positive etc and if that was transmitted to the wrong person that would make them seriously ill or worse but PPE, ANTT and handwashing is in place to prevent that. The system is stretched as it is, they can’t get 2 separate work forces for covid and non-covid.

To all those saying that the carer with covid would be wearing ppe, my mum was terminally ill through out the pandemic, we did stop carers coming in from end February until beginning of august. But once they started coming in again (and I went back to work) 3/4 out of 10 did not wear their ppe correctly, gloves and aprons, fine, masks were not worn properly even while they were doing personal care. Noses out or both mouth and noses. Fiddling with them constantly (which I get, I find myself reaching to touch my mask often, most times I stop myself but if I don’t then I put on a new mask.

We got cameras up and one of us would say ‘that the mask needs to be covering your face correctly, please put it on properly, we told the agency on 48 occasions in 3 month. Then mum passed away, not covid related, just had enough and let go.

Now dad has 4 care visits a day, different agency, still have to tell one of them a day to tell them to put the mask on properly and a lot of times to remember to wash their hands!

I don't think anyone has mentioned carers working knowing that they are covid positive Callaird.

Where were you when you were instructing carers via camera about how to care for your mum?

Hi,

I work in intensive care caring for both non covid patients and Covid patients. My team also cover a number of surgical wards, some of the these wards are specifically for patients who have shielded prior to their operation. We, as I’m sure you can appreciate, have to move between both Covid and non Covid areas through the day. We minimise risk by trying to always see non Covid patients before moving to Covid areas.

This isn’t always possible as patients need treating a number of times a day. To prevent spread we change uniforms between areas, have full PPE which includes long gown, full FFP3 respirators, visors, 2 pairs of gloves and a surgical scrub cap to see our Covid patients. Infection control informed us that the spread from those areas was negligible following these procedures.

As health care workers people do not want to do anything to cause unnecessary harm so the care team looking after your relative will also have strict infection control policies. You are also within your right to ask for transparency from the managers as they can do this without breaching anything IG as you shouldn’t know the other patients on the carers list.

vodkaredbullgirl

Exactly all these experts on here thinking they know better than carers makes me laugh. Don't they realise it's more than just taking care of someone. There is a lot of training specially about infection control etc. They forget we put ourselves at risk looking after there relatives.
Bet half of them on here are in the safety of there homes whilst keyworkers are putting themselves at risk. I love my job and make sure I follow the correct guideline set out by the company and cqc.

IMO it is impossíble to separate carers by patient illness. Be it Covid, pneumonia ir other infectious disease. They need to follow hygiene procedures but can't be avoided realistically