DD has never mixed with another child :(

[youremywonderwall]

DD is 8 months old.

She was born just before lockdown.

I feel really sad that she’s never played or mixed in close contact with another baby her age.

I don’t have any friends that have children and her cousins are all much older than her (10+) and of course we’ve all been distancing.

I have a lovely group of antenatal friends but we all made the decision to distance our babies when we met up(which at the minute we can’t do as there are 8 of us)

We go to a regular baby music class so she gets to see other babies but she’s never actually gotten close.

I worry about how this might affect her immune system, not mixing and picking up bugs from other babies.

She’s registered at a nursery but won’t be staring until March 2021 when I go back to work.

How much is this going to affect her? :(

You asked for a source, I gave you source. I don't know what you expect me to do - write it all out for you? It's up to you if read it or not. What I'm saying - that children need interaction with other children, even from a very young age - isn't at all controversial so I'm genuinely baffled at the 'prove it' bollocks. Surely you're at least somewhat aware of how child development works?

You said there is "very very strong evidence base showing that children that have early interaction, stimulation and learning, with other children, have better outcomes" and you implied the evidence of that is so ubiquitous that someone even asking for evidence of it is a shock to you. But then the only "evidence" you supplied said literally nothing about early interaction, stimulation and learning between children leading to better outcomes. I'm talking about babies interacting with other babies, as per the topic of this thread.

And I don't know why you're so angry/hostile/condescending. Totally unnecessary. If you don't know a lot about a topic and want to know more, then asking someone for the source of their information is good practice. It would be stupid to go around believing everything random strangers say online just because they sound very sure of themselves. I have a young baby who has had almost no interaction with otherbabies due to the pandemic, so I want to know more because your assertions are quite worrying to someone in that situation.

OP I am in a similar situation and I'm worried about it too. It's really tough.

DS is 5 months. Born in lockdown and living in an area where we don't know many people. I was hoping to meet some other mums and babies at local groups but they are all closed. I've tried some online groups but they're not really the same. DS going to nursery April 2021 when he will be 1.

I have been meeting mums and babies from antenatal class in the park in 2s and 3s. Perhaps you could try that? It doesn't necessarily need all of you there.

I've also been taking DS out every day and we interact with others. We were in a cafe today and there was another mum and baby and the babies were smiling at each other. It was super cute and hopefully some valuable interaction. You can't plan things like that but they do happen if you get out and about.

Carbuncle - I agree that this must be having an impact on DS (and on me too actually). As a psychologist, do you have any suggestions for things we could be doing to help mitigate that impact?

I think it's had a big impact on me as a first time mum, not being able to get out and do things

DS seems happy enough and I make a point to take him to the door for deliveries etc and post and everyone says hi to him.

Sometimes we watch the buses from the front door (live on a road) and people walking by with will wave and say hello, as do other children

I also take him to the play area when in the park even though they don't have baby swings so he can watch the other children

I haven't found success with online groups and my antenatal classes were in a different county as we moved so we have been really limited

I have tried to talk to other mums and babies but I've found people to be a bit stand offish probably because of all the social distancing etc

I was really worried about it but I'm trying not to as there's not much I can do about it at the moment

My baby is 5 months. He hasn’t met any other babies as there aren’t any really near us. Covid has stopped any group activities, but even those would have been a 45-60min drive away so wouldn’t have been a regular activity.

He seems fine so far. Just because he isn’t playing with babies, doesn’t mean he has no interaction with anyone and is living in silence.

Children don't play with others until much older- more like 3 years old. Until then they might play side by side but playing with an adult is perfectly fine and appropriate

Even if your baby had a sibling they'd spend a lot of time watching them rather than actually playing with them iyswim. Going to nursery next year at just over one sounds perfect developmentally. Try not to worry.

@TheDailyCarbuncle, I don’t think there are no benefits, but I do think far more things feed into it. For example, parents who do not attend groups, but also do not engage with baby; parents who struggle to find free groups and can not afford to go etc; parents who lead chaotic lives and so do not attend groups. I think that it’s unnecessary to come across so strongly. If I’d read that when my ds was sick, I would have felt even more blooming awful and useless because I couldn’t attend groups ( And I was new to area, no friends with babies, no family locally, so no baby friends close by). Sometimes life limits you, the best thing to do is focus on what will help - engaging with baby, giving social contact with peers when possible etc. Yes, it’s not ideal, but big life issues (like a pandemic, health issues, bereavement etc) sometimes take you out of that situation.

