To think formula is an amazing invention?

[IsoBordem]

As I was sitting and feeding my beautiful healthy, happy, and thriving baby I was suddenly so thankful for the existence of baby formula. It gets such a bad rap by some people but I would hate to think where she would be now if formula did not exist.

Seeing her in the hospital because she lost too much weight in her first week was heartbreaking. I will always be grateful that we live in an age where baby formula is available!

There is very strict laws governing the advertsisment of formula for 0 - 6 months by the WHO. It can not be advisetised promoted, on reduced offers in supermarkets. You can not collect clubcard points etc when you buy formula aswell. You can only advertise formula from 6 months onwards. Companies have taken advantage of things in the past which is why these laws are in place.

Formula milk itself can be an important and lifesaving substance.

What would be amazing though is robust and universal breastfeeding support for all.

@FuckeryOmbudsman I haven't seen any data for your claim. However I did used to live in an African country and you can easily see how formula there could be very unsafe, as adults and children regularly get sick from unclean drinking water and cook on open fires - it would be just about impossible to prepare formula hygienically. The charity I was working for are currently focusing on providing people with safe hand washing facilities so you can reasonably assume that many people don't even have that. People living below the poverty line would also be forced to make choices between buying sufficient formula for their baby and food for their older children so there's a clear risk of under feeding (and obviously malnutrition in the older children).
In the UK of course formula is a fantastic invention for all those women who can't or don't want to breastfeed. I would love donor milk to be more widely available but it isn't and even then the mother should have the freest possible choice about what works best for her family.

I suspect deaths that can be attributed to FF are mostly down to improper prep.

A lot of deaths are down to companies unethically promoting FF in countries where many poor people have limited to no access to clean water. So, yes, you could say 'improper prep', but you could also say that FF shouldn't be promoted for the purposes of profit at all in those places.

I’ve seen plenty of threads here where OP's post about how amazing, fabulous, magical breastfeeding is, so why is the OP labeled as goady because she dare say that formula is brilliant?

And to backhandedly agree that oh yes, it's good but more breastfeeding support and upping rates would be so much better. That's not what we're talking about here? Are mothers not allowed to appreciate formula? The other fact is there are mothers who decide they don't want to breastfeed. Not that they can't but that they don't want to. That's valid and acceptable at it is their choice.

I'd probably be dead without formula. My son would be also. Its amazing.

I’ve seen plenty of threads here where OP's post about how amazing, fabulous, magicalhmm breastfeeding is, so why is the OP labeled as goady because she dare say that formula is brilliant?

Either way gets grief. They're both goady topics without meaning to be.

It saved the life of my son. What more can I say?

I agree that feeding your baby is a good thing!!

It may have changed now, but I don't like the way formula and breast feeding were presented when I attended antenatal classes 13 years ago... it was all towards breast feeding and we had to stay behind like naughty school children and ask the midwife about formula feeding if we wanted to know about it, because they couldn't just tell us.

In my mind it should have been a balanced session... these are the pros and cons of breastfeeding, this is what you need to know, these are some of the things that can go wrong and these are solutions / this is where you can get help.

And then the same for bottle feeding.

And what you need to know about for mixed feeding.

And I mean all the pros and cons that impact your everday life too...

e.g pros of breastfeeding - if you want an excuse to hide during a family party, you can just say you need to feed the baby and disappear for some peace and quiet for half an hour.

• you can sit watching TV guilt free because you are also feeding the baby

cons - you might have a baby that won't take a bottle of expressed milk despite you feeling like a dairy cow to express it - thereby ruining any chance of a night out

• your mother in law will try and take over whenever you see her because she wants a turn with the baby

@FuckeryOmbudsman your claim is absolutely correct, as anyone who takes an interest in the regulation and history of formula companies would know.

Formula is great when made in perfect conditions. Formula used in refugee camps is lethal. Companies target poorer regions, diminish women’s milk supplies by state-supported presence of formula companies in hospitals (wet nurses, supplementing babies etc), then send these women and babies off home to make formula in dirty environments. All with the belief that their milk wasn’t enough and perpetuating that to the next generation. Diarrhoea is one of the biggest causes of infant mortality in poorer countries - the cause? Dirty water to make formula. They are absolutely corrupt companies and have killed millions of babies.

