Taking DD out. Please help.

[SpookyTheGhoulfriendScarer]

I'm posting for traffic.
I'm sorry, I know this is hated, but I please please need advice.
Although you ladies are total sharks, you know your parenting stuff and I trust you to be able to offer me advice.

(Context, kids sleeping, I'm crying on th toilet knowing they will wake soon.)
We can't leave the house with DD been like this since lockdown. Cant leave with her af all. She loses control for no reason.
What can I do? I'd it just s cae of she outgrows it in 7mo!

Sorry you're having such a shit time. It'll pass.

How old is she?

How old is she? Can she communicate? What happens when you leave the house?

how old is she?

I don’t have the answers but sending love

Sorry OP, I don’t get what you’re saying? Typing is hard when you’re crying

How old is she? What exactly happens? Did this start with coronavrius? Are her parents very health anxious, is there another source where she could have picked this up?

Have a hug @SpookyTheGhoulfriendScarer - most things pass. What's brought you to the end of your role tonight?
Can you tell us a bit more? There are loads of wise vipers here who can help, but we need to know what's happening...
How old is DD? Does she have SN or need to shield? Are you alone with no outside or family support? Are you rural, in a town or big city?

Role? Rope! Bloody autocorrect!

Hi thanks for your replies. Sorry, I wrote this after another failed attempt at getting the DC out for a bit. I really don't know what to do or if this is normal or not?

DD is 2 and has been referred to paediatrician for ASD assessment. Sorry I should have said that in my first post! She can be fine then just suddenly lose control (there probably is a reason but I have no idea why). Throughout lockdown we tried many times taking her for a walk, both in and out her buggie. Each time shortly after the garden gate she would lose control, thrashing and screaming.

She is the same if we take her to the shops, taking her anywhere really. We took her to a local animal attraction last week and had to leave after 5 minutes. We have a 1yo DD also who is picking up on these behaviours.

I dont know how much is DD's (possible) autism and how much is normal 2yo behaviour. And I dont know if it's me doing something wrong and if there are things I can do to make going out easier for her, and us. She loves animals, we would love to take her to the zoo but not sure if it's possible?!

She has seen the paediatrician. I was told after the face to face appointment that an ASD diagnosis is likely. We also have an appointment with a private nursery next week.

I'm surprised they sent her for an ASD assessment so young it usually doesn't happen until age 6 or so IME.

2 really is the worst age. How's her speech? Would she be able to tell you what she wants to do for a day out?

Gosh, that sounds hard. If you have a partner, do take turns getting out yourselves for a break. Fresh air, a walk, a coffee outside. You're missing out on that and you need it. Make it a priority to take your younger DC out alone while the other parent stays home with older DC. I hope you get help in overcoming this soon.

GlummyMcGlummerson

I'm surprised they sent her for an ASD assessment so young it usually doesn't happen until age 6 or so IME.

This isn't always the case. I have an adult DS with ASD. The HV was aware of this and noticed DD wasnt hitting her milestones at 8mo. She regularly visited (phoned during lockdown) to keep tabs on how DD was progressing. At 18mo she referred her to SLT (speech was fine but had to be ruled out) and also to the paediatrician for assessment. By then DD was displaying lots of ASD traits as well as not meeting her milestones.

SLT discharged her as I expected. DD knows loads of words, however she doesnt always use them to communicate. She often stands near what she wants and wails. Again, I dont know if this is normal 2yo behaviour??

DianaT1969 Yeh we do take turns to have a break. Her behaviour in the house can be extremely challenging. DP is brilliant with her and very understanding how hard my day can be when he is at work and will often send me to my bed (heaven!!) for a break or tell me to out for the day when he is home. DD is his first experience with SN and he finds it tough, often worried he's doing something wrong or overlooking things that could help and ends up tying himself in knots over it.

OP, that sounds so tough for you.