My situation was in 2015, so prior to pandemic. I had different responses from different professionals regarding social effect on child, but then they often ignored the medical side that’s quite traumatic for a young child. I worked hard at engaging with ds, encouraging sharing, lots of copy cat games, letting him explore my face with his hands as babies do and all sorts like that - I also did find peers when possible later - but it has not created child unable to associate, socialise or empathise with peers. I know it’s your speciality, but I think positive suggestions on what’s good to do in the situation might be better than a flat out ‘it’s terrible, never be overlooked before covid’.

At her age its no problem although must be hard for you to not be able to meet other mums! Her social development is still coming from close relationships with care givers so lots of time at home has probably been great for her. As she gets more towards 2 then she'll need interaction with other kids her own age but I'm sure they'll be options for that.

You could always take her to a swimming class though if you want to interact with other mums.

When we say 'babies should be around other babies' do we mean literal "goo goo ga ga" babies? My 4 year old has done more for my 9 month old's development than another baby could imo. My baby was born before lockdown but never saw any babies before lockdown (and we've not even met with family). I'm unsure what I'm supposed to be worried about if he's not around babies tbh.

DS1 didn't care about other kids until he was a toddler, but was more interested in his much older first cousins (he attached himself to one who is 12 years older actually).

OP your concerns aren’t at all unreasonable but I wouldn’t catastrophise about this; while the optimal situation may well be exposure to plenty of other babies in different social situations, there’s very little that’s optimal about the current situation, and I think at only 8 months it is more important that your DD has a secure and loving bond with you, lots of stimulating sensory play, plenty of parent-child communication in the form of stories/songs/funny face/silly noise games/chatting while you’re out and about etc, and as much contact as possible with other family members. You are clearly a loving, engaged parent and in all likelihood your DD will be absolutely fine. The germ thing would occur to me too (when DD was tiny we made a point of hanging out with DM’s dogs to build up her immune system!), but providing you’re not being too obsessive about hygiene and your DD is out and about with you I can’t see any particular issues there.

The knock-on effect of restrictions on children is being totally ignored and downplayed. Next year there'll be endless hand-wringing articles about it, saying it wasn't foreseen, it's a terrible tragedy etc. It's so fucking predictable.

I do however agree with this. As a former teacher with a Master’s in a subject allied to child development/psychology, I’m becoming increasingly alarmed about the long-term impact of Covid restrictions on young children (primarily toddlers upwards) and suspect that the true cost of this will only become evident once these children enter the education system. There will almost undoubtedly be many more children who are poorly socialised and have diminished speech and language skills as result of social isolation, mask-wearing, lack of access to community facilities like libraries, and stressed out, time-poor parents. Over and above the lack of play opportunities I’d be concerned about how these children are in many cases not being properly socialised through small everyday interactions with others in shops, libraries, parks, on public transport etc - they’re just not seeing how the (normal) world works in the same way as previous cohorts.

While your DD and my own older toddler DD will in all likelihood emerge unscathed from all this - as engaged, educated, well-resourced parents we can and will take efforts to mitigate the worst effects of lockdown - many, many other children won’t be as lucky. Sadly one of the many things this pandemic is doing is entrenching our society’s already considerable social and educational inequalities, and so far there’s been very little recognition of this (with most of the focus being on more tangible, measurable things such as the economy).

@TempsPerdu

OP your concerns aren’t at all unreasonable but I wouldn’t catastrophise about this; while the optimal situation may well be exposure to plenty of other babies in different social situations, there’s very little that’s optimal about the current situation, and I think at only 8 months it is more important that your DD has a secure and loving bond with you, lots of stimulating sensory play, plenty of parent-child communication in the form of stories/songs/funny face/silly noise games/chatting while you’re out and about etc, and as much contact as possible with other family members. You are clearly a loving, engaged parent and in all likelihood your DD will be absolutely fine. The germ thing would occur to me too (when DD was tiny we made a point of hanging out with DM’s dogs to build up her immune system!), but providing you’re not being too obsessive about hygiene and your DD is out and about with you I can’t see any particular issues there.