Please educate yourselves before making sweeping comments or celebrating the likes of Nestle and Danone. We’re all hugely blessed to live in a country where companies can peddle their goods without the huge risk of them killing your child. Please let’s not make a thread celebrating these companies.

While @FuckeryOmbudsman makes a valid point, I do sometimes wonder how these figures would compare to baby deaths worldwide if formula did not exist or was not available. Luckily, we can only speculate about this.

@Sandcastles55

Well explained, so shockingly sad, they should be imprisoned.

Or course it’s great. I don’t think it does anyone any favours to have a debate about that.

I do think it’s considered too normal unfortunately. As even the NHS website says that breastfeeding decreases the risk of x y z, whereas formula actually increases the risk. Breastfeeding should be the baseline.

I have a friend who insisted that breastfeeding beyond 6 weeks has no health benefits, basically because she didn’t do any longer with her daughter and was told that by the midwife (who was probably trying to help her feel better). She actually tried to make me feel bad and I had to keep quiet to save her feelings- I breastfed for 14 months which I’m incredibly proud of and I know DD has benefitted hugely because of it.

Deaths caused by filthy water and no hygiene. Not formula. Way to skew the research

@IsoBordem

As I was sitting and feeding my beautiful healthy, happy, and thriving baby I was suddenly so thankful for the existence of baby formula. It gets such a bad rap by some people but I would hate to think where she would be now if formula did not exist.

Seeing her in the hospital because she lost too much weight in her first week was heartbreaking. I will always be grateful that we live in an age where baby formula is available!

Are you me OP? Could have written this myself, first born was premature 6 weeks....sent home after 4 days...told to ‘feed on demand’, baby did not how to ‘demand’....5 different HV’s over the following week ‘oh she will demand when hungry’ result? Loss of 24% body weight in a week....then into a coma for another week. So yes formula is amazing and enabled co feeding so she could recover

@Wexone

There is very strict laws governing the advertsisment of formula for 0 - 6 months by the WHO. It can not be advisetised promoted, on reduced offers in supermarkets. You can not collect clubcard points etc when you buy formula aswell. You can only advertise formula from 6 months onwards. Companies have taken advantage of things in the past which is why these laws are in place.

Unfortunately, these are not laws, but guidelines, by the WHO. Countries decide whether or not to adhere to them. For example, the guidelines state there should be no advertising or promoting of formula milk at all. Britain only partially adhere to this, and advertise follow-on milk from 6 months. Follow-on milk exists only as a way to get around the advertising ban for infant milks. It does not exist in countries who stick rigidly to the guidelines.

So often on these posts I see people saying we just need more robust breastfeeding support and more encouragement etc but that doesn't address the fact that some women just don't WANT to do it. I had all the support in the world, midwives, health visitors, family, husband helping round the clock, money to pay for additional support.. didn't change that fact that I simply hated the feeling of it, hated how often my baby wanted to feed. Knowing it's cluster feeding and normal didn't mean I suddenly was able to put up with it or like it.

What I needed was 'permission' to stop. I wish my midwives and health visitors were allowed to say it's ok to formula feed. I wish they had been allowed to tell me about making up bottles so I wasn't googling or crying in the formula aisle feeling useless!

Ultimately the problem with 'more robust breastfeeding support' is that it supposes all women want to breastfeed in the first place and it's just lack of info or help stopping them. For me the vast majority of people I know who stopped felt confident breastfeeding, they just hated it

@Somethingsnappy

While *@FuckeryOmbudsman* makes a valid point, I do sometimes wonder how these figures would compare to baby deaths worldwide if formula did not exist or was not available. Luckily, we can only speculate about this.

That’s true but it’s a null and void and a bit obtuse really isn’t it as formula isn’t going anywhere. Given that 90%plus of mothers use it beyond six months if not way way sooner.

Meanwhile The WHO estimate that globally 800,000 children could be saved every year if they were breastfed 0-23 months as it the optimum.

What makes people angry is that in countries where breastfeeding is absolutely safer and life saving, formula manufacturers were allow to propagandise and erode breastfeeding with tragic consequences. It is in this context that I absolutely believe the concept of choice via cynical manipulation of western female bodily autonomy to increase profit margins was literally at the cost of babies’ lives

Enterobacter Sakazakii and Salmonella can both be found in formula, so unfortunately it's not just dirty water. Belgium seems to be the worst country for contaminated formula, either that or they're the only country that doesn't cover it up.

