IKIANBU, but how to get needle refusing DD to have her Jab?

[Plonque]

My DD is in Yr 8 of secondary school.

She has mentioned a few times about the HPV jab coming up at school and how she wasn't going to get it because she thinks it will hurt.
I've not entertained this at all and have said it's a tiny sting for a moment and it could save your life - you're going to have it.

Anyway, the permission letter has come today and needs to be returned immediately.
DD has point blank said she is not having it and I don't know what to do.
I don't want to set off any life long needle phobias or such, so I'm just trying to see the most successful way forward.
I don't really have any phobias so I've no idea how to handle it.

She had all of her baby jabs but has not needed any sort of injection since so this is new to her, I get that she doesn't know what to expect so refusing seems the best option.
I had said to her if she kicks up a fuss at school I will take her for it at the doctors (I actually don't know if this is possible?!)

Can you suggest any strategies?

As she is eligible for it she will still be eligible in a few years time on the NHS. But you have a much bigger problem because in year 9 she will be offered 3 more jabs - a second one of these plus things like tetanus top up etc. Put ELMEA local ansthetic cream on her available at chemists - although speak to the jab nurse first as it might not be OK.

If you don't give permission, she certainly won't have it. The people doing this will be used to needle phobic teenagers and most likely have strategies for dealing with them. When she sees everyone else going ahead with it she'll probably fall in line.

My DD had her HPV at a catch up clinic run by the school nurses at the local hospital. Lots of children miss jabs at school because they were off / are ill etc. She is severely needlephobic. I spoke with the team beforehand and they called her in first, chatted with her, let her cry / scream / hyperventilate until she had got it out of her system and then did it. The second time she was a bit better.. They generally have a lot of experience with this. Call and speak to them.

I don't think scaremongering is going to persuade her to do anything. It certainly wouldn't get you anywhere if you tried that with me.

Speak to the GP or a nice practice nurse and see if you can book a longer appointment so she can do it calmly and in a controlled way. Making this traumatic will only backfire later down the line, especially if this is an actual phobia rather than just a dislike.

A combination of being calm and reasoned and not making her feel like she's being a baby or pathetic is probably the way forward with maybe a little treat afterwards?

You can also buy numbing cream over the counter if it's pain she's worried about. If it's the sensory part tell her she can always wear headphones and watch something on her phone so she doesn't have to interact with what's happening. The GP may also be able to prescribe something mild to calm her down of she's seriously stressed about it.

Defiantly recommend the numbing creams. I’ve had a fear of needles for as long as I can remember and this works for me (too fast approaching 50!) you don’t feel a thing

Not defiantly, definitely 🤦‍♀️

@crumbleandcake but this isn't a small child, it is a teenager/pre-teen who is mentally competent. It is very important that teenagers are able to give consent/refuse consent for medical treatments for safeguarding reasons.

I don't think scaremongering is going to persuade her to do anything.

It's not "scaremongering" to give her the full information.

HCP:

Numbing cream won't be that effective as it is an IM injection and it only works on the skin.... but psychologically it can do wonders.

You can't do a vaccine with a butterfly either really.

I'd ham up the fact that getting her ears pierced was probably much more painful, and that getting ill involves more needles than one immunisations.

I suspect school nurses will have various techniques to work round reluctant participants.

Teenage girls are terrible at winding each other up into mass hysteria so if there is any way of getting it done away from her friends I would do so - unless she has a couple of extremely sensible friends who will keep her calm.

I don’t think a girl who has piercings and wants more can really be described as truly needle phobic. More of a panicker. Keep the calm and practical approach going. We all, especially women, have many somewhat unpleasant things to deal with and we can’t opt out of them. A sign of maturity is to face them and deal with them. And obviously if she shows a mature approach you might treat her as such in other areas of life (bribery).

I'm terrified of this, my DD is needle phobic, had to be restrained by 3 of us last time she had to have bloods taken. Already had tears about the HPV and its ages away. I plan to use a combination of scaring the shit out of her over cervical cancer - videos of treatments, what chemo is like, how many many many more injections she would need then, stories of people whove died young etc. And bribery - maybe a girly weekend away just me and her once she goes through with it. I'm also hoping to do a course of hypnotherapy beforehand to try and change her thinking around needles.

Doesnt help that her dad has turned into a crazy anti-vax lunatic - she doesn't believe any of his crap but can see her latching onto it as an excuse not to have to have the needle (he's made all kinds of threats if I let her have the HPV or MMR booster). Its really hard at this age when technically its their decision but we need them to make the right one!

I don't think scare tactics are the right way to go with a phobia. It seems counter intuitive. I have just come back from getting bloods taken from a reluctant 8 yr old so maybe my context is completely different.

Remove all her earrings and point t out that the holes are "closing well" every day.
Also maybe show her some injection picture so she knows it's not a javelin!

someone who voluntarily has piercings is not needle phobic. Teenage drama queen situation. They all blubber at each other and because of the 'influencer' culture they set each other off, rather than the correct reaction which would be for the others to say 'stop blubbering'.

it will hurt a little bit for a few seconds. Non-issue.