The knock-on effect of restrictions on children is being totally ignored and downplayed. Next year there'll be endless hand-wringing articles about it, saying it wasn't foreseen, it's a terrible tragedy etc. It's so fucking predictable.

I do however agree with this. As a former teacher with a Master’s in a subject allied to child development/psychology, I’m becoming increasingly alarmed about the long-term impact of Covid restrictions on young children (primarily toddlers upwards) and suspect that the true cost of this will only become evident once these children enter the education system. There will almost undoubtedly be many more children who are poorly socialised and have diminished speech and language skills as result of social isolation, mask-wearing, lack of access to community facilities like libraries, and stressed out, time-poor parents. Over and above the lack of play opportunities I’d be concerned about how these children are in many cases not being properly socialised through small everyday interactions with others in shops, libraries, parks, on public transport etc - they’re just not seeing how the (normal) world works in the same way as previous cohorts.

While your DD and my own older toddler DD will in all likelihood emerge unscathed from all this - as engaged, educated, well-resourced parents we can and will take efforts to mitigate the worst effects of lockdown - many, many other children won’t be as lucky. Sadly one of the many things this pandemic is doing is entrenching our society’s already considerable social and educational inequalities, and so far there’s been very little recognition of this (with most of the focus being on more tangible, measurable things such as the economy).

I agree with every word, @TempsPerdu, you've said it far better than I did!

@NewMumOrpington

OP I am in a similar situation and I'm worried about it too. It's really tough.

DS is 5 months. Born in lockdown and living in an area where we don't know many people. I was hoping to meet some other mums and babies at local groups but they are all closed. I've tried some online groups but they're not really the same. DS going to nursery April 2021 when he will be 1.

I have been meeting mums and babies from antenatal class in the park in 2s and 3s. Perhaps you could try that? It doesn't necessarily need all of you there.

I've also been taking DS out every day and we interact with others. We were in a cafe today and there was another mum and baby and the babies were smiling at each other. It was super cute and hopefully some valuable interaction. You can't plan things like that but they do happen if you get out and about.

Carbuncle - I agree that this must be having an impact on DS (and on me too actually). As a psychologist, do you have any suggestions for things we could be doing to help mitigate that impact?

The only thing you can do is to keep doing what you're doing I think - carry on meeting other mums as much as you can.

You're probably doing all the other important things - talk plenty to him, play with him by doing things like handing him toys and taking them back off him, read him little books, help him to move around etc etc. All that is very valuable.

Also I would say go easy on yourself and make sure you're getting time to yourself away from your DS if at all possible. Baby groups do a lot to take the pressure off mums and give the day a bit of variety - without activities to break up the days there's a danger you'll get really bogged down and tired. It's a lot of pressure to have to be the one to do all the interaction and stimulation - make sure you get breaks and proper rest.

An 8 month old does not get anything from being near other babies. Those gatherings are for the parents. That doesn’t mean there isn’t value for the parents, but really your baby will be fine with lots of attention from you.

I do think that a lot of people underestimate the enjoyment that some (maybe not all) babies and toddlers get out of the company of their peers. My DD made her first friend when she was around 18 months old. Sure, they only played in parallel, but they used to spontaneously hug and walk holding hands and DD would get very excited whenever she heard his name. She still adores him even though they had limited contact once they started different preschools. I also saw two six month-old babies in the playground the other day who were being held so they could make eye contact and who were laughing and making sounds at each other/ trying to touch each other’s faces. So I think all the “kids only care about Mummy until they’re at least three” stuff gets overplayed.

But, whilst contact with other babies can be a lot of fun, the lack of it isn’t going to do any harm at eight months!

Yes of course it’s lovely if babies and toddlers can be around other babies and toddlers.

That doesn’t mean op’s child of 8 months is going to be harmed in any way by not having been in close proximity with other babies.

It’s simply not worth any angst.