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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this shows a complete lack of understanding for how people's lives work?

68 replies

CallmeMrsScavo · 19/10/2020 19:07

DH and I are going through the adoption process. During all the open days and meetings with our agency before submitting our ROI, the adoption agency mentioned there was online training to do and we would need to do some volunteering (but could be done at weekends). Now we've submitted our ROI and they've emailed through with five dates over the next month we need to take completely off work for the training sessions.
DH and I are both teachers. We can't take leave unless it's during school holidays. We're not legally entitled any leave for the adoption until we get matched with a child. How on earth do adoption agencies expect people to do this!? I understand that they need future parents to put their child first but if my child were sick (for example) our employers would obviously make an allowance - but they obviously won't make an allowance for us to just fuck off to "train" for 25% of the time we're supposed to be working!! It feels as though the adoption agency are intentionally sabotaging our careers so we have more of a focus on a child - but they seem to be forgetting about that money thing that we need to actually feed the child!
How has anyone else managed this? Surely the adoption agency should've mentioned that they're expecting us to basically not do our jobs!
I've already posted this on the adoption thread but posting here because it's the only thread on Mumsnet that anyone views/responds to. And, no, I'm not slating social workers. My dad was a social worker and I was very close to the care system growing up.

OP posts:
Porridgeoat · 19/10/2020 19:10

You can request unpaid leave for those days. Would be the same for mid week weddings

Frequentcarpetflyer · 19/10/2020 19:12

Lots of people read and respond on other threads.

TW2013 · 19/10/2020 19:15

Yes but teachers don't usually go to five weddings in one month and they might not be approved to take the time off paid or unpaid. There should be allowances made to make it easier to adopt.

kezziethecat · 19/10/2020 19:16

If you're a teacher you can't request unpaid leave for just anything. I think it varies from school to school but I wasn't granted it for my husband's phd graduation or the funeral of a close family friend.

Cocomarine · 19/10/2020 19:17

Intentionally sabotaging your careers is a bit dramatic.
You work in one of the few occupations where it’s almost impossible to get term time leave.
Not impossible - but very much at the head’s discretion.

I would expect them to be sympathetic to too having the spread the training out over a longer period because of your job, to cover multiple school holidays.

It’s harder for you, but every profession has its ups and downs with impacts elsewhere in life.

When I worked permanent nights for example, one day of training would have meant 2 days annual leave, so I didn’t miss out on sleeping! But I wouldn’t have thought there was an attempt to sabotage my career.

I hope you can sort it out easily, even if it takes more time. Good luck!

Porridgeoat · 19/10/2020 19:17

Preparation for an examination and meetings might cover it in link above

Doyouknowwhat · 19/10/2020 19:17

The training session is 5 days, how is that 25% of your time?
You will then have to take more time off for the home study.

I appreciate it's difficult as a teacher, but not many people are teachers and most can book annual leave.

Perhaps they run other courses that are 5 days in a row during a school holiday?

You can only ask.

The course is really valuable, it's not stuff you can learn on line. Siscussion and hearing other peoples ideas and experiences is invaluable.

Hercwasonaroll · 19/10/2020 19:18

Unpaid leave requests like this wouldn't be tolerated where I work (teacher) and I consider my employers pretty decent. Do you both need to be there for both? Can you speak to the agency?

Flowers for you OP

RunBackwards · 19/10/2020 19:18

I've never worked in a school that wouldn't have granted the PhD graduation, unless I suppose, the staff member had already had a lot of leave. Education is kind of what we're there to celebrate...

Merryoldgoat · 19/10/2020 19:19

At the school I work at this would be allowed as unpaid leave. Have you asked?

One of our teachers has adopted and was able to take the time needed.

Also, most people don’t work in organisations where taking leave is so difficult.

trilbydoll · 19/10/2020 19:20

Have you gone back to the agency and said this isn't possible (especially at such short notice) to see if they have an alternative?

Lots of jobs can't be just dumped at short notice, as you say sick children is what it is but if you were a dentist or a doctor with a full appointment book no-one would be very impressed at 5 days in the next month being wiped out.

RunBackwards · 19/10/2020 19:21

Mind you where I work now (SLT) we'd agree the days for adoption things too.

Perhaps instead of saying the adoption people don't understand how lives work, it's employers who need to understand more about how lives work?

NoSquirrels · 19/10/2020 19:23

Surely this is just a thing that’s sorted with a call to the agency to explain your particular circumstances (both teachers) and request a course that runs at least partly over some school holidays?

Radleyhah · 19/10/2020 19:24

I'm a teacher and adopted a few years ago. We did the 5 days training over a longer period and I think that managed to get 2 in the holidays. I paid for the rest as was in the school's policy that allowed 5 days paid leave for maternity/ adoption. I'd check all the school policies to see if you're entitled to the leave. My head started by saying no 7until I proved I could take it!

whitewineandmagnums · 19/10/2020 19:24

I'm no HR expert, but given that pregnant women are entitled to leave for antenatal appointments, surely there must be something in law about adoption appointments?!

Cocklepops · 19/10/2020 19:35

What has the headteacher said when you’ve discussed it with them?

12309845653ghydrvj · 19/10/2020 19:39

Must be super stressful for you OP Flowers not going to add any suggestions as don’t know enough about the area, but I am sure you will be able to work something out

Original poster
CallmeMrsScavo · 19/10/2020 19:40

To clarify a few questions asked:

  • We're not legally entitled to leave until we're approved (which is after the training|)
  • The training is 5 days over a month. A month is four weeks - so 20 work days. 5/20 is 25%
  • We both need to be there for all the sessions.
  • We've spoken to the adoption agency and this is how they run their training. I'm a bit annoyed they made it seem like everything could be done with our jobs and then changed their tune as soon as we signed up.
  • Whilst teachers are entitled to ask for unpaid leave during the term time, the school are entitled to say no. And they will.
OP posts:
NoSquirrels · 19/10/2020 19:41

- We've spoken to the adoption agency and this is how they run their training.

But can you book into a course at a more convenient time?

Doyouknowwhat · 19/10/2020 19:47

Do they run a course over the summer holiday? I know that seems a very.long way off, but this process takes years, so a few months delay isn't terrible really. We had to wait 2 years before they would even enrol us onto a course.

LividLaughLovely · 19/10/2020 19:57

Feel for you, OP. People don’t understand the impossibility of this sort of thing in education.

Original poster
CallmeMrsScavo · 19/10/2020 19:58

@NoSquirrels

- We've spoken to the adoption agency and this is how they run their training.

But can you book into a course at a more convenient time?

There is no "more convenient time". The only convenient time would be when I don't have a job, in which case they wouldn't allow us to adopt without any income.
OP posts:
Viviennemary · 19/10/2020 20:07

And they wonder why people are not coming forward to adopt. It's very depressing.

NoSquirrels · 19/10/2020 20:10

There is no "more convenient time". The only convenient time would be when I don't have a job, in which case they wouldn't allow us to adopt without any income

Don’t be daft. You’re teachers - you have 12 weeks off a year, 6 weeks of them in one chunk.

I get you’re annoyed, but this is not an insurmountable problem and you don’t need to give up your job to solve it.