AIBU to Think MNHQ needs to tackle the ageism on this site?

[LastGoldenDaysOfSummer]

The venom and hate aimed at older people on some of the Covid threads is disgusting. If the same was aimed at disabled, TW or BAME people then the posts would be deleted immediately, and rightly so.

But because it's the elderly it's left to stand, even after being reported. This isn't new, MNHQ has always been a hotbed of ageism but it's usually dealt with when reported.

But not any more. Should they be doing more?

The young do feel 'got at' actually, because they are now being blamed for the spread of covid when they were told to return to uni and carry on with their education- they did, and the vast majority did not hold parties or do anything outside the guidance, for which they have been rewarded with social demonization and a stricter lockdown in our area than the general population. This kind of divisive and nasty behaviour to the young will come back to haunt us.

YANBU - I'm BAME and under 40 and shocked at how much ageism and ableism is able to stand. I find the racist comments get deleted quite quickly.

I don't think the young are being blamed, they like everyone else are on the whole trying to understand what's happening and how they should respond

I think the government is being blamed for fail8ng to recognise that sending kids to university was a massive risk that should have been much better managed. Just because people report facts...cases are rising in the young and the fear is they will spread to the old,..is not assigning blame. If young people rad it that way perhaps the6 have some guilt ?

@turnitonagain

If the same was aimed at disabled, TW or BAME people then the posts would be deleted immediately, and rightly so.

There’s loads of racism against BAME people on MN.

Yes. It's always addressed when reported but ageism isn't.

I am 58 and I'm amazed at some of the havocc I have apparently wreaked, not just ruined everything for younger people due to being (slightly) more at risk from the virus, but I have personally destroyed any chances of young people ever having a house, a job or a pension, and I am sitting in my paid-for mansion laughing at them (not true btw just in case anyone needs it spelling out).
According to quite a few posters it is now time for me, as a scummy boomer to have my assets and my future plundered as I have been selfishly keeping the young down.

I don't actually want MN to delete this stuff, I want to challenge it for the nasty pointless divisive hatred it is.

I teach uni students, they tell me they feel blamed! And saying you work at the uni is like social death in the town itself. I don't care, I know our uni has done an amazing job in terms of campus safety and has paid privately for tests too which is why anyone knows about them. The students and the uni's name is mud though outside those in it (for bringing corona into the area).

@midgebabe

thread today saying it's only the over 70's who are dying, it's just like flu for everyone else so we should behave as if it were flu, and do nothing

Replace over 70's with the term BAME...

But age ISN'T the same. It happens to everyone at exactly the same pace.

Say that everyone lived to 80. A 60 year old has therefore had 75% of their life. A 20 year old has had 25% of their life. Etc.

Age is measurable, quantifiable and equal, barring accidents. When measuring the long term impact of the measures we take we should factor in proportion of lives affected as well as number of deaths.

This isn't just my argument, it's my mum's - a 76 year old with a degree specialism in viral epidemiology. She's suffering from isolation, but she's fucking furious that my sister hasn't been able to access her therapy for self harm, or that I haven't been able to have my smear test.

If young people rad it that way perhaps the6 have some guilt?

You said young people weren't being blamed...and then blamed them.

Luckily by working with young people, I see their creativity and that most have coped pretty well with these circumstances, I'm not fearful for the future, this generation will do fine, like all youth, they find a way through, but are they going to love the government that threw them under the bus? Nope!

On a fair number of threads I’ve come across posts on the lines of “This woman, she was probably in her mid 60’s just reached into my pram and held my baby’s hand.” Often there will be replies on the lines of “Why did you mention the woman’s age? How is it relevant” etc etc. There does seem to be an awareness of ageism on here.

I am also conflicted when it comes to COVID restrictions. I’m nearly 60 and my friends and my siblings are between 60 - 75. I do feel I need to take more steps to lower my risk of catching it as it is more of a risk for me than younger people. I would rather the younger people got out there and went to school, work and socialised while I err on the side of caution. Is it fair - no. Is it nice - not at all. But on the basis we may have a long wait to find and roll out a vaccine (if that ever happens) I don’t want or expect life to stop to protect my generation. It is unpalatable but some of us are at higher risk than others and we all have to do our best to protect ourselves while trying to make sure life doesn’t grind to a halt for everyone.

read the Covid threads. They are rife with it.

I look through the Coronavirus board most days. I haven't seen any 'venom and hate'.

Can you provide any examples, or are you just going to dodge the issue with 'go and look for it yourself' to cover the fact that you're making it up?

