The government have fucked up the re-opening of schools

[noblegiraffe]

They have, haven't they?

Back in June their five tests for reopening schools were:

First we must protect the NHS’s ability to cope, and be sure that it can continue to provide critical care and specialist treatment right across the whole of the United Kingdom.

Second, we need to see daily death rates from coronavirus coming down.

Third, we need to have reliable data that shows the rate of infection is decreasing to manageable levels.

Four, we need to be confident that testing capacity and PPE is being managed, with supply able to meet, not just today’s demand, but future demand.

And fifth, and perhaps most crucially, we need to be confident that any changes we do make will not risk a second peak of infections.

I'm pretty sure I know the reason for not reminding people of those five tests this time round, but particularly test 4 - capacity within the testing system.

I was listening to the radio today about how the lack of testing is damaging the NHS's capacity to reopen services as nurses with symptoms cannot get tests and therefore cannot return to work. The same goes for schools - if teachers cannot get tests, either for themselves or for family members with symptoms, then they cannot go to work. This has been the case even with priority referrals.

There also seems to be utter chaos around who gets sent home when there is a positive test. Some schools are sending home a year group, others close contacts. Teachers often have no idea if they'll be sent home if one of their pupils tests positive.

But surely the government are tracking cases in schools carefully? No, it turns out they're not even storing that data. schoolsweek.co.uk/its-official-dfe-doesnt-know-how-many-schools-have-covid-cases

And a survey suggests that covid protection measures in some schools are poor. www.tes.com/news/third-teachers-lack-soap-and-water-school

So with an abysmal test and trace system, less than adequate measures to prevent the spread, and a department that isn't on top of its brief we can expect more disruption to come.

Even if your own kids' school is fine so far, parents really shouldn't be happy with this state of affairs, particularly the lack of testing capacity that will mean children will be out of school or missing a teacher unnecessarily.

YABU: The government have done a sterling job
YANBU: The government have not done a sterling job

@MarshaBradyo

Yes I said as an employer we have done that but I it’s not a swab test but 95% is a good indicator and I know a lot of other companies who are doing temp tests every day as well .

But for members of the public the private tests are very expensive.

@MarshaBradyo

Anyone can buy a test privately can’t they?

They can but these private tests are surely taking up some of the limit capacity.

Rather than try to shift the blame to the general public being tested when they "don't need to be", the Government could just ban private testing and free up all of that capacity for public testing.

But then I suppose... you know... money...

They are expensive but are people saying the option shouldn’t be there?

I dint think the private tests are through nhs . Ours are not . They are mostly private clinics ?

Ok so ban private testing. Hmm don’t we want cases lower if people want to pay is it so bad

I'm not sure how accurate this map of schools with cases is, but it's something.

The two schools in Norfolk for example:

Status: Open. 1 person isolating.

Status: Contacts/clean/school closed 1 day.

@Iamnotthe1

I don’t think it’s that simple . A lot of the private tests do not meet all the required criteria. And are not all certified .

I don’t really understand why people are getting worked up about case numbers rising - hospitalisations and deaths are not. We’re probably finding out about a lot more cases now that more people in the community are being tested because of mild symptoms/contact with other cases compared to only serious cases being tested in hospitals earlier on. Realistically, there were probably loads of cases months ago too, we just didn’t know about them.

@MarshaBradyo

They are expensive but are people saying the option shouldn’t be there?

I can't speak for others but I'm saying that the Government is choosing to lie about the capacity, availability and usage of the testing system to cover up their own incompetence. I'm also saying that this is exposed as a lie as soon as you look at the numbers, private testing, the outsourcing of our tests to other countries, etc.

I'm saying that if there aren't enough tests or enough capacity to process them, it's entirely the fault of the Government and the choices that they have made rather than the fault of the general public.

@cantkeepawayforever well given this govt can't organise a piss up in a brewery it is too late for it to work now, you're right. They will be playing catch up the whole winter.

If they had given it more than 10 minutes' thought it could have been possible though.

I'm pretty sure everyone with school aged children predicted this spike months ago. Certainly every parent I've spoken to over the summer did.

The govt has fucked this up SO spectacularly. Randox the testers were appointed in the spring. They've surely had the time and foresight to know this was coming?!

@bumbleymummy

I don’t really understand why people are getting worked up about case numbers rising - hospitalisations and deaths are not. We’re probably finding out about a lot more cases now that more people in the community are being tested because of mild symptoms/contact with other cases compared to only serious cases being tested in hospitals earlier on. Realistically, there were probably loads of cases months ago too, we just didn’t know about them.

Hospitalisations are starting to go up, as are numbers on a ventilator.

