What is your honest opinion of Eastern Europeans?

[tellmehowitis]

Name changed for this.
I've been in England for nearly a decade and have tried to integrate but so far the friends I have are other Eastern Europeans such as Polish, Latvian, Romanian etc. and also a few Spanish, Portuguese, Italian.

My experiences of English people (women especially) have been as follows:
-seeming friendly and saying things like "we should go for coffee/drinks" but not actually meaning it.
-most locals already have a social circle and don't seem to want to add to it (or don't want to add me specifically).
-if friendships do develop people will at some point suddenly decide they don't like me anymore for no reason (well there obviously is a reason but they don't say what it is).
-people blank me or act condescending. A woman on a course I was on actually turned away and looked at the ceiling when I said "hi, how are you", even though the previous day we'd had a perfectly pleasant chat. I couldn't think of what I could've said to offend, it was all general small talk like where we're from and what uni we went to etc. This has happened a few times with different people.

Maybe I'm just not likeable...but then there are no problems with people of other nationalities. I think I'm "normal" and not some weirdo, I speak English, have a job and am not here to "sponge" or any of the other stereotypes.

It didn't used to bother me too much but now I'm considering my long term future...even though materially speaking I have a nice life here I'm thinking of moving back home to settle down, because feeling like an outsider takes its toll emotionally.

I'm just curious though, what is it about me that locals don't like...is it my personality specifically that doesn't fit here, or is it because of my nationality? (It was the same before Brexit, so can't blame that).
If you're EE do you have English friends? And if you're English, would you be friends with an EE person? What do you honestly think of us as a whole?

You sound nice OP and I would be your friend if I knew you. There are a lot of social cues to navigate and I have Autism so have to approach it as an outsider like you have to. If someone says "We should go for coffee." I think they mean it.

I like Polish cuisine from what I've had. I used to devour Polish sausages (oi oi) before I went vegan and I hear good things about Polish alcohol.

Eastern Europe is a big old place. And I think moving anywhere that has a local population of Mums who have known each other since childhood can be hard to break into.

My own experience:
I was brought up in a village which had had Polish airmen stationed in it during WW2. There was huge pride in the connection with Poland. The local WI made a quilt to commemorate it and we occasionally had visitors from Polish relatives of those airmen.

It was also an agricultural area that relied heavily on a seasonal workforce. Long before the expansion of the EU local farms used to recruit from a variety of Eastern European countries for this purpose. They lived on the farms they worked on and relied on hitchhiking to get into town, so we often stopped to give these young men and women a lift. This was in the 80s and 90s.

As an adult I don't come across huge numbers of people from Eastern Europe, but I have known a few women who have married British men. One has fitted in really well. The other I made a huge effort with because she seemed very unhappy. I think she had made a few faux pas before I knew her. Firstly, she was very critical about the country and British women all the time. Secondly, she tended to launch herself into intense friendships too quickly - leaning on people overly for childcare and giving presents all the time. These habits tended to cause a mix of irritation and embarrassment. She is a nice person, but she got stuck in a rut. Unfortunately although she wanted advice, she didn't want to hear what it was so I couldn't help her. I have limited free time and I have to admit that when I meet up with a friend I don't want to leave feeling emotional exhausted. Our kids are at different schools now and we live about half an hour apart so I have lost touch with her.

Hardworking, friendly and outspoken to the point of rudeness.

I was once informed by a Polish lady I'd barely met if I ate less fish and chips I wouldn't be so fat. 😂😂😂 Complete with inch pinching

I was very offended since most my fatness comes from my love of a good cheese. I'm quite thick skinned (( literally it seems )) so laughed it off but if I'd been a bit easier to offend it would have gone down differently.

As for the making plans things, it's just what us Brits do. I wouldn't be offended by that.

They are people. I treat people the way they deserve to be treated. If you're an asshole, you'll be treated like one. If you're a nice person, I'll be nice to you.

You get nice people and assholes in every country. I don't give a shit where you're from.

Tenant in my flat is Eastern European. Lovely guy. I've been out to dinner with him. My best students are Eastern European. My schools head girl is EE.

