To think that we shouldn’t be coming out of lockdown for Christmas?

[LockdownForChristmas]

Yesterday we had the highest total of cases yet since the beginning of the pandemic. And the death rate is going up day on day. They’re attributing it not to mass testing but to the fact that when lockdown was announced people rushed to see each other and hence the virus spread more.

If we open up on the 2nd of December people will just rush out to the pubs and the shops and each other’s houses and we’ll be back here in the new year.

It would be far better to stay in lockdown until the new year and then hopefully start the year on a reducing case rate.

And yes, I know it’s Christmas, but tonight is Diwali, and nobody is suggesting we should come out of lockdown so people can celebrate that, so why should we just because it’s Christmas?

Serin . I also have student DC. Enjoy your family time, and I hope you have all recovered/are recovering well

"Spending Xmas without my Nan is shit but her surviving this is more important than Christmas."

But there are many Nans, and grandads, (around 500,000 of them) out there for whom this will be the last Christmas, regardless of Covid, and they may not want to spend their last Christmas all alone in order to possibly live a few months longer, maybe in isolation. Many can't manage/hear/see virtual communication.

I do think we are still a predominantly Christian country and whether or not you align with a particular religion, most people and families celebrate Cristian celebration (Easter, Christmas,shrove Tuesday even) in some form. Our national holidays are based on Christian holidays and so to say people are not practising because they don’t do it in a way you believe Christians should is a bit dismissive of them. I do think that lockdown for Eid and Diwali and other religious festivals is harsh (especially as recent ones we knew were coming) and perhaps something should have been put in place to allow families to celebrate together as safely as possible. The human cost is significant and a bit of compassion I think is important when considering the breaking of guidelines/rules. And equally I agree that rules are in place for a reason and we need people to adhere to them... it’s such a difficult position and I feel very conflicted about it. Sorry OP if your celebrations have been affected and to everyone who is struggling

Pubs and restaurants should stay closed.

@MercyBooth

'Lockdown' because it's really not is it

Tell our hairdressers that.

And our pubs, restaurants, cinemas, gyms, soft play, zoos, clothes shops.....need I go on? It clearly is a form of lockdown and it is insulting to these businesses which may not survive to suggest otherwise

@AllTheUserNamesAreTaken You are bang on the money there.

It will be a disaster for shops if they are closed in the pre-Christmas season. People will buy gifts but Amazon will be getting their money.

I fully expect that by Spring there will be huge numbers of shops, pubs, and other businesses that have closed permanently, even as it stands now.

@Silverstripe depending where you look only between about 4 to 8% of people are "practicing Christians" . 59% in the UK identify as Christian but out of them less than half even say they believe in God let allow practice. It's the default religion.

@amicissimma

Totally agree with this FIL has stage 4 cancer, he is catholic and Christmas is important to him. We will have him for Christmas regardless of what Boris says because that is what he wants to do.

We are obsessed with people living forever in this country, life is precious and should be enjoyed.

(Before I am labelled a granny killer, we follow all other rules)

I believe lockdown will end on the 2nd quite rightly to allow independent businesses to trade. The collapse of the economy will kill far more people than a disease where the average age of death is 81.

@SpillingTheTea - why ?

As well as hairdressers, and other beauticians etc, and our pubs, restaurants, cinemas, gyms, soft play, zoos, clothes shops, there's also spas, swimming pools, museums, theatres, foreign travel and all the 'events' industry, which includes weddings, conferences, trade shows and concerts.

And that's still probably not a complete list. It's only 'carrying on as normal' if you never do anything except food shopping, office work, walk in the park or stay at home.

I think it’ll be lifted, only time will tell. Imagine back into lockdown after Christmas? Has BJ said no more lockdowns? My mum seems to think he has

The thing is though Covid is going nowhere. We can't stay in lockdown forever. That's not me being a selfish heartless bitch. That's just life.

@Sillysop92

As it was a law passed, I’m sure that in order to extend it MPs have to vote on it. I can’t see MPs agreeing to an extension especially in struggling areas.

Yes it ends and they would have to vote on it

It’s a very difficult time. If lifted people will go a bit nuts as Christmas excitement looms. If not businesses will miss much.

But overall the MPs will be reluctant (most Cons anyway) but listen to the figures and decide.

It’s very hard to completely trash businesses, forcing many to collapse/close and thousands of job losses, whilst refusing to close the schools/colleges and unis which statistically caused the largest outbreaks of covid.

We live in city, when uni/schools came back the numbers In our city more than tripled and figures for each ward showed that the university area had
5x higher cases than anywhere else in the city. The numbers were damning and could not be argued with.

I’d rather they’d closed at least the Uni’s than local coffee shops

@FreshFreesias

More people are dying from suicides in London than corona. There is going to be a huge mental health backlash as well as deaths caused by illnesses not diagnosed due to the obsession with a virus that is barely killing anybody. I’m guessing that all the pro lockdown fanatics are in the public sector and their lives are not affected.

Like a previous poster I would like to see the statistics verifying this claim. What is the number of excess suicides for this period (i.e. compared to an average over the previous five years)? And what would be the number of COVID deaths without a lockdown? That is the meaningful comparison.

Shops and other similar businesses need the chance to open before Xmas. Forcing thousands of people to lose their businesses and/or have no income in the run up to Christmas is as bad as exposing people to Covid risks in my opinion.

As for death rates in January, well if we go full tilt with lockdown and collapse a huge swathe of the economy, that will kill more people in the medium to longterm than any January spike. Unemployment and impoverishment has a direct impact on people's longevity in all sorts of ways. There's a reason why life expectancy varies substantially between rich and poor areas and why experts talk about 'shit life syndrome' and 'deaths of despair'. And a trashed economy and mass unemployment means less money for literally everything which supports vulnerable people, from social care to child protection to the charitable sector. Zeroing in on tomorrow's Covid death rates is blinding us to every other kind of pain

I have no idea of current suicide rates, but it doesn’t take a genius to see what the impact of an isolated Christmas with thousands of businesses failing will have on them.

@Silverstripe

why should we just because it’s Christmas?

I feel genuinely very sorry for people not having the Diwali celebrations they usually would but it is worth bearing in mind that Hindus account for less than 1.5% of the population in the U.K., whereas practicing Christians account for 59% - and of course, Christmas is celebrated by many non-practicing Christians, atheists, and members of other faiths as well. I doubt there would be the same expectation of Christmas going ahead as usual if it was a festival that only 1.5% of people participated in, even though it is important to recognise and empathise with people who’s religious and cultural celebrations have been tanked this year.

59% of the UK is a practising Christian? Where did you get that from?

@TheKeatingFive

I have no idea of current suicide rates, but it doesn’t take a genius to see what the impact of an isolated Christmas with thousands of businesses failing will have on them.

No, it doesn’t, but the claim that is being made by some on here is that these numbers will be higher than if we carry on as normal and allow the virus to spread.

Pubs and restaurants should stay closed.

Why though, ruin businesses and jobs, when most of transmission wasn't in them, when they reopened at beginning of July their wasn't massive rises.

It'll be lifted I hope! The economy does need the Christmas spend or many other businesses will fold. In all honesty it doesn't really matter what they tell me about not seeing my family after the day lockdown should end, I will be seeing them regardless on Christmas Day.

@KitKatastrophe

Death rates in January are going to be horrific & unfortunately it will be largely innocent people. It will be ENTIRELY innocent people. People who choose to celebrate christmas with their families are not "guilty".

This