To ask if there's something I'm missing about the allegedly "controversial" Diversity performance

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

Diversity performed on Britain's Got Talent, a performance which incorporated a message about BLM. Their performance, as usual, was incredible and sent out some great messages. The video is below.

It's had 10,000 complaints. Why?! am I missing something? Did someone's nipple pop out or something? What is the basis of people's complaints? The only reason I can think is that some people (probably because they're part of the problem) don't like it when others point out that there's racism in the world? Boo hoo to them

I am pro BLM, pro choice and pro gay marriage. I read the papers and stay informed on these issues.

Yet your sole contribution to the discussion is to shout down black people when they use a platform to draw attention to racism.

We don't believe you. We see you.

@noblegiraffe
I'll need to go and watch that again as I can't remember it very well. I do remember the NHS part though, and personally I cringed at that.

I agree it’s fine to question BLM the activist group, it’s fine to question any activist group and BLM have some questionable aims certainly.

But Black Lives Matter isn’t just the group, it’s a slogan and movement that has caused a lot of awareness recently and when most people say it, or put it on their twitter profile or make a celeb video about it etc, they aren’t specifically referencing the campaign group, but the whole