@shesgonebatshitagain, I agree entirely, but I don't think it is 'obtuse' to consider the alternative in a thread of this nature.

@IsoBordem

Not trying to be goady. Guess I was just thinking about it as I caught up with some friends and they were shocked that I was using formula. I think there is such a negative stigma about it that I actually felt embarrassed and like I failed. But that is just silly. It’s fantastic that formula is there for those who need it and there shouldn’t be a negative stigma about using it.

Don't feel embarrassed, breastfeeding is very hard and lots of mums have problems. In some areas, breastfeeding is the norm and it can feel uncomfortable if you aren't (generally in middle class areas where a lot of first time mums have done NCT courses where they are very pro-breastfeeding, they are also very pro-natural birth and you can feel the same if you've had c-sections and assisted deliveries). That changes by six months when a lot of mums are switching to formula and stressing about bottle refusal. The pendulum swings the other way and the conversation changes to "are you still breastfeeding?". Honestly, you can't win sometimes, whatever you do.

I also think formula is amazing. I agree it shouldn't be marketed by large companies who are making a fortune from it, with an awful track record in the developing world.

My babies would not have thrived without it, both had failure to thrive. I mixed fed and it was great for us, the babies thrived and I was able to get a break and able to breastfeed for longer. Everyone is different and for some breastfeeding works, some formula feed and many women use a combination of both.

@Winnietp

Or course it’s great. I don’t think it does anyone any favours to have a debate about that.

I do think it’s considered too normal unfortunately. As even the NHS website says that breastfeeding decreases the risk of x y z, whereas formula actually increases the risk. Breastfeeding should be the baseline.

I have a friend who insisted that breastfeeding beyond 6 weeks has no health benefits, basically because she didn’t do any longer with her daughter and was told that by the midwife (who was probably trying to help her feel better). She actually tried to make me feel bad and I had to keep quiet to save her feelings- I breastfed for 14 months which I’m incredibly proud of and I know DD has benefitted hugely because of it.

Sorry but here we have another. Because you were made to feel bad about breastfeeding you decide to come onto a formula feeding thread to state the wonders of breastfeeding?

Balls. It should most certainly not be the baseline. Women out there wreck themselves trying to feed because they feel like they have to, because professionals can't give the permission they need to stop. And the fact remains there are women who don't want to breastfeed.

I have a lack of mammary glands and one of my daughters is an assault survivor. Telling us the risksof formula should be equal to telling the risks to a mother who simply doesn't want to. It doesn't help anyone. It makes everyone around feel like shit and for what outcome? That some mothers might raise the breastfeeding stat because they feel forced or scared to feed this way?

Yes I'm passionate about this subject because 'more robust breastfeeding help' normally equates to a woman being browbeaten into a choice she doesn't want. Having to watch the same happen to my daughter is fucking horrendous.

[quote Somethingsnappy]@shesgonebatshitagain, I agree entirely, but I don't think it is 'obtuse' to consider the alternative in a thread of this nature.[/quote]
The stable door has opened and the horse has bolted so to speak though so really it is
We are never going to not have infant formula

[quote Sandcastles55]@FuckeryOmbudsman your claim is absolutely correct, as anyone who takes an interest in the regulation and history of formula companies would know.

Formula is great when made in perfect conditions. Formula used in refugee camps is lethal. Companies target poorer regions, diminish women’s milk supplies by state-supported presence of formula companies in hospitals (wet nurses, supplementing babies etc), then send these women and babies off home to make formula in dirty environments. All with the belief that their milk wasn’t enough and perpetuating that to the next generation. Diarrhoea is one of the biggest causes of infant mortality in poorer countries - the cause? Dirty water to make formula. They are absolutely corrupt companies and have killed millions of babies.

Please educate yourselves before making sweeping comments or celebrating the likes of Nestle and Danone. We’re all hugely blessed to live in a country where companies can peddle their goods without the huge risk of them killing your child. Please let’s not make a thread celebrating these companies.[/quote]
Allll of this.

These products are very important. They have saved countless lives including that of my son. Let's try to make clean water universally accessible not degrade the availability of this vital product.