AIBU to Think MNHQ needs to tackle the ageism on this site?

[LastGoldenDaysOfSummer]

The venom and hate aimed at older people on some of the Covid threads is disgusting. If the same was aimed at disabled, TW or BAME people then the posts would be deleted immediately, and rightly so.

But because it's the elderly it's left to stand, even after being reported. This isn't new, MNHQ has always been a hotbed of ageism but it's usually dealt with when reported.

But not any more. Should they be doing more?

You do see the opposite too. I see many older regular posters try to tie up younger posters in knots.

I’m somewhere in between

It breaks my heart to think of what the younger generation and children have lost this last year. I hope their mental health can recover

@Nanny0gg

Me to. The irony in some of the posts that just think of it from their perspective. They couldn’t card less about the young one, and get pissed off when someone explains that actually, yours chucking one generation under the bus....

I haven't read the threads being discussed but this does work both ways. There are posts about "idiot" students and "millennials". There are so many issues bubbling under the surface and the age divide isn't going away anytime soon.

The mental health of a generation who can’t mix and socialise and make and build relationships is not a easy thing to deal with. It’s big ask to expect them to put their lives on hold.

It's a bit of an exaggeration to say that they can't mix and socialise. I have teenage children and whilst they have been a bit restricted it would be very untrue to say they haven't been able to socialise at all. They have certainly been less restricted than the elderly or shielding.

The inequalities between the lives of the baby boomers - the wealth and opportunities they had and have and have been steadily removing from those behind them - and those of us who have to work to support their luxury, is appalling.

And here we go again - would you please tell me where this luxury of mine is, because I seem to have mislaid it somewhere! If I were to make a sweeping generalization about a generation of young people I would be shot down in flames., but it's okay to take pot shots at the older generation.

There's an example on the first page of this thread......."Some people have teenagers in their 50s".

Err, I had a 5yo in my 50s. There are plenty of us with primary age children. People just don't think.

But it exists in every sort of media. According to the tabloids, anyone over 50 has a gold plated pension , we all own houses outright, had free university and now while away our time pottering. Rather than the reality of working full time, doing the school run and running a house like anyone else.

Ignorant, lazy reporting and frankly dim.

In covid terms, the country would grind to a halt if every over-50 flung up their hands and isolated. Most head teachers, hospital consultants, senior govt officials and senior police officers are in their fifties. But also thousands of carers, train drivers, nurses, supermarket staff, childminders, psychiatrists, water engineers etc. Without us society wouldn't survive.

In my last work place there was a discussion about whether we needed a tampon dispenser in the loo because there were only 3 women in the building and I was told I was too old to need one. By a 30yo woman. . If only.

So mumsnet is no better and no worse than everywhere else. It would be nice if it were better.

@Belladonna12

The mental health of a generation who can’t mix and socialise and make and build relationships is not a easy thing to deal with. It’s big ask to expect them to put their lives on hold.

It's a bit of an exaggeration to say that they can't mix and socialise. I have teenage children and whilst they have been a bit restricted it would be very untrue to say they haven't been able to socialise at all. They have certainly been less restricted than the elderly or shielding.

Well that’s good for you but.... my DC has stated secondary and can’t get to know the new kids and make friends because they are to allowed to move seats or walk together etc it makes it very difficult. DC is really struggling and I’m pretty sure there are many more feeling completely overwhelmed and alienated.

First year students are in a worse position than other years as they don't have pre-existing friendships to fall back on and any contact on our campus is in masks so hard to recognize people. There are particular pressure points for mental health- also those with already existing MH conditions are going to fare worse, whatever age, but definitely amongst teenagers. Lots of older people get depressed too, and many have chosen to see family as a consequence despite the risk as otherwise they feel too alone when they have not quite as long as everyone else to live.

