To give ds a glass of brandy to get him to sleep?!

[Startingoveryetagain]

The title is lighthearted incase I get flamed or is that a viable option?

Ds 9 does not sleep and it is driving me insane, not to mention physically draining me.
Its honestly like having a newborn, he has always been like this since birth but I'd hoped he would have grown out of it by now.

His normal bedtime is 8 o'clock most nights, he's up and down the stairs coming into my room until at least midnight, he then goes to sleep but is usually up again by 3-4am and gets into my bed.

I've tried everything from lavender baths and sprays on his pillow, white noise even bloody whale music!
He's obviously very tired as he's not concentrating at school, has dark circles under his eyes and will sleep in until late on the weekend of I let him. It's also driving me insane that i can't seem to get him up in the mornings either.

Any suggestions please?

@ILikeStrongTea

Have you tried a weighted blanket?

I've just bought myself a weighted blanket - been using it for almost a week, it's brilliant. I'm getting much deeper sleep, although it took a couple of nights to get used to. A lot of the blankets were recommended for older children. Some are v expensive, I found a 9kg one for about £40 (ebay)

@NoSquirrels He's the younger sibling, but they're twins so have the same bedtime. It makes no difference how late or early I put them to bed it's still the same every night.

They're usual routine is dinner 5.30-6pm they can then watch tv or use their tablet until 7, then its bath, teeth, bed! Ds1 will usually read now and again he'll get up and ask for water or go to the toilet, but he's usually asleep by 8.30-9pm then I'm left with Ds2 up and down like a yoyo until all hours. Tonight he was asleep by 9.40, but I can guarantee he will be awake in the next two hours, be awake for an hour or so then go back to sleep.

You could try putting him to bed later. I've suffered insomnia my whole life, and when I was your son's age my parents realised putting me to bed too early just caused me to lie there getting frustrated. My bedtime became 10pm and I got on a lot better because I was more tired by then.

Binaural beats for sleep are also good, better than white noise, but they work best with headphones which might be a bit difficult if he’s in bed.

He is old enough to understand that he is disturbing you... and that it is reasonable not to do so if he is not frightened/ill. Ask him to think of what is good for you!

I am sympathetic (a life-long struggle with getting to sleep) but he is going to need to learn not to disturb others.

Sadly, boredom works best.

Not getting up when you wake up is important. Having to stay in the room and to be quiet is a way of resting even if you can't sleep.

-Reading works too (not a blue-lit screen - though 'a paper-white' Kindle worked for me). The content had to be not too exciting - just enough to lift the boredom a bit. These days it is routine for me and 20 mins can make me sleepy.

My 9 year old is the same but slept well as a baby but now is a night owl. My GP thinks they may be a correlation between night shift workers and this seen I worked nights for many many years. I do not stress over it now, the more I battled him the more he bounced about, he will regulate himself eventually.

That's actually a very good suggestion @Steppemum I'll give that a try from tomorrow.

@ForeverBubblegum

Weighed blanket

Good idea, my son has got Sensory Processing Disorder and has a weighted blanket, cushion etc, although in his case it's made no difference.

@Diverseduvet

Have you tried an anti histamine? This was actually recommended to me by a GP and it does work. He needs to break the cycle which is not easy.

Good advice. Give him a fair bit od puritan one night and it might break the cycle xx

In Eastern Europe the common practice was (and in rural areas is) that mums make a poppy tea. Basically give a little opiates to kids to help them sleep better (and longer)

just an idea on the lighthearted side :)

Consult a good sleep consultant, if you can afford it. Maybe see a GP too, just to rule out health concerns.

Thanks again, I'll also look into a weighted blanket obviously I'll need to get him weighed first to check I get the right one.

@GalaxyCookieCrumble Honestly he has been like this since birth! He was never a big crier, but would wake up have his feed then just lay there staring, he also still has his blanket that he still sleeps with as the only way I could get him to sleep when he was a baby was to cover his head with it and that's how he goes to sleep now.

Can I just say, piriton makes some kids sleepy. It has no effect on some and it make some hyper. So if you have never used it, bedtime is not the time to try!

