To think a second lockdown is right?

[Plentyofshit]

I don’t think we are comparable to Sweden. A few months ago Europe thought Sweden had got it wrong, now people think they’ve got it right. We may change our minds again about Sweden in a few months time, what if their infection rate rises again?
Sweden are culturally and geographically very different to the UK. Sweden had no lockdown, but guidelines were in place and adhered to.

I think we are comparable to Spain. Their situation proves the lag effect, and their death rate is now rising.
This is just the start, where will we be next March?
For every 1 death, 20 more need hospitalisation. How will our NHS cope?
So should the priority be - the deaths/serious complications/NHS crisis for tens of thousands of people - or the damage to our jobs and economy.
Labour support a second lockdown.

A second lockdown would be protecting those who are vulnerable, who have health issues, old and young that might not survive if they get COVID-19.

Everyday I can go out and see idiots with masks on their chin, under their nose or in COVID-19 deniers nothing at all.

Shup up, mask up, and grow the fuck up.

Of course they mustn’t charge for tests!

They should try to find a way to prevent people getting the nhs ones just to go on hols though- not sure how? Perhaps track anyone who has announced they have symptoms to make sure they are isolating until they’ve had the negative, and therefore discourage people from lying about this, and require proof of those who have “been advised to” by local authorities and the like.

Shut up, mask up, and grow the fuck up.

I agree with this though!

My understanding is - from watching Keir on Andrew Marr - they support the guidelines, they DON’T support the shambles that has lead to the possibility of further lockdown. There’s a clear distinction.

@QuentinInQuarantino That’s very interesting. Thank you - is there any talk of a national lockdown in Spain? Is it being controlled by local lockdowns? Are people working together or unsupportive of your government?

[quote NC4NW123]@SantaClaritaDiet start charging for tests?!? Wow this is the single worst comment I’ve read!! Spoken from a massive position of privilege obviously. Some people can not afford them!! How about parents with kids who need to get tested every month or so because you know.. children do get coughs,, and it is a rule of the school?? What about the poor people who have lost their jobs!! Disgusting comment. Face coverings should also have been made free the day they became mandatory.[/quote]
and where do you think test come from exactly? Magically from some fairy factory?

Instead of ruining what is left of the NHS, charging for tests would be a start. What is disgusting is people all happy and jolly about their "free" test (as difficult as they are to book these days) completely oblivious of the loss that will have to be covered from somewhere else.

It's not 3 weeks you will have to wait for a GP any more, it's not 6 months + you will have to wait for emergency surgery.

You talk about privilege? You clearly speak from a position of health privilege and a very naive one. I don't wish you any bad, but it's likely you and your family will need some medical help at some point.

Trust the tories to give away free test and ruin the economy a bit further. It's about time they wake up.

@SantaClaritaDiet the cost of testing isn’t coming out of the NHS budget but rather the Public Health budget. I believe.

The NHS was in a desperate situation before the pandemic, things will be catastrophic. Free tests is ridiculous.

@SantaClaritaDiet refer to earlier comment.

@SantaClaritaDiet I see your point actually, like prescription charges. I’m happy to pay for my medication - children or the vulnerable should not.

If anything, the hospitals should get back to normal quicker, too many health problems have been ignored or left untreated for no good reason.

Yep, definitely agree with this. It's like Covid is being used as an excuse to stop providing any other medical care or treatment. And in areas where there aren't many cases, for them to use Covid as an excuse - it's disgusting. It's equally disgusting that there's no cry of outrage from the people who work for the NHS that they've pretty much abandoned people.
Boris can fuck right off with his "human chain around the NHS."
What's the point in protecting it if it isn't there when you need it for anything non-Covid related?

All this talk of "protecting the vulnerable" makes me sick when no-one is outraged about the fact the government have used the crisis as an excuse to abandon sick and disabled people in regards to their support systems and home carers. Ditto with children with special needs. Protecting the vulnerable they ain't.

No no no. No more lockdowns, my mental health won't cope. I dont even know if I can do another six months...

No to lockdown

Need to strike balance which is pretty much where we are

Jesus wept, no, 'we' don't need another fucking lockdown.