As someone already said on this thread, it really suits the government for us to all blame each other and sow discord amongst the generations, people should be campaigning against them and their care home policies, and their underfunding of the NHS, instead they are sniping at each other. Why is the NHS close to capacity all the time each winter? We should be interrogating their divisive and socially unjust policies.

I’m pretty sure there are many more feeling completely overwhelmed and alienated.

I’m sure there are, including a friend who had her first child in lockdown and had no one to support her for the first 3 months of his life, or another friend who didn’t see another soul in the flesh for 5 months because she lives alone and had to shield, or another friend who couldn’t be with her dying mum or be at her funeral.

If we could accept that it’s very difficult for lots of people for lots of reasons instead of setting everyone against each other we might get further.

The othering of older people on this site is by far its worst feature. I report when I can be bothered, or when it's particularly egregious.

No younger people can wrap their heads around the fact that they are, inexorably, becoming 'the old'. The hatred is driven by fear. Just as so many posters dismissing 'the vulnerable' as a group don't seem to realise that if they are overweight, unfit, pre-diabetic, whatever - THEY are the vulnerable.

mayyouliveininterestingtimes I am 70. I deplore the political decisions which you detail. I never voted for the governments that implemented them. I worked in the public centre. I think Margaret Thatcher ruined the society she claimed not to exist and started a dog eat dog culture. I have probably benefitted from some 'I'm alright Jack' policies but I resent being stereotyped. I don't like students being stereotyped by age either, or any other individual being prejudged. Re Covid.. I am happy to shield if it prevents financial and other harms to younger people but I resent being referred to as if I am not fully human. MN is an ageist place. If I posted about a disagreement with a DIL for example I would not get a fair hearing. I would be dismissed as an interfering old cow whatever had happened I think having a separate gransnet is okay but it does mean each generation speaks into an echo chamber. Also re Covid, there ar plenty of vulnerable people below retirement age. Are they supposed to sacrifice their jobs and lives for everyone else. I am okay, my pension arrives regardless but what about vulnerable people under 66. Oh wait- if they are over 50 they are just an old biddy who has had their life.

@LastGoldenDaysOfSummer, I voted YABU because yes there is a clear divide in MN around age.
But it works both ways.

You have comments about elderly people in the same way that you have comments about the younger generations. I a, only following in your outrage if you are also really annoyed and angry and comments about young people who are all careless, snowflakes, don’t care about others etc... that litter MN too.

And a thousand likes for what jellycatspyjamas said.

Meuniere I am older, I live in a small University city, I hear people stereotyping and blaming the students. It seriously annoys me.

Well that’s good for you but.... my DC has stated secondary and can’t get to know the new kids and make friends because they are to allowed to move seats or walk together etc it makes it very difficult. DC is really struggling and I’m pretty sure there are many more feeling completely overwhelmed and alienated.

Are you sure that she wouldn't be feeling overwhelmed anyway ? It's difficult for anyone starting a new school if they don't have any friends at any time . My DC has started at a new school too. There is a problem with not been allowed to move seats. However, they are free to chat to other children at break times etc and they are not wearing masks. She isn't finding it that restrictive compared with normal.

Another thing often overlooked in these stupid generalisations and ageism is that many of us boomers have young offspring and extended family. The idea we are deliberately screwing them is offensive.

@Paintedmaypole, the reality is that similar comments are said about people in their 20s.

Don’t you think that sending students in halls to just lock them up within a day of them arriving, with security guards at the door is OK.
Is that not treating them like ‘lesser than’ and not fully human as you said (beside the fact it was actually illegal too)? I’m pretty sure that you wouldn't have accepted having a security guard at your door !!
However many people were in full agreement because ‘students are just careless’, they are the ones driving the number of cases up etc etc. (All that wo any data or proof btw)

What we see is the government winning at pitching people against each other and doing a lot of finger pointing to distract us from the fact THEY are massively failing (at the track and trace system, testing and generally having policies that make sense and work)

Sorry @Paintedmaypole.
X post. I typed my answer much more slowly than you did!
I can see how you are annoyed at stereotyping younger people too.