Deaths are not rising much yet.

Whilst I would wish it were not the case, nothing about the virus has changed.

Yanbu, it's absolute chaos. Dd1 sent home today to isolate for 2 weeks as she may have been in contact with covid. Dd2 still expected to be in school. I've posted a thread earlier as I was unsure as to how I would get one to school when the other has to isolate. No provision for key workers, the effect on working parents is going to be massive over the next few months. I'm seriously considering whether it's worth me working at all, it all so stressful.

According to the chart here, we have carried out more tests than most countries;

UK 20,292,025
Germany 13,436,301
Spain 10,756,835
France 10,000,000

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

It's a shit show. DS's school has had 3 confirmed cases already. Then DS started with a temperature last night. Pretty sure it's a cold as he's got a snotty nose too but it would be ridiculous to carry on regardless. After several failed attempts we managed to get him a test, I know we were incredibly lucky to get one with other stories I've heard of the issues getting tests.

Levels are shootinging higher and higher in our area, a fourfold increase in just 3 weeks. Schools are nowhere close to 'covid secure' (otherwise kids wouldn't be catching colds either), so many kids self isolating already that this is not giving any consistency in their education anyway.

The sooner they start the blended learning for secondaries, stop threatening fines, underwrite people's income who need to self isolate and sort out the test and trace debacle the better.

My anxiety levels are getting higher and higher.

God knows how the school staff are coping, they all deserve medals.

It's OK everyone!!! Matt Hancock says it should all be sorted...in a few weeks.

@RepeatSwan no, it probably hasn’t changed much. We just know more about it and are testing more so we know it isn’t as deadly as originally feared. We know that the vast majority of cases are mild or asymptomatic and we know who the more at risk groups are. We also have a better idea of how to treat the more complicated cases.

Honestly, I think we need to stop obsessing over numbers and just back to living our lives. If the media reported every flu case and all the hospitilisations and deaths every flu season on a day to day basis people’s anxiety would be through the roof too. It isn’t helping things at all.

When cases rise around here, DS is not going to school. His school shouldn't waste time and resources trying to threaten me, I know what I'm doing and I've already made my intentions clear to the Head. It's all crystal clear, people cannot get tests and we are losing control over this virus. I'm not waiting around for covid to enter my house if I can act and avoid it. Why are parents still being pushed to deregister, or being threatened with welfare/legal action? Delusional, that's our gov.

@bumbleymummy Honestly, I think we need to stop obsessing over numbers and just back to living our lives.

I think everyone wants to get back to living their lives - but that's pretty fucking difficult when every time a child in your household brings back a temperature or cough you have to go through the rigmarole of trying to book a test when you can't, attend the test sometimes 75 miles away, and wait for results that are no longer coming back in 24 hours.

There are people on here who've been waiting several days between first symptoms and results. Lots who've given up trying to get a test and then forced to isolate whole household for 2 weeks.

People are obsessing over the numbers BECAUSE they can't get back to living their lives.

It's a steaming pile of horse shit.

Remember when Jenny Harries said that the UK was an international exemplar in preparedness?

Honestly, I think we need to stop obsessing over numbers and just back to living our lives.

Are your kids really young or so smart that they can easily be homeschooled?
I have 2 kids in exam years- the one doing A-levels needs to know A-level material for her degree.

@Unsure33

They said children were not at risk of serious symptoms . And at one stage there was no evidence that they were passing it on to adults at a high rate .

Even in the first school that had cases was it not 17 teachers were positive to 3 students?

So that sounds like a staff room problem or something similar and that’s the problem with the media . They drop a bomb and.then disappear not actually interested in following up the facts . So people then jump to conclusions .

They concentrate on the negative . Not the fact that oxford hospital is extending a trial on another drug that’s proving to be quite effective after all who wants good news .?

The issue with that though is that children don’t seem to show the same symptoms. So they don’t get tested. The adults do show symptoms, so they do get tested. So then you look at it and say “Only three children were positive compared to 17 adults, so it’s the staff room that’s the issue.”. Except it doesn’t account for the fact that it is entirely possible that children are infected, and passing it on, but not affected, so they don’t receive a test.

For example, there has recently been some evidence to say that children show sickness bug type symptoms rather than a cough and cold. We didn’t know this for ages. (www.theguardian.com/science/2020/sep/07/fatigue-and-fever-most-common-covid-symptoms-in-children-study).
So we haven’t been testing kids with ‘tummy bugs.’ Only three positives doesn’t mean only three kids had it. It’s just means only three kids showed the right symptoms, got tested and had it. It is entirely possible that there were a lot more children who were asymptomatic or had the ‘wrong’ symptoms.