AIBU to Think MNHQ needs to tackle the ageism on this site?

[LastGoldenDaysOfSummer]

The venom and hate aimed at older people on some of the Covid threads is disgusting. If the same was aimed at disabled, TW or BAME people then the posts would be deleted immediately, and rightly so.

But because it's the elderly it's left to stand, even after being reported. This isn't new, MNHQ has always been a hotbed of ageism but it's usually dealt with when reported.

But not any more. Should they be doing more?

Ageism isn’t ok and shouldn’t be accepted.

But to jump on the covid bandwagon - my MIL refuses to see her grandchildren as they are trying to kill her & feels that the young should stay at home as she hasn’t many years left. She should be able to enjoy the garden centre, beach walks and restaurants without the worry of the young people spreading it?

She’s still going out meeting friends going to Zumba classes and cinema. But feels schools should close as they spread it & we should all stay home - she can’t possibly see her grandchildren for a social distance walk as they are going to kill her?
I just think some people are selfish! Young or old, government haven’t helped. And I know there is family’s scared to loose there homes as they have little money coming in. And other people scared to leave there homes since March - it’s crap and The spread of fear and control isn’t helping .

Ageism doesn't worry me.

It's like watching people throwing a boomerang made of steel with a sharpened knife-edge into the wilderness as far as they can, knowing the harder, faster and further they throw it the greater their surprise when they realise its going to return.

@SonjaMorgan

I haven't read the threads being discussed but this does work both ways. There are posts about "idiot" students and "millennials". There are so many issues bubbling under the surface and the age divide isn't going away anytime soon.

Btw I totally agree that ANY shitty generalised sneering at the “other” generation(s) is wrong.

Obviously I tend to notice the ones (quite a few even in this thread) that seek to blame me personally for what some people my age may have done.

The inequalities between the lives of the baby boomers - the wealth and opportunities they had and have and have been steadily removing from those behind them - and those of us who have to work to support their luxury, is appalling

Almost as appalling as the massive generalisations spouted here. Please pop your bubble and have a look at the real lives of baby boomers. Some are living in poverty, some have struggled since Thatcher destroyed their industries and communities and threw them on the scrap heap.

Yanbu but it’s up to people not to be bloody ageist in the first place!

At least adults have the ability to rationalise in a way young children can’t.

I completely agree, which is a huge challenge for the adults in their life to support them through.

I am technically a baby boomer (very, very late!). Yes, I own my own home which I am very, very grateful for. Other than that I am a carer for my disabled DH. We are not living in luxury.

I haven’t really seen any ageism but there are issues of generational inequality and the unequal effects of Covid on different age groups. There’s no doubt that there are many areas where millennials have it much much harder than boomers- such as housing and pensions. That’s a general statement though, it doesn’t mean every single boomer has an expensive house they bought for buttons and a final salary pension. But overall there are serious issues of generational inequality.

Yes to what @CayrolBaaaskin says. Basically the 'direct' cost of Covid is massively born by the over-seventies (average age of fatalities is 82, which is actually higher than the ave UK life expectancy), but the cost of prioritising Covid over everything else or attempting to rigorously suppress Covid till...really who knows when???....will be overwhelmingly born by the under-fifties and very particularly the under-thirties....and that cost is turning out to be absolutely eye-watering on every level - financial, educational, emotional, medical (missed cancer diagnosis for example). There really isn't any way round that issue and shouting 'ageism' every time someone broaches won't make the reality go away.

Actually whats really struck me about MN over the past six months is some posters' really brutal dismissal of people struggling with their MH at the moment. Should I report every post like that as 'ableism'?

Here's an example of an ageist and uninformed post from @Napqueen on a Covid thread

Yes we are. School children are having hugely disrupted education, the shit show going on in higher education and the lack of opportunities and jobs for young people generally. Although older people are higher risk of becoming ill or dying of covid this risk is still small and they generally have the benefit of pensions, higher salaries, bigger houses etc to sit this out with. I feel the younger generation will feel the effects of this considerably more for considerably longer

@DimityDeNimes - that’s not really ageism is it? The older generation are more likely to have more wealth- doesn’t mean they all have it. The post you highlighted does say generally. Men generally are the beneficiaries of the gender pay gap - that doesn’t change because one poster has a dh that earns less than his female counterpart. Anecdotes are not data.