We English aren't very accepting of difference imo. I like to think I'm more open because I've lived/worked overseas, but in reality, I'm an introvert that doesn't socialise a lot. So could come across as unwelcoming.

I definitely agree with pp who say this isn’t just the case in the UK, a friend of mine now lives in Denmark and is married to a Dane. She completely assimilate into Danish culture, speaks Danish fluently and pretty much regards herself as Danish after 20 years with only a nod to her UK roots and still most of her friends are all from the international community, which is large and active but ever changing as people come and go. She has two Danish friends which she found through dogged determination, really throwing herself into the Danish way of life and also throwing herself into the ice cold sea by taking up winter bathing which is where she met her Danish friends.

Some of the loveliest people I know are Polish and Latvian, I have to say some of the men I think look a bit scary but they have also been lovely too

I have Eastern European friends, a Polish friend I'm particularly close to. She's brilliant. But she is very confident and opiniated (when lots of English people try not to say things that might offend others) so I think she can rub people up the wrong way. I have a mixed group of friends but that was in London.

@Dopplerscale

I definitely agree with pp who say this isn’t just the case in the UK, a friend of mine now lives in Denmark and is married to a Dane. She completely assimilate into Danish culture, speaks Danish fluently and pretty much regards herself as Danish after 20 years with only a nod to her UK roots and still most of her friends are all from the international community, which is large and active but ever changing as people come and go. She has two Danish friends which she found through dogged determination, really throwing herself into the Danish way of life and also throwing herself into the ice cold sea by taking up winter bathing which is where she met her Danish friends.

I know who that is! I watch her YouTube videos when I’m homesick. 😊🇩🇰

Also as an adult I also find it much harder to make friends these days, especially with the 'let's meet up'. Everyone is busy and secretly lazy and would rather scroll on their phones every other hour instead of buck up the courage to make plans.

Have you arranged to have coffee? It might be a welcome relief for them if you make the first move. :)

What part of the country are you in?

My best friend is Estonian (I'm British). We met in Estonia, she subsequently lived in the UK for 15 years.

I found her BRILLIANT at being organised enough to actually sort out coffee when she suggested it - this is really rare with British people I find. I figured this was more about her being new to the country than being European. She mostly made friends with other Europeans who hadn't grown up in the UK.

Hello, I’m Scandi. It took me ages to figure out that when people said “I’ll call you” or “see you soon” that’s not necessarily what they meant. So when I first came over and someone said “I’ll call you” I’d be like “great what time?”. Where I’m from that’s what you do to make sure you are available for the call. A lot of people here must have thought I was pretty desperate! Likewise if someone in the playground says “we should do a coffee” I need to stop myself from saying “yes, I’m free on Thursday 21st at 9.15”

No problem with them as a general group. Some of the young men I used to see on the tube when I was in London seemed rough, but no more so than the English 'chavs'. The women I have met have been seemed nice. They will be a mixture like all racial groups.

@Baycob

"Being critical of UK culture - when I lived there people would often tell me how shit our bread was, how supermarkets were filled with ready meals, that girls were fat here, weather was terrible, we can’t behave when we drink etc. I found it very offensive! I could have said a lot about Poland having lived there for almost a decade, but I didn’t as I knew it was rude."

Well said. Too bloody right. Respect your host!

Lots of food for thought...good to hear the perspective from "the other side" on a forum, as no one in real life would tell you these things face to face. Too many posts to quote individually but I'll address some of the common points:

-I live in a medium sized northern city, its multi cultural so people would be used to foreigners.

-I don't have a strong accent, people say I sound a bit American with just a hint of EE.

• I've done various group activities/clubs over the years and people there are nice enough on a surface level, but we've never moved past acquaintance level.

-Yes, I've worked out that the "let's meet up" is just a pleasantry...but then how do you actually meet up with people, if no one means it? I've tried to initiate by suggesting a date and place, or inviting people round. I always get the brush-off: either a vague excuse for why they can't, or they say yes initially and then cancel. I have a limit of asking twice, if rejected both times I don't bother anymore.