Can we not turn this thread into another discussion about whether old people should keel over and die to help the young?

OP, YANBU. I'm 31 and I've found it incredibly upsetting to see how dispensable the elderly are (or in some cases, anyone over 50) to so many people.

@ChasedByFox

And please do not conflate ageism with racism. People that are now old were once young. People that.are non-white we're not previously white. They've never had white privilege in a way that older people now once had youth.

Two separate issues, both need addressing.

Absolutely! It's a shocking and totally useless comparator!

No I am not blaming them

Saying Some people feel blamed it may be because they have done something wrong is not the same as saying every person who share some classification with those people have done the same thing,

I forgot to say I totally agree that the segregation between mumsnet and gransnet is not acceptable at all. Whatever I might start a thread about I want the input of all ages not just my peers. A problem about my DGC for example I’d welcome the opinions of all age groups. I don’t want to know just what other grandparents think. With boards like feminism, bereavement, style & beauty, tv, reading etc, every age has something to add . Why on Earth the second you reach 60 or you become a grandparent do you need a separate site to discuss this stuff on? Baffling.

I can’t stand the ageist generalisations, usually the ‘older generation’ (when they are talking about 60 yo MIL) are racist / sexist etc.

It’s so stupid: your grandmother’s generation invented the Equal Pay Act, the Sex Discrimination Act, your Mum was probably Rocking Against Racism and wearing an Anti Nazi League badge.

So far im agreeing with everything poppingnostopping says

Thats probably because im both ancient (51) and the mother of teenagers/young adults

@BigBadVoodooHat

read the Covid threads. They are rife with it.

I look through the Coronavirus board most days. I haven't seen any 'venom and hate'.

Can you provide any examples, or are you just going to dodge the issue with 'go and look for it yourself' to cover the fact that you're making it up?

Other people have had no trouble observing it, I'm surprised you're having difficulty.

I'm not dodging the issue. I'm busy. Try reading the Liverpool thread. Plenty of ageism both ways there. Either is inexcusable.

I think it is a mindset thing, the example of a 60 year old having 20 years left but a 20 year old would have 60 years completely ignores the experience and value of the older person gained in those years.

Absolutely! It's a shocking and totally useless comparator!

No it isn't. I was comparing the response of HQ to ageism as opposed to racism. Not the topics themselves but the response. A very useful comparator, actually. Racism gets deleted when reported. Ageism not so much.

Other people have had no trouble observing it, I'm surprised you're having difficulty.

I'm not dodging the issue. I'm busy. Try reading the Liverpool thread. Plenty of ageism both ways there. Either is inexcusable.

So you are not able to provide evidence of the 'venom and hate' that is you allege 'rife'?

Why are people getting so offended by the Gransnet section? It's useful to organise forums so that you can easily get the help you need and/or talk to like minded people. I don't see hardcore feminists complaining that they are being 'othered' because their is a feminism board, or the same with black mums complaining there's a black section, or parents with kids who have special needs complaining that there is a special needs section. It is designed to be a space where you can talk about things specific to you. Use it if you think it's useful and don't if you don't. No one is forcing any of you to do either.

Also, Gransnet will obviously be linked somewhat to age, but it's basically for anyone who is a Gran (i.e. a Grandparent). Some of you are so entitled, you've got to a point you're doing yourselves a disservice.

For me it’s the discussions about how older people have benefited from good pensions, cheap house prices, secure jobs, free higher education etc and should be giving money, child care etc etc to the younger generation because they don’t benefit from any of that. In the context of the thread it’s clear they’re taking about people in their late 50s/early 60s.

I’m 50 next year and most of the folk I know in my age bracket didn’t benefit from low house prices - certainly not in the way my parents did, don’t have final salary pensions or job security. I’ve paid over £30k in higher education fees (from taxes income, not student loans). Most folk I know are either working full time to try and build some security before retirement or are working part time and raising their own children still but the narrative all too often seems to be that folk in their 50s had it so good - forgetting they are the Thatcher generation and watched all of these benefits being steadily stripped away.

So you are not able to provide evidence of the 'venom and hate' that is you allege 'rife'?

No, you are too lazy to read the thread I suggested. Or to read the other posts confirming what I say.

But carry on pretending there's no ageism here if it makes you happy.

Wow.

What a bunch of racists I'm seeing.

Can you really compare discrimination based on age vs a group (BAME) who have been treated the lowest of the low for thousands of centuries, lack of opportunities as a result of their skin colour, people being killed because of their skin colour.

I cannot believe what I'm reading on this thread.