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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To give ds a glass of brandy to get him to sleep?!

110 replies

Startingoveryetagain · 07/12/2020 22:33

The title is lighthearted incase I get flamed or is that a viable option? Grin

Ds 9 does not sleep and it is driving me insane, not to mention physically draining me.
Its honestly like having a newborn, he has always been like this since birth but I'd hoped he would have grown out of it by now.

His normal bedtime is 8 o'clock most nights, he's up and down the stairs coming into my room until at least midnight, he then goes to sleep but is usually up again by 3-4am and gets into my bed.

I've tried everything from lavender baths and sprays on his pillow, white noise even bloody whale music!
He's obviously very tired as he's not concentrating at school, has dark circles under his eyes and will sleep in until late on the weekend of I let him. It's also driving me insane that i can't seem to get him up in the mornings either.

Any suggestions please?

OP posts:
Mydogdoesntlisten · 07/12/2020 22:59

Also, I'd leave his bedroom door open with maybe landing or bathroom light on?

Prestel · 07/12/2020 23:01

Blackout blinds are a good idea if you don't have them already, as even a small amount of light can disturb a light sleeper. Also having a red light on before lights out is supposed to be good in the opposite way that blue light from screens is not.
Have you tried putting him to bed later? If there's a time he normally, finally settles, the idea is to put him to bed shortly before that time, so he drops off soon after going to bed, then gradually move it forwards by small amounts.
Also, if it's possible, you need to put him back in his own bed if he gets up in the night, really, but I know it's not easy.

Mydogdoesntlisten · 07/12/2020 23:05

Prestel, I'm like that now, as in needing a dark room to sleep. I remember when I was a child being quite afraid of the dark so I needed a light on to be able to sleep though.

Tootsietootie · 07/12/2020 23:12

Life long insomniac here. Do NOT try drugs until you have done a month of properly not half arsed for a couple of days:

  1. Repeated bedtime routine that is relaxing and calm (bath/massage/low voices/stories)
  2. Clear rules that you stick to. Told the day or two before in a really positive way (these can be whatever you like, I hated children sleeping my bed so they never did (after a few days of perseverance) some people don't mind, but the worst thing is to make rules, and break them in the middle of of the night cos you can't be arsed to stick to them)
  3. Absolutely no screens have any time after 6pm and not more than an hour a day.
  4. At least an hour of proper exercise a day.
  5. Something that is calming (mediation/yoga Nidra for kids/relaxing the body/massage)
  6. A low GI diet in the main
Have I been given medication as a child I would still be on them 40 years later probably with horrific side effects/ addictions as my cousin has.
FortunesFave · 07/12/2020 23:13

My DD (12) was like this. She was recently diagnosed with ADD.

Tippexy · 07/12/2020 23:17

For a start, you need to get him out of the habit of coming into your bed at 3/4am. He's old enough to understand that this isn't appropriate as adults need to sleep and not be disturbed. Encourage him to stay in his own room and read a book. He may find waking up so early is less appealing to him then.

AlwaysLatte · 07/12/2020 23:18

Some great suggestions on here - hopefully you will find some of them work and you can have that brandy for yourself. Thanks
During the first lockdown my 12 seemed to be awake half the night when previously he was a great sleeper and we quickly realised he was missing a strong routine when we relaxed things at bedtime so we picked up the pre-lockdown routine again - familiar sections: shower/cereal (his thing!)/teeth/bed and story if wanted. Or just a chat, which he sometimes prefers. But pretty much closely timed. Also he set his alarm for the same time every morning.

Plus when his mind is buzzing for whatever reason he can't sleep well and needs to talk things out so we make sure we have a good chat with him. Even if it's just about his favourite Youtuber!
Now he's back to going to sleep by 10 and waking up at 6.30.
Making sure he has enough exercise and water too also helps for him.

PastMyBestBeforeDate · 07/12/2020 23:19

GPs in England cannot start a prescription of melatonin. A consultant must do the initial prescription and they can request the GP continues the prescription.

Tippexy · 07/12/2020 23:19

Also, stop letting him have a lie in at the weekends. Establish a 7 day a week routine.

Returnofthemaccys · 07/12/2020 23:20

And if he is scared. Is there space for him to sleep in with you? Better than medicating him surely and he will eventually deal with it in his own time.

Imagine someone saying, 'Don't medicate your child for diabetes. He will eventually deal with it in his own time'.

Sleep disorders are real and so are neurological disorders that cause them. Sometimes melatonin (which, by the way, is a naturally occurring substance that we all make) is a fantastic solution that enables a child to sleep, function, not slip into depression and be able to learn. You can buy them as gummies over the counter in most other countries. It's not a sleeping pill.

DangerMouse17 · 07/12/2020 23:21

8pm is not too early for a 9yr old @possums4evr
Hmm

He needs to stop getting out of bed. If he wakes he should read and then try again when feeling sleepy. No screens after 7ish, ensure enough exercise etc. He shouldn't be wandering and then in your bed at 3am. He needs to stay in his own bed...unless of course he is scared of being alone? Is all well at school etc?

user1473878824 · 07/12/2020 23:23

I agree that there is no way he should be coming in to you at 3am. Once in a blue moon after a terrifying nightmare, sure. Dim lamp on and a book for 15 minutes and see if that helps him drift off at that time?

rosiejaune · 07/12/2020 23:28

Delayed Sleep Phase Disorder?