Do you have any maintained (council run), nurseries near you? The benefit of a maintained nursery is they employ a qualified SENDCO and staff may have additional training for SEND children or children on the diagnosis pathway. They should be able to support you with transitions to help you support your DD, and help you access other services that you need.

I work in a nursery with a unit for preschoolers on the ASD diagnosis pathway. Visual timetables and now and next boards can really help children understand and prepare themselves for transitions.

Have you tried addressing any potential sensory issues op? She might have an issue with noises outside, or brightness, or the feel of the wind on her face etc etc.

I’m a nursery SENCO and work with lots of parents who feel like you, so don’t feel alone in this. Toddlers are challenging enough without any additional needs, and when they have both it can be extremely challenging. It sounds as though your HV has been proactive and helpful, have you spoken to her about the issues with taking DD out? It is a common issue amongst the parents I support, and everyone has different approaches. Some carry on regardless and see if the meltdown passes, others have decided it’s too stressful and distressing so have effectively decided to remain housebound (or the child is, with one parents or family member staying with them while the others go out). You have to decide how you feel and which option suits you best at this point in time, but I would say you need to speak with your HV for support and advice. Do you receive DLA? If so you can get nursery funding, which could be helpful to you.

If you could somehow get her strapped into a pushchair, could you drape something down from the hood to darken the space within ( without suffocating her!) so she may feel a bit secure/hidden?

How lond will she scream/thrash once you get out if you continue to walk? Will she calm down eventually?

Life is going to be hard if you cannot get out of the house at all

No advice but I have a child with ASD. I've been there, done that and I understand.

Agree with doctor hamster- might be worth experimenting with different hats, ear defenders, sunglasses, shoes, the lot. DD (ASD and LD) didn't leave the house without a woolly hat for years. Wind (any slight breeze) made her cry.

As part of training at work we took part in an immersive autism awareness programme and following that it really doesn't surprise me that children with ASD who experience sensory overload have meltdowns as it was disorientation and horrible.

You don't know yet if she has ASD but are obviously experienced and there are lots of resources and things to use to help children cope that weren't available when your adult child was younger.

What about being in the buggy do you think stresses your Dd out? Would she be better off with ear defenders and /or sunglasses to reduce the sensory input if she won't wear sunglasses perhaps a sunshade/insect net that you can get for some buggies as that will make it darker. Could you get a parent facing pushchair (we used to have a Quinny zapp and Dd fitted into it until she was at nursery and was very tall) so she can see you as perhaps it is the constantly changing scenery once you get past the front gate that upsets her and that way she can look at the familiar adult pushing her. Perhaps a weighted lap blanket or a faux fur one that she can stroke to keep calm.

On the other hand Dd is NT and HATED the pushchair at one stage and I didn't drive so it was essential if we wanted to go anywhere and she used to brace herself as stiff as a board and scream and cry when I tried to put her init.

dannydyerismydad

There's a charity run nursery who ran days specifically for DC with or awaiting diagnosis. I was taking her regularly until it shut down during lockdown. It's a nursery where parents must stay with their DC therefore due to Gov guidelines they haven't been able to reopen yet. DD's paediatrician also warned against that setting in favour of a nursery with NT DC so DD could learn their behaviours instead. That's why we have an appointment coming up for a private nursery. It's an expense we will struggle with but worth it if it helps DD.

My dd was diagnosed at 2 with asd. The getting them out wasn't easy (I had a newborn at the time we went through diagnosis). First tip is everything is ready before you start to put them in the pushchair (I presume a double) secondly have distractions eg a book fastened on or toy, I had a cup on a cord thing (she would through everything on the floor) then it's a case of just go and fast, after 3-4 mins she would begin to protest less (if you made eye contact she would start screaming again so I had to ignore her, forward facing buggy). It did get better around 3.5 or so once she had been in an autism specialist preschool for a while.

I have a few autistic friends, so am happy to refer behavioral questions if you wish, OP. One friend has just received a diagnosis for her younger child (she, her husband and other child are also autistic).
Shops can be very upsetting; fluorescent lights, signage everywhere, loud music, proximity to strangers, unfamiliar smells..