-The bluntness/directness thing is true. In most EE cultures saying something you don't mean is seen as dishonest/two faced and not a desirable trait. We also have a much higher threshold for what we find offensive. I do try my best to reign in any blunt tendencies as I know it's not looked on favourably here but no doubt I've offended people over the years without meaning to. Can someone give an example of something an EE person has said that has been considered blunt?
In my country if you've offended someone they'll just tell you, you'd then apologise and it's forgotten about. Whereas here people just never speak to you again and you've no idea why.

-Now that I think about it, I probably don't smile much unless there's something to smile about. It just doesn't come naturally and we're not a smiley culture, so I will make an effort to do it more.

-My dress sense is fairly ordinary...things like jeans and casual tops from Newlook with ballet pumps or Converse.

I'm British and have the same problems!! I find Europeans easier to make friends and have a clear conversation with! I spent a few years working in hotels and Eastern European staff were always my favourite colleagues to work with..upbeat, fun, helpful, honest and good team workers.

I don't think you can generalise aboout Eastrn Europeans as that surely covers a massive swathe of Europe and milions of people. I'm sure there are good and bad amongst them, like with any country/continent.

I peronsally know 2 Hungarians and 2 Polish people and would count them as being in my social circle as they have kids in the same class as mine. I am English but have lived in Europe and I personally don't give a crap where anyone is from, just how "nice", for want of a better word, a person they are or oren't and how much I enjoy interacting with them, or not.

All of the absolute twats that I can think of that I have hated over the years have all been English males I think.

@Baycob. A lot of these things she said though are true.

In Dundee, a few years ago there were lots of Polish people, and you could usually see at a glance of a woman was EE as they tend to be slimmer than most local women (I include myself in that). DHs friend had a polish girlfriend who I really liked, when I mentioned that I would feel really fat in Polish nightclubs as everyone else is so slim, she told me that fat women don’t go to nightclubs in Poland

Whereas here people just never speak to you again and you've no idea why

This is very true though and is a really stupid English trait that I have been guilty of myself - our problem not yours I'd say.

@Pyewhacket

My mother is French and I spent a lot of my childhood in France where I was subjected to abuse and hostility because I spoke with an English accent - one of the reason I left home at 18 was so I didn't have to go back there. I then worked abroad in a number of countries and faced blatant racism, especially in Austalia. Interestingly the only place I found a warm welcome and made real friends was in the US : black, white and Latino. So if you somehow feel excluded or marginalised I understand how you feel. I don't think the British are naturally rude or nasty ( unlike others I've known) but I guess we can be a tad insular. I work in the NHS with people from all around the world and get on with everybody but we don't have many EE where I am, mainly Hungarian and Russian SpR's. In fact we don't have many Europeans full stop. We did at one point but they all left, most of them were tempted by the pay and conditions offered in the US. Very few went home.

I speak good but definitely subfluent French, and never suffered any abuse whatsoever when I lived in Paris.

Also, reassuring to know it's not just me. I guess I'm just feeling a bit down. Lots of my international friends have moved after Brexit so I've been feeling a bit lonely.
I end up thinking about how my old life back home was. Lots of old-time friends, and I quickly made friends with new people too..talked to the neighbours every day from our balconies, and we had coffee and toast in front of our apartment block. Colleagues became friends and would go on weekends away together. I never even knew what loneliness felt like.
Now I feel like if I died no one would even find me for days (ok maybe a bit melodramatic but you know what I mean).

Dont you think us Brits are actually rather lovely? This thread demonstrates we are quick to say its us not you, we are such an odd unfriendly bunch People are falling over themselves to say how lovely EE are, seriously would all nationalities do this I doubt it. We aren't odd and unfriendly we are just who we are, as with all people good and bad.

@OP just seen your update. I moved back to my home country for a while, and guess what: I didn't fit in there either. People blanked me, people cancelled on me, people insincerely suggested meeting up... I have come to the conclusion that internationals may not fit in anywhere. I would really caution you against moving back to the EE just for this because it may not be how you remember it.

@Mammylamb

Whether it’s true or not.... it’s offensive to say so.

Oh yes I do think British people are generally nice. I just think maybe I don't fit in culturally despite living here for many years.