7 yo hits and scratches self when being told off

[yesiamyesiamokaycallmeback]

every single time there is even a whiff of being told off my kid actually screams and cries, drops to the floor or bangs his head against the wall (hard), scratches his face and body, and punches/ slaps himself.

I dont know what to do. he used to bang his head on the floor as a toddler but I hoped he would grow out of it and he just hasn't. it has gotten worse.

my Dh said we should ring the gp but our go is pretty old and I cant see him doing anything. he brushed off pnd because I still have a husband (wtf) and also his cure for mastitis was see how it goes or give up bf so... I cant see him doing anything other than blaming us (which would be fair enough but other kids don't do this)

we do not hit/ smack but we do end up shouting.
I have asked my family what to do and all of the points on the Internet searches (take away toys/ ban screens/ time out etc) have been tried and we have been consistent for years nothing bleeding works. I am scared for him. he is too old for these massive toddler like meltdowns. way too old.

Ask for a referral to a behaviour psychologist. It may be the reaction he is use too if it is going on a long time, he could use it to stop you punishing him.
My niece rules the house she is lovely until anyone tries to say "No" Dsis always comforts and gives in.
How is he in school if told off?

I have asked how he is in school and they said fine except from a little fidgeting and class disruption from talking, messing about. the teacher has been very frustrated after school at times asking me to have a word- but I want her to have a word because I dont know what to do either

he is fine if a friend is round or cousins are round.

do I ask the gp or the school?

You can switch GPs, sounds like you need to anyway.

It's difficult because there is a lot of missing information to your post.

How many times a day would you say that he does something that deserves a 'telling off'? Do you give him a warning and an opportunity to change his behaviour? How do you actually tell him off?

Is your response to bad behaviour consistent?

When you say ' you end up shouting at him' are you raising your voice from the start and he goes into a tantrum, or do you start by telling him off calmly and with a firm voice and you end up shouting when his behaviour escalates? I'm not really expecting answers from you but these are questions you should be asking yourself.

You really need to take a step back and look at what triggers the undesired behaviour, how you FIRST respond to it, then how it's managed if he starts to lash out.

I suspect that you will have to change your behaviour and how you tell him off. I'd also be interested in knowing what is his reaction at school.

My son hits himself in the head when he doesn't get his own way, even if he makes a spelling mistake or something others may feel is a trivial error. I will PM you.

But I do agree with the poster above, if you telling him off involves shouting/ being loud, change the way you approach telling him off as this may help.

Often a child with poor impulse control will already feel disappointed in themselves for doing something wrong, so a calm discussion about how to do things differently next time is whats needed rather than a telling off. (I may be missing the mark here and projecting my sons issues)

It might be an idea to speak to the school and see if someone from SENCO can take a look at him, they may be able to get an occupational therapist in to assess him.

Our DS has ASD (was not diagnosed until he was 9), and we didn't really know much about autism before this. He did some behaviour similar to what you have posted - when a toddler banging his head sometimes on the floor, slapping himself when being told off, being very emotional/highly emotional responses to situations etc. With our son he was pretty much OK most of the time at school, other than being told off for being rude - he would bluntly say things, not realising it was rude. He wasn't choosing to be deliberately rude - it was his autism. As he got older his differences with other children became more noticeable.

I'm not saying your son is autistic, but there are some signs in your post that he could be, so have a look on line and read up on it, and see if you think it may be a possibility.

Anxiety? It sounds like a really tricky thing to have to deal with I feel for your son and you.

You could look up ways to discipline without telling off. It's possible to have firm boundaries without shame or shouting, takes hard work from you and DH to put in place but I'm sure you're desperate.

Taking things away or time outs are actually not great ideas, they don't deal with the behaviour and can create cycles of negativity / resentment.

It could be ASD or ADHD too... Def talk to senco

Instead of telling off could you try to approach correction as you would if you were giving advise? Frame the correction as very positive. So if your D C runs down the stairs explain the merits in walking down the stairs, for example as in 'Let's walk down the stairs holding the rail because it is a really safe way to get down them without falling.'

My daughter is 5 and has been doing this since starting school. We have recently seen a professional about her behaviour ( referred from school ) and the advice we were given is anytime she does threaten to hurt herself or hurt herself to just ignore it and not give her any attention for it at all ( obviously if she's going to seriously hurt herself we are to intervene) and lots and lots of positive reinforcement for anything positive she does - even sitting nicely ect

They said any attention negative or positive was still attention. Completely ignore it was our advice

@yesiamyesiamokaycallmeback

I have asked how he is in school and they said fine except from a little fidgeting and class disruption from talking, messing about. the teacher has been very frustrated after school at times asking me to have a word- but I want her to have a word because I dont know what to do either

he is fine if a friend is round or cousins are round.

Do you think there's a possibility of ADHD? It doesn't always look like hyperactivity, it can look like being easily distracted and fidgety too.

I ask because one of the manifestations of ADHD is RSD - Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria. (I know the name is a bit eye-rolly, but bear with me, it's a real thing.) It's an intense over-reaction to criticism or perceived criticism. I used to hit myself in the head when I was told off as a child too. It's only since learning that there is a name for it and that the emotional response I feel to criticism isn't always warranted that I've been better able to deal with it.

Have you tried using a gentle tone of voice? It can make a huge difference.