Has this started since she became more aware of her surroundings? If professionals are suggesting ASD already then it's very very likely. I'm Not a medical person but an autistic one here are my thoughts.

The triggers are likely to be changes/the unknown but most likely sensory differences. Both can be very severe. My suggestion would be to have a daily routine. It doesn't have to be exactly the same but try and keep key events at the same time each day. Getting up, meals, bedtime are the main ones.

It won't go that way every day, especially at first but just try and keep as close as you can. Routine can be a huge comfort for autistic people and it's something that doesn't negatively impact anyone else. It helps us know what to expect.

As part of that routine, introduce outside time but go slowly. Going outside is a huge sensory change. The sounds, smells, sights are all different and these things all feel stronger and can overwhelm us. I still hate going outside. It's loud and unpredictable. Even now I can't cope too long in stores etc as the lights bother me and I hate the noise. When I get back home I can actually feel my brain relax. It's hard to describe. There are some good videos on The National Autistic society's YouTube channel that can help.

First don't set high expectations. You'll only stress yourself out. Try abandoning the buggy for now as that adds extra changes and just work on getting her outside. If you have a yard or garden go there first. Go through the coat routine and tell her you are going to see the sun. Explain where you are going and what you are doing as you are going and just go outside the door for a short time then go back in. She likely needs to learn how to cope with the sensory experience of being outside. Doing it gradually should allow you to come back more easily once the overwhelm hits. Hopefully she will lead you as she gets used to it.

The fact we've been encouraged to stay in so much the last few months means she probably hasn't had change to really figure out the experience.

I'd suggest reading up on sensory overwhelm and sensory difficulties as you are likely to find others who've gone through this. Just avoid the organisation Autism Speaks. They think autistic people are sick and need curing and their rhetoric is very damaging. It's a neurological difference. It causes issues that will be different for every autistic person but it's also a huge part of who we are as it effects how we think.

(Disclaimer: I know very, very little about asd etc) You said she kicks off when you get outside the garden gate; can you make inside the gate absolutely full of activities-physical, puzzle solving etc-then One adult can take the little one out while the other does lots and lots of activities in dd’s safe garden. Very, very gradually, expand-E.g. if she’s happy on a wheely toy going round the garden, open the gate and swoop out in a loop and straight in again and gradually let her extend any periods outside that she is ok with?

Ok, sounds like her world got smaller in lockdown (naturally) and it felt safe. She's anxious beyond your house and garden.

What I would say is: start where she is. Forget about days out to visitor attractions for now and focus on her being confident in your very local area - maybe the trip to your local shop, the local park etc.
I am not sure what end of 2 she is, but this is what I would do:

Buy her (and her little sister) a small furry toy. A beanie baby or jellycat would be ideal. Small enough to be carried in one hand.
Introduce the girls to their new "pets" or "friends". Key: your daughter's beanie needs to feel very very scared and shy and maybe be hiding in a box. But if you stroke him gently and hold him in your hand he feels braver. Can dd help him feel brave? Oh yes she can, he loves to be held and feels so safe in her pocket or hand or bag.

Dd's job is to help her new friend get braver as he just wants to hide in his box. Can she show him the sitting room? The bedroom? Etc etc. Lots of praise about how petfriend is feeling MUCH braver now she has shown him the bed etc etc.

Then gradually pet friend is happy in the house, but worried about the garden, can she show him the garden? Then, can we show him the park? Pet friend loves to go on the swings but he is too worried, shall we show him? He'll be brave in your pocket/hand etc. Then petfriend can learn about the shop. You could make him and her a short drawn shopping list : we need to find bread, milk, apples and a treat. Can they find the things on their list?

One word of caution: buy several identical petfriends! If he gets lost he has "got so brave he has gone on holiday" and comes back all clean after a lovely holiday. If it does not work you can use them as little birthday gifts or whatever in future so no risk.