In fact @DimityDeNimes I don’t see anything unacceptable about that post at all. If that’s the best you can do there’s obviously not an issue.

It works both ways, like any other 'ism'. We have had growing inter-generational inequality in this country for a while now and it is largely being ignored. When people feel ignored they start to shout a bit louder. I think this is what we are beginning to see. Of course we are living through times when sensible discussion about virtually anything seems beyond the means of most people so it will probably manifest in bitter division and insults like everything else.

It’s all in the phrasing.

“I’m concerned that lockdown is storing up problems for our young generation. What can we do to minimise this?” - perfectly acceptable.

“The average age of death from Covid is 82, I’m sorry but they’ve had their lives!” - unacceptable.

(The latter example nearly always features a granny or parent who is that age and would ‘happily die’ so the child can sing happy birthday with her friends.)

@BigBadVoodooHat

Other people have had no trouble observing it, I'm surprised you're having difficulty.

I'm not dodging the issue. I'm busy. Try reading the Liverpool thread. Plenty of ageism both ways there. Either is inexcusable.

So you are not able to provide evidence of the 'venom and hate' that is you allege 'rife'?

There's plenty of evidence. Quoting specific examples from other threads will lead to TAAT deletions.

If I've reported ageism it's usually been promptly dealt with. My issue is that so many posters find it acceptable.

I believe it is ageist and has lots of stereotypes that are not true for a huge number if not the majority of older people.

I know MN imagines all older people have paid off their mortgages and are sitting in their spacious homes, child free and looking forward to (or already enjoying) rounds of golf, spa days and holidays in Barbados courtesy of their salaries as consultants or their fat pension pot but ...

Many older people are working for NMW or slightly more, existing on state pensions sometimes supplemented by a modest private pension. They have weathered recessions, negative equity, redundancies, forced into early retirement by health problems, seen their pensions disappear due to fund managers incompetence or halved by divorce ... I won't bore on but you get the gist older people - like young people - are not an homogeneous group

And I'll point out again - ageism isn't just about older people

It's about prejudice against anyone because of their age, whatever their age.

Plenty of ageism towards younger people on here as well.

@DimityDeNimes - no group is completely homogeneous. Talk of any group will include generalisation. That’s just how it works. The post you quote even states it’s speaking in generalities.

Yes, some older people don’t have pensions or Housing wealth but in general they are far far more likely to than younger generations. It’s not ageist to say that. Just a fact.

Same as men as a group generally out earn women. But of course there are many men who earn less than women.

Why are people getting so offended by the Gransnet section?

@FTMF30 - we talking about a separate site called Gransnet that MN set up a few years ago and they said was aimed at over 50s.

Also tbh no younger people at all have pensions. You need to be at least 55 to draw one.

Those of us who are still working and have a mortgage/rent to pay are pretty resentful that a larger proportion of the older population voted for this and have damaged our economic prospects

Plenty of us 50+ have mortgages/rents to pay, DC to raise, bills to pay are dismayed by those - and many were "younger" people - who voted for Brexit. And those who couldn't be bothered voting at all. Stop trying to be divisive.

Napqueens comment was accurate. Just because it doesn’t apply to everyone in a certain age range does not mean that it’s not true. There are always outliers.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48759591

Objecting to facts just makes people look like they’re incapable of understanding stats

@DimityDeNimes - again the older generation voted majority brexit and the younger generation did not. That’s not to say you personally voted brexit or are responsible for it. Younger people are far more likely to still be paying off their mortgage too.

Maybe just don’t take things so personally? I’m pushing 50 myself and have young primary school children. I’ll definitely be paying off my mortgage into my 60s. But I recognize too that my generation had advantages (eg free education and cheap property) that dds will not. That’s not to say I was necessarily in a position to take advantage of those advantages (soo wish I had been able to get on the property ladder earlier) but I recognize in retrospect that I had opportunity that dd will not.

@DimityDeNimes

Why are people getting so offended by the Gransnet section?

@FTMF30 - we talking about a separate site called Gransnet that MN set up a few years ago and they said was aimed at over 50s.

@DimityDeNimes Aah ok! Fair enough. Makes much more sense than what I thought people were complaining about.