So to avoid a second lockdown what should we do? Masks, distance, sanitise, rule of 6, curfew at 10pm? We should be in agreement here, however much we hate it?

@SantaClaritaDiet ok and what do you propose for those who can’t afford them? Who literally cannot get a test, or actually those who just won’t WANT to get tested. Who WANTS to spend their spare money on masks and tests. No one. No one would do it. Keeping people in jobs and no lockdown is how you protect the NHS. Keeping people in work paying TAXES. Testing has nothing to do with it. My health and my families also has nothing to do with you. I’m forever great full for the NHS but charging for testing is wrong in so many levels. No one asked for this virus. Paying for prescriptions is different, if you need it, you must pay for it. It doesn’t affect anyone else if you don’t!

Time-limited lockdown (circuit break) would be more manageable, perhaps. The most difficult part of the national lockdown was not knowing when it would end. I understand that even a circuit break lockdown would be damaging, but I do wonder whether ripping the plaster off quickly would have greater benefits than disadvantages.

10pm curfews is merely tinkering at the edges and delaying the inevitable.

No to a lockdown
They don’t work
What happens when it’s lifted - increasing cases
Dire economic collapse, recession, job losses
Huge impact to other illnesses and health
We need to live with this
How often and how frequent should we lockdown? Once a month, a month out of 3 ? What ? Forever ?

I’m Really angry aBout all the impacts to freedoms , things that are given away without even parliamentary debate Or vote based on flawed science and wgat if modelling that could be as accurate god knows what. We should all be concerned about this !

Also seeing as this government is outsourcing the absolutely failed Test and Trace system to their millionare mates company, who have proven they couldn't run a bath.
Masks should be provided for free to the public by this embarrassment a government

[quote Plentyofshit]@QuentinInQuarantino That’s very interesting. Thank you - is there any talk of a national lockdown in Spain? Is it being controlled by local lockdowns? Are people working together or unsupportive of your government?[/quote]
There was a massive rumor that there would be a national lockdown on 18th September but it came and went with nothing. The govt had to deny it! It reminds me of the current run ours of a October half term lockdown in Britain!

I'm a big fan of Sanchez (I think because he is saintly compared to Johnson so I'm like "be careful what you wish for" to my Spanish friends!) but there has of course been a lot of complaints. People are angry about the return to schools (very similar to the UK).

In Madrid, they've implemented a local lockdown in those districts that have a very high case number (more than 100 cases per 100k people). It is problematic because these areas are poor we areas populated by immigrants and young workers in high rises who have spread the disease due to close living and needing to commute on tubes to Madrid centre. So they have locked the people in the district except for work and school, and this has led to big cries and accusations of racism and creating ghettos and blaming immigrants.

But there is no appetite for another lockdown because we were so financially fucked!

The self employed got nothing.
There are many seasonal workers who rely on working April - October who got no work nor furlough pay.

Sorry I forgot to say it's very much controlled by local administrations much like Scotland, NI etc. the main lockdown was central govt but now each region is in charge of implementing what the government suggests.

@QuentinInQuarantino This is so interesting! Thank you. So when your country sees our response, do they think we are the laughing stock of Europe? Where have we got it wrong? Or are we broadly in line with the Spanish response?

No no not at all! Spanish media is broadly sympathetic to the UK and the death levels. The only negative thing I've seen reported on the UK was coverage of Dominic Cummings trips up north breaking the rules and they were quite angry about the quarantine against Spanish travel because it had a very bad impact on the hospitality industry with so many last minute cancellations.

Our outbreaks are mostly in wealthier, urban places where there is a lot of industry and work so it seems related more to returning to work than to tourism and going on holiday. (On mumsnet there is a lot of discussion about going on holiday causing spread) Schools have only been open 2 weeks so it's early to say how that will go.

We never had a first lockdown. Just a set of restrictions that I don't want to see repeated.

I want to see a proper testing regime, and whatever rules are put in place, proper enforcement, and some payments to those required to self-isolate. Early closure of pubs I support, I would have fast food places be takeaway only, and let us be straight about things now and have no pubs open on Christmas Eve, Christmas Day or New Years Eve.

No, I wouldn't support another lockdown like the last. The implications would be far too high.

It's a balancing act between health and the economy. You can't swing too much one way on either side.