They won’t do it without her consent. My DD forgot to give me form for second jab and she consented herself and had it at school. Is it the actual jab she doesn’t want or fear of injection at school. If latter just book her in to have at surgery. DD describes girls crying and fainting so I think there was silliness which wouldn’t help a nervous girl. Are her friends having it? Only one girl didn’t at DD’s school her parents are apparently anti vaxxers (child was previously homeschooled) and was definitely seen as even more weird and odd one out for not having it.

I had this with dd, she is needle phobic and in the end I gave her the option, explained the risks and let her decide.

She didn't want it, tbh with the hpv vaccine I was a little bit on the fence about risks vs benefits but would have supported dd if she'd wanted it.

I hadn't realised that in year 10 they need two more vaccines! This time I strongly encouraged dd to have them, I think they were meningitis and tetanus. She did eventually let the nurse give them but it was a really stressful ordeal.

I think i would consent for your dd to have the injection op but if on the day your dd point blank refuses there's not much you can do.

As already said numbing cream won’t work but by the time she finds this out it’ll be over and done with anyway. My DD was the same - endless ear and nose piercings so in no way needle phobic but terrified of how much the vaccine would hurt. A short discussion about how much treatment for cervical cancer would hurt soon shut down that argument.

Severe needle phobia here, absolutely nothing to do with pain, I’m afraid of the actual object. The same way as people who are scared of spiders aren’t afraid of getting bitten and it hurting. I am petrified beyond being able to ration with.

For my BCG in school I refused and they called my mother who physically restrained me (sat on me while I lay down) and I was hysterical. In the heads office on my own away from everyone.

Every time I’ve tried to get one as an adult (I desperately need dental work) they’ve refused to do it while I’m in so much distress. It’s awful for them to see how terrified I am. I try to explain every time, but that many people claim to be scared of needles they don’t realise how bad a true phobia can be.

For context I have a lot of piercings and tattoos, the needles are nothing alike and can’t be compared. Because it’s nothing to do with the pain.

Hopefully they can convince your DD to get it done, I’ve got my fingers crossed for you!

Talk to her about cervical cancer. My parents allowed me to and didn't kick up any sort of a fuss so I didn't even really understand what I was refusing! I wish I had got it done!

A lot of people here saying someone with ear piercings can’t be needle phobic Most needle phobias are specifically of hypodermic/surgical needles in that specific context and mainly revolve around the liquid being put into your system.

For piercings a piece of metal goes in and straight out the other side, and a completely different type of needle is used for the procedure. We wouldn’t be scared of a sewing needle, or drawing pin etc.

The best comparison I have is someone who has an extreme phobia of peas, but isn’t bothered about beans. Only peas. Hope that helps a bit

I wish they needed my consent when we had the BCG jab.

I was pinned down by 3 adults to get me injected. Fuckers stopped doing it in schools the year after.

I'm terrified of needles now and get extremely panicked by a blood test even though I know it's barely a scratch.

i have a needle phobia, in particular of the idea that the needle might break inside my arm & I'd be left with a bit of metal in my arm.

So every time a helpful person says 'its a really thin needle', 'it is really tiny', that just makes things WORSE.

distraction is the only thing that lets me get through procedures with needles.

Off-topic slightly, but I'd hazard that smear rates re falling because its a complete nightmare to try to get an appointment that actually makes it possible to have it done.

Good uptake for health services is going to need a change in thinking that Mon-Fri 10-4 offers suitable appointments, particularly for something that can only really be done one week out of four. and that a system where you have to ring multiple times to get through to even try to make said appointment is adequate.

I've been trying to have my latest smear done for 2 years.

Can't make an appointment more than 4 weeks in advance, so only possible for the current cycle - no planning ahead. They're only available on one day of the week and in working hours, so need time off work, but I need at least a month's notice to book time off at work.... and that's before you add in that I don't have 'extra' days to book due to school holiday cover but I can't take my DD with me.

I'm not avoiding it; I want it done, I've been religious about it for as long as I've needed them, I was part of the trial that proved the HPV link as a student (back when call up started at 21). 2 years, no success.

I'd kill to have had the jab, because at least I'd be less at risk then, but I'm too old.

From what I heard from DD, the girls definitely wound themselves into a state and I felt sorry for the nurse having to cope with them!

They definitely won't do the jab though if she doesn't consent. My son had his this term and I had a flurry of messages asking why I hadn't told him about the enormous needle.......... then that he hadn't consented so hadn't had it. After I explained that he didn't have to consent but equally I didn't have to do anything for him/buy presents, he managed to go back and get it done. That was stroppiness rather than a phobia though so probably isn't all that helpful!

I do think we pander to people far too much now. "I'm too needle phobic to have an inoculation but have tattoos covering my face, I want a job but people discriminate against you when you have tattoos!"
Ok so I'm exaggerating but I think we need a bit less understanding and a little more "stop whinging and get on with it"! If you want to be a wallflower it should be to your loss and detriment not others who endure and achieve.