To not bother with “friend”

[Purplelemon7]

Who hasn’t ever made any effort to see my two kids who were born over the last few years but wants me to come over for dinner with my DH now to see her new place? She was a close friend and lives 20 mins away from me and doesn’t hate kids or anything. Sent me messages to congratulate me on their births and said she would let me know when she could visit both times but never did. My eldest is going to be two soon.

@MatildaTheCat

I don’t think people take open invitations seriously. It’s a bit like, ‘we must have lunch sometime.’

If I want to see someone I get out my diary. Which is, in fact, what she’s doing now.

I agree with @MatildaTheCat

I understand the point about open invitations but isn’t a bit different when a close friend has a life changing event happen in their life? Isn’t that something you should prioritise and make time for? I was actually struggling mentally with the first child as people often do and I remember telling her about it over whatsapp, so even if she didn’t care about my kids wouldn’t it have made sense to make the effort to see me?

Having children might be boring to those who don't have them but lots of stuff people discuss is boring or not related to me. If my friend couldn't show a tiny bit of interest in meeting up with me or seeing my new child in 2 years I probably would bother with them as they would be a bit self absorbed. Same as a friend who wanted everything to revolve around a new child. Big life events matter to real friends whether that is a child, new job or home.

Although I get what you're saying op, I think that you are still expecting your friend to prioritise your children - did you reach out to her when you were struggling for example? I know I certainly wouldn't turn up to visit on an open type invitation, I would always wait for an arranged date and time - maybe that's just me. The fact that you had just had a baby would make me even less likely to just call round - I'd be worried that your would be to tired to entertain etc. I think as others have suggested go visit, have dinner and see if the friendship has stood the test of time/change of circumstances. What's the worst that could happen after all

@Fredthefrog That’s what I feel too. I’m conscious of the fact that children aren’t interesting to everyone so I definitely avoid making all my conversations about them and I do see friends without my kids, but the others have all shown some interest in my kids i.e. have met them once. One of my friends isn’t very confident with small babies so she asked if she could come when they were a few months old which was absolutely fine with me.

@Mydogmylife It wasn’t an open invitation to turn up whenever she felt like it, it was for her to tell me what day suited her best as she works three days a week and I’m on mat leave so I was at home pretty much all the time. She’s had two years to find a day that she worked but she hasn’t.

OP YANBA, she didn't show any interest in a huge event in your life but now wants you to come over and admire her new house. Nah, you deserve better "friends" than this.

I had my first child when I was 35 which was quite late for my group. As such I spent the 7 years leading up to that being the single friend traipsing round the houses of friends every weekend to hang out with them and their newborns/toddlers.

It wasn't just dull, it was really upsetting at times. Friends who were parents had no interest in my 'single' life or what was going on for me. Conversations were dominated by the wee people in the room. No actual chat was achieved.

I understood of course, but it didn't lead to a fulfilling experience for me.

Now that I have my own children I would never judge a friend for not wanting to hang out with them. Those friends may have any of a huge variety of things going on that might they might not want to hang out with kids, plus my kids are not me, and I not am capable of full attention to an adult conversation when I am with them. I wholeheartedly support any friend who does not want to spend their spare time in my children's company.

Plus it's passive agressive to suggest an 'open invitation' and then blame your friend for it not coming to fruition. You are capable of suggesting a solid plan too.

YABU. Why would she visit your children? As a mum i find this hard to accept too, but here's the thing - OUR KIDS AREN'T AS EXCITING TO OTHERS AS THEY ARE TO US! Friends without kids don't want to hang out with your kids. Don't be high maintainance! Just go and have a nice dinner and ebjoy a night off

Also, everything @LadyLaSnack said!

@LadyLaSnack I think what you’re describing is quite different and I agree that’s wrong. I would never expect my friends to spend all their time with my kids or not take any interest in their single lives. I enjoy the time I have with my single/childless friends where we meet up outside without my kids around and talk about non-child related things. Admittedly I can’t do it as much as I would like to but thankfully my friends are understanding of that.

I also think it’s a bit aggressive to push someone to see you when you have given them several opportunities to give you a date that works for them, which is only common sense if they are working and have less free time you are at home most of the time.

She has invited you over after all, she's doing a nice thing. And if you've just been waiting for her to tell you when she's free to visit you, why haven't you invited her over? Sounds a bit one way, she has to both invite you over and in invite herself over to yours to maintain a friendship with you? That's what is sounds like.

@Purplelemon7

I understand the point about open invitations but isn’t a bit different when a close friend has a life changing event happen in their life? Isn’t that something you should prioritise and make time for? I was actually struggling mentally with the first child as people often do and I remember telling her about it over whatsapp, so even if she didn’t care about my kids wouldn’t it have made sense to make the effort to see me?

I think new parents can become a bit blinkered and what’s a life changing event for you can be nothing of significance to someone else.

Your social life must be very limited if you only accept invitations from people who commit to showing an interest in your children. It's dinner - not a tit-for-tat of I'm not admiring your curtains if you don't admire my kids.

I'm against the grain here but my friends (not acquaintances, friends!) the ones who care, who I speak to a lot and I consider to be my close friends check on me and see me after I've given birth to a child because that's hard even if you don't have children you know that. The person doesnt have to be interested in children but in you and your well-being as your friend. It's huge life changing event and if she wasn't that bothered, i wouldn't be but that's how I feel. Friendship should never be one sided but I want my friends to be there when life changing shit happens and I am there for them 100%.