With my son who did that when he was younger, we kept the same rules for hitting/scratching/hitting your head off the wall as we did for doing that to someone else - so we would hold his hands/head, talk about how it's my and his father's job to protect him from hurting anyone including himself until he could do that himself, and wait for him to calm down and then talk about it.

Eventually, we got to a point of him being able to say variations of 'When you say things like that, it makes me want to hurt myself' so we could skip right to the talking and working on emotional regulation. Those didn't always go as well as I'd like - we both have emotional dysregulation conditions that can fire each other off - but he learned to pause his reaction enough to respond better and we both work on those skills.

With my daughter who would only do the scratching whenever she was uncomfortable out of habit, I'd give her a warning to stop and get her cream - that was most often enough to break the loop. She wouldn't always get her cream but mostly she'd stop. There were a few times when she was really wound up that I held her hands too and then when she calmed down, I'd cream her while we talked it out.

Change GP
Speak to school nurse
Families in focus
Thing is your child may grow out of it.
Then again, without being alarmist, they may not, referral takes ages. Keep a diary and ask for referral.

it would be great to have him say 'I want to hurt myself ' before actually doing it.

I try being calm but I can be asking him to stop jumping off the table or something like that for 10 mins straight qnd he will basically just laugh.
I dont always shout but I do sometimes as it gets that bad. some days all I do is say stop stop stop. I have cried infront if him before out of pure frustration.

I am worried because he really seems to lack empathy too. for example, if his younger brother hurts himself he will laugh whereas his sister goes 'oh no are you okay?' and try to comfort him

or when someone is crying in the other room, I always know it is him purposefully hurting them because he does this laugh and its the same every time.
he lies quite badly too- think about the boy from outnumbered who lied about his dad having cancer and stuff like that. I really don't know what to do, his dad is really worried but I am making excuses and burying my head in the sand

Good point about referrals taking ages.

I have tried everything but slamming crockery and throwing hard toys at people deserves a telling off. I dont know what to do. I am scared for him when he is in that state. otherwise he is a lovely child

I have noticed that people have asked me not to bring him when we visit but don't mind my other children so it is already affecting him.
I dont know what to do. I dont want him to have no friends and have everyone avoid him but it seems to be the case as its already happening

Do you carry out any threats? Is there any consequences when you continually say stop and he ignores you.
When he finally responds to you when he's pushed you to anger he explodes could this be another way of getting away with bad behaviour.
He may have SEN.
My DS hits himself but he is defiant in school, home, or social activities, I punish him as promised in most situations.
It is worth investigating anyway.

everything you have written cried out asd or pda to me

my 10 y old has both and others

(i have 2 kids with numerous disabilities each)

I’d talk to the school SENCo.

like now we are having a massive tantrum because I put marmalade on his toast. I asked if he wanted marmalade- he did... and now its made he starts shouting and throwing and hitting out. so I put him in the corner of the room and he starts hitting his head saying he wants to kill himself and he hates his life. because of marmalade. I dont know what to do man. I try and keep calm but I have other children to consider and when he is in this mood it just isn't fair. 30 mins over marmalade that he wanted.

I looked online and it doesn't seem to be asd as in the nhs website one of the requirements is that he has to be consistently like this across at least 2 settings- so home and school. school have no concerns except from mild misbehaving.

since the children have been back at school I have had each if them off isolating due to cases in their bubbles and that time spent alone when eldest is at school was bliss. no arguments, no misbehaving. and now his bubble has had a case and we have to spend 2 weeks at home isolating while the others go to school (except preschoolers) it is like there is no break.
except for me- I have been broken.

booked gp appointment. what do i say?

also I cant change GPS because they only accept patients from a specific postcode, the other doctors have said we don't fit the criteria because we live in A1 rather than A2. bloody ridiculous.

don't make his toast!! Let him make it, and spread whatever he wants on it.

Gosh, poor kid and poor you. You need to have him refered to be seen, this is self harming. It sounds like he really isn’t managing his feelings at all. I wouldn’t say this was autistic behaviour but more that of ADHD and rejection sensitive dysmorphia. My son is asd and adhd but it’s his adhd that makes him hurt himself :( it’s truly awful to watch.

I bet school do have issues, and that they would score him. My sons said definetely no adhd to the point I cancelled his private appointment because they wouldn’t believe it anyway... nhs one came and they scored him higher than me!

I have read the symptoms or whatever of adhd and it does sound like him.
haha I wish I could trust him to make toast but he is absolutely untrustworthy with anything like this! almost caused a fire before- singed all my washing that was sat next to the heater (we had to take it out of the wall not long after)

but he is lovely and nice and kind when we aren't battling. it's not all bad

Oh OP it sounds stressful.
My DS is very similar he has DMDD SPD and no emotional regulation amongst other things.
I felt put off when I read up on ASD too.
He is awful in school too and it has been hard to get help it is a battle.
Have a read up on SPD it has an awful affect on their life.
Be armed with information contact your GP and school.

Yes you need to get professional help.
I'm similar to @BiBabbles.
My DS went through a phase and I would explain that I wouldn't accept him treating other people like that so he certainly wasn't to treat himself like it!
They need a positive internal voice, which when they are young is your voice, then they develop their own.
Also naming the action as wrong rather than the child.

but he is lovely and nice and kind when we aren't battling. it's not all bad
Same as mine it makes it so hard knowing their illness causes great distress and horror he's very confused.
He is mini hulk I'm his Betty