@Belladonna12

Well that’s good for you but.... my DC has stated secondary and can’t get to know the new kids and make friends because they are to allowed to move seats or walk together etc it makes it very difficult. DC is really struggling and I’m pretty sure there are many more feeling completely overwhelmed and alienated.

Are you sure that she wouldn't be feeling overwhelmed anyway ? It's difficult for anyone starting a new school if they don't have any friends at any time . My DC has started at a new school too. There is a problem with not been allowed to move seats. However, they are free to chat to other children at break times etc and they are not wearing masks. She isn't finding it that restrictive compared with normal.

She was a really confident, popular girl and now she’s like a shaddow of her former self. She wasn’t put with any of her friends but she was fine with that as ordinarily she’d make friends very easily but they are very strict and they have to go out in groups and can’t wait for each other etc....

The school is enormous and even finding people from her class once they are out for lunch is proving difficult with a short 25 min lunch break.

It’s just a nightmare and I feel so sorry for her

yes as long as MN also addresses the vitriol against 'the young'

YABU

because it's MN, and there is a lot of hatred and bitterness in general
against SAHM
against high earners
against landlords
against teachers
against slim people
against anyone not doing laundry as frequently as you are
and don't even look at the so-called self-appointed "feminists" ready to pounce on anyone daring to get married and god forbid change their name!

Some is clearly pure jealousy
most of it is just bonkers. So there might be ageism among other things. What do you expect MN to do? Just report abusive threads and stop taking the rants of random people on an anonymous forum personally.

She was a really confident, popular girl and now she’s like a shaddow of her former self. She wasn’t put with any of her friends but she was fine with that as ordinarily she’d make friends very easily but they are very strict and they have to go out in groups and can’t wait for each other etc....

I’d recognise the same in my primary aged daughter - her friends are all in different classes and the things that made school bearable for her (singing, drama, group work) aren’t happening and she’s a shadow of herself. It’s awful, but my older friends have it hard too, it’s not either/or.

I’m 51 and have two school-aged (adopted) DDs of 11 and 8. So yes, I’m middle-aged. I think that ageism isn’t a new thing at all. When I was in my twenties, I thought that over 40 was old never mind over 50! So it isn’t exactly surprising to me when young people complain about the restrictions on their lives because of the old and vulnerable, who are apparently at death’s door. I might have thought the same if I was young myself.

That’s the beauty of Mumsnet, there is such a variety of ages. Hopefully we can learn from each other, whatever our ages.

In my last work place there was a discussion about whether we needed a tampon dispenser in the loo because there were only 3 women in the building and I was told I was too old to need one. By a 30yo woman

Omg what did you say!!!

I wanted tablets to stop my period while on holiday...cut off for online seemed to be 50 (even though at the drs its 55) and i just thought if I’m’young’ enough to have periods then i should be ‘young’ enough to be able to stop them

@Jellycatspyjamas

She was a really confident, popular girl and now she’s like a shaddow of her former self. She wasn’t put with any of her friends but she was fine with that as ordinarily she’d make friends very easily but they are very strict and they have to go out in groups and can’t wait for each other etc....

I’d recognise the same in my primary aged daughter - her friends are all in different classes and the things that made school bearable for her (singing, drama, group work) aren’t happening and she’s a shadow of herself. It’s awful, but my older friends have it hard too, it’s not either/or.

I’m not suggesting other groups don’t have it hard, but it infuriates me when some people simply view it as the worst it can possibly be for young people, is them not being allowed out to get drunk.... it’s far far more than that the negative affects on them.

I also worry because they are so young, how it will impact them throughout their life, maybe it will, maybe it won’t. At least adults have the ability to rationalise in a way young children can’t.

It’s shit all round but the assumption it’s only the older generation that’s affected is rubbish.