5zeds · 07/12/2020 23:29

More exercise, more food, no screens, get up at the same time every day.

Original poster
Startingoveryetagain · 07/12/2020 23:33

Thanks for all the suggestions, I have looked into melatonin and I know GPs can't prescribe them without prior treatment.

He's definitely not scared of the dark or lonely as he shares with his brother and they do have a light in the room which I turn off once they're asleep and leave the bathroom light on.
He's not really a big reader, but he does like an audiobook on.

I agree that he's too big to be in my bed now and it's not every night, but enough to disturb my sleep.
I don't expect them to go straight to sleep at 8pm but they do need to be in bed relaxing at that time, as they're up @ 7.30 to get ready for school.

OP posts:
Original poster
Startingoveryetagain · 07/12/2020 23:35

@5zeds could that be another reason for not sleeping? That's one of his excuses for getting up is that he's hungry, but hes also not a very big eater and is quite slim for his age.

OP posts:
sadsack78 · 07/12/2020 23:36

Go see a doctor if you need to. From the outside it sounds like he possibly has some anxiety about falling asleep, particularly on his own, which is more common than you'd think, and no failing of yours as a parent.
As the other posts suggest, there are lots of things to try, including weighted blankets etc.
If your ds has any siblings he could share a room with at night time, or even a pet that could come in with him at night, it might help ease his anxiety.
Has your son said anything to indicate how he feels about bedtime or going to sleep?
Good luck- you're doing your best and chronic sleep deprivation is miserable.

sadsack78 · 07/12/2020 23:37

update- just read your lates op, so ignore my wittering :)

Bagadverts · 07/12/2020 23:38

What is he saying when he comes in? Is it delaying tactics- another drink, check something for tomorrow? Anxiety about being alone/fear of the dark?

I agree about darkness as a light sleeper. I was an insomniac as a child, up till midnight or around that even school nights. Till about 10 happy reading or listening to the radio (speech Radio 4). I didn’t like getting to midnight or later as I felt alone (and I found the sailing tune sad). I was better with audio books. Mostly grew out of it - was waking up about 6am.

NoSquirrels · 07/12/2020 23:46

What's his actual bedtime routine? And is he the younger or older sibling? Might he drop off quicker in a dark, quiet room alone, in fact?

One of my DC can have trouble going to sleep, if we miss the "window". So going too early, or too late. Perhaps 8pm really isn't his ideal bedtime, and a slightly later bedtime would work better, when his brother is already asleep?

Original poster
Startingoveryetagain · 07/12/2020 23:47

Currently I don't think he's anxious or worried about anything, because if he is his sleeping does get worse.

@Bagadverts It could be anything! The other night he came down and asked "if fluff fell from the sky would it cry?" Hmm I've had every excuse in the book, every question asked it's all just too much now.

I will definitely give my GP a call tomorrow and see if I can get him an appointment.

OP posts:
steppemum · 07/12/2020 23:48

You need to try a sleep clinic.

My SIL did it with hers, and all the stuff was relatively simple, but together it worked. One reason that it worked was the consistancy.

Loads of good suggestions already, I would add

  1. snack before bed. If he isn't eating enough, then give him an extra snack to see him through.
  2. He needs a plan fo rwhen he wakes up in the middle of the night. So a very low light bedside light that he can turn on, go to the loo, gte a drink, and then back to bed. His bed only, not allowed to come to you unless he is ill.
  3. My dd has trouble falling asleep. During lockdown she has migrated to doing everything on her bed, homework, minecraft, reading, chatting to friends etc etc. Then she slept in her bed. We have just rearranged her bedroom so she has a chill zone where she does all the other stuff, and her bed which is only for sleep. We only did it a week ago, but it is helping already.
4.It is Ok if he doesn't go straight off to sleep. Take the pressure off. It is bedtime, he can listen to an audio book, read, but what he cannot do is come up and down stairs.
steppemum · 07/12/2020 23:49

@Startingoveryetagain

Currently I don't think he's anxious or worried about anything, because if he is his sleeping does get worse.

@Bagadverts It could be anything! The other night he came down and asked "if fluff fell from the sky would it cry?" Hmm I've had every excuse in the book, every question asked it's all just too much now.

I will definitely give my GP a call tomorrow and see if I can get him an appointment.

notebook. All questions go in the book. You will answer in the morning. When he comes down, don't answer, ask him if he has written his question down? Good then no need to come down.
DoTheNextRightThing · 07/12/2020 23:51

Get some Piriton in him. That will do it.

m0therofdragons · 07/12/2020 23:52

Have you tried warm milk drinks before bed so he feels full? 8pm is a totally normal time for a 9yo and mine regularly come into my bed at around 6am (twins age 9 - luckily they seem to take turns). Dtd2 is currently having nightmares which I had around that age. Are you firm about starting in his room and resting his body even if he can’t sleep? Definitely worth a chat with your gp though. Good luck op.

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