@Bagamoyo1

GPs can’t prescribe melatonin unless it is initiated by a specialist and used for certain specific medical conditions such as ADHD.

This is true. DS i( 15) s seeing a psychiatrist via CAMHS.. He was very depressed and sleeping extremely badly when he started but is quite a bit better now. Melatonin has definitely helped him fall asleep earlier in the evening He doesn't take it every night any more but still has it sometimes.

We have had a strict bedtime routine since he was a baby , with no devices in his room at all. This helped to a certain extent but his sleep deteriorated to such a degree that I am grateful he could try melatonin. The GP can't prescribe it though

The children’s sleep charity were a life saver for us

I was like this as a child. I was prescribed a sedative antihistamine medicine to stop me scratching my severe eczema. It also had the lovely side effect of rotting my baby teeth as it was full of sugar and was the only way I could sleep.

I stopped getting it when I was 11 and I’ve struggled with my sleep since. I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder at the age of 28 and my doctors aren’t sure if the sleep problems caused this or this caused the sleep problems. I’ve also been diagnosed with a sleep disorder in the past few years. I do all the sleep hygiene stuff. I have blackout blinds, eye mask, I listen to mediation music etc but I cannot fall asleep naturally. Well, I can but it’s not in any routine or pattern that would enable me to have a normal life, I can be awake for 27/28 hours at a time before being able to drop off without medicinal help. This means my bedtime gets pushed further and further back until I’m sleeping during the day so can’t hold down a job/study etc. I have a slightly normal-ish life now on medication for the bipolar (which is sedative) and a sleeping tablet nightly. I alternate that with an antihistamine called Promethazine (Phenergan) which you can buy over the counter and can get in liquid form for children. I still find it hard to drop off even with the tablets but it’s much better now than before. I was dismissed for years as just not trying hard enough to get into a routine when there was genuinely something wrong.

@Returnofthemaccys

And if he is scared. Is there space for him to sleep in with you? Better than medicating him surely and he will eventually deal with it in his own time.

Imagine someone saying, 'Don't medicate your child for diabetes. He will eventually deal with it in his own time'.

Sleep disorders are real and so are neurological disorders that cause them. Sometimes melatonin (which, by the way, is a naturally occurring substance that we all make) is a fantastic solution that enables a child to sleep, function, not slip into depression and be able to learn. You can buy them as gummies over the counter in most other countries. It's not a sleeping pill.

@Returnofthemaccys sorry did I miss the part where OP said her son had been diagnosed with a sleep disorder? Or do you just inject Insulin into your child when you suspect your child might be diabetic?

I specifically said if he is scared not if he has a diagnosed neurological disorder

Audio book/lavender oil/cedar wood oil.

But I also think that you need to take a harder line on it. A nine year old shouldn’t be up and down the stairs and certainly not getting into bed with you in the middle of the night, and he should be told in no uncertain terms that while you are understanding of his not being able to sleep, that doesn’t give him the right to keep everyone else awake.

Melatonin! My sister and her DD both have ADHD and find this stuff a godsend!

Of course yabu, gin is much more effective.

My ds went through this, turned out he was being severely bullied at school. Anything worrying him?

Camomile tea is good.

Cut out the tablet. No screens for the last hour or more if poss. Stimulates the brain.

Sorry but at 9 even if he wakes at 3 in the morning he is old enough to stay in his own room being quiet until getting up time, unless he had had particularly bad nightmares. He's doing it because he can, it's a habit he needs to break

It's very common for people to wake multiple times in the night, some believe humans evolved with 2 sleep cycles not one long one, so there is nothing wrong other than the actions he takes when he is awake

Melatonin rocks!

I have no answer I'm afraid, just sympathy. I had one the same and caved and bought a super king bed through sheer exhaustion.

Sleep hygiene works for some children but at 9 years old, it's likely you've tried everything under the sun (like I did).

There is hope on the horizon in that he'll grow out of it soon. My child stopped coming into our room aged about 10 and it's quite rare for an adolescent to want to sleep in their parent's bed. Hold on there, this will pass!