I have wonderful friends who I have known my entire life and others I met along the way aka uni etc. If someone isn't interested, then why would I be but if you feel like you've been missing her and you would like to relight the fire, go for dinner. I personally would rather have a babysitter to go for dinner with what I would class a real friend.

That's my very personal opinion and very different to other people's opinions on here, I know it's quite strong but it's how I feel x

I know you are thinking of it as being a period of two years that she hasn't visited , but don't forget that a huge percentage of people haven't visited friends and family members over the last few months.

It sounds like you’ve made your mind up about this friend already from your tone of posting. Perhaps it would be best to call it a day on this friendship.

I think what you’re describing is quite different

But OP how would you know that the situation is quite different? How would you know whether she's hung out with friends with kids lots and has left feeling a bit crap? How would you know if she really wants kids but can't see it happening? How would you know if she just doesn't like the company of children?

I also think it’s a bit aggressive to push someone to see you when you have given them several opportunities

Sentences that are not aggressive - 'Hey, we've not managed to get a date in the diary for ages - fancy popping over for lunch on your day off for a catch up?'

Sentiments/thoughts that are passive aggressive - 'Well I've given her several opportunities to come up with a plan'

I think I can see both sides. You wanted support and she didn't know how to give it.
I think some new parents can be so blinkered. You see it all the time on here

'Oh we won't be having visitors for the first 2 months to bond as a family, we won't be letting anyone hold the baby for x amount of time.. or I'm just so busy with my new baby and being in the bubble of love and joy I just don't have time to text my friends back who have messaged me to ask how I am. It's just what being a new mum is about'

Then 2 years later when they want to go out theyre surprised no one wants to baby sit..

How hard is it to text someone back? I'm not saying you do this op but this has been my experience of friends with kids

Also it's so boring how much they talk about nipples and breast feeding and then when the baby gets to a toddler conversation is off the table as it's just a constant flow of interruptions. I've come to terms with the fact I just don't have anything in common with my friends with kids until they come out of that bubble.

Or even worse is when you're sat there trying to have a conversation and the person is just whinging about being exhausted and you try and be sympathetic but then you get

but you're lucky you don't have kids

I've had a lot of miscarriages and I've been told I need ivf, I was also at a lunch with a friend when she said this and I'd just been told I'd had another mmc about 3 hours previously. That was hard. But I didn't share my struggles as openly as I could have as after the 8th miscarriage people stopped caring really.

YABU

Some people are just not interested in kids. I’m not bothered about meeting friends’ kids. I find them annoying and if I meet a friend and kids are around it’s not enjoyable with all the whinging, questions and constant attention seeking. When I see my friends it’s just that! I want us to be able to have conversations without hearing “mummy mummy”.

OP look at it from this point of view. I’m really into horses, I spend a lot of time outside with my horses at home- they are a huge part of my life. I have a lot of non-horsey friends and I when they come around I don’t have outside meetingS on the yard and I don’t think they care about my newest addition to the yard. I’m not upset because they haven’t come to meet my newest family member. It’s the same with kids. You love them, but your friends are probably indifferent and have no interest in meeting you when they are around.

@LadyLaSnack The point about wanting kids but not seeing it happen is a possibility that I hadn’t considered. I remember now when her sister was getting married she didn’t want to go to her wedding because her own relationship wasn’t working out. She told her sister and her sister said she was very selfish and they fell out. I had forgotten about this until now but yes based on that I think you could be onto something.

I don’t agree with the other points that are being made here eg parents are boring to talk to - she has never met me as a parent to know if I’m boring as one. I also know that she likes children as we had a mutual friend with a child, I’ve seen her play with him and she’s also said to me how much she enjoyed him.

OP - it sounds like you do still care enough about her to open your mind to what she might be feeling, and she cares enough for you to make an attempt to re-start the friendship after a couple of transformative years. Why not give it a shot and take her up on her offer of dinner? At least then you will know either way if there is a future in it.

I gave her an open invitation with both of them. Well, that's not really an invitation, is it? It's not far from the classic "we must meet up some time" which roughly translates as "I bear you no ill-will but I'm really not interested in developing a friendship with you".

@Lonoxo

I wouldn’t bother. Having a child is an important life event just like buying a house. I would expect a close friend who lived reasonably close by to visit soon-ish after a baby is born. She might not want to be friends with your child, fair enough, but she should be interested in your life.

As an aside, I’m not an animal person but I know how important people’s cats/dogs are to them so I try to show an interest in their pets because they are my friends, not because I care about pets in general.

This. Friends care about each other's lives. If one of my closest friends had literally zero interest in me becoming a parent - one of the biggest life events a lot of people will ever experience - then I would be rethinking the friendship. Not liking kids is not an excuse to treat them like lepers, even if she finds them completely boring would it really have killed her to spend half an hour with them whilst also catching up with you, ONE time?

My friend graudated from uni with her maths degree just before covid; I have no interest in maths degrees so judging by most posters here I should have been allowed to just say 'nah' when she invited me to her graduation party since maths degrees have nothing to do with me? I of course didn't, because she's my friend and I care about her and want to share in her happiness.

My friend graudated from uni with her maths degree just before covid

Did your friend's maths degree rewire their brain to make it almost entirely impossible for them to hold a cohesive conversation with them when they are in the company of their maths degree? Did anyone not show up to her graduation party because they long for a maths degree but biology won't let them, or because they mourn for the maths degree they never had?

Maths degrees and children are not the same type of life changing event. One causes ripples into far away pockets of feelings that people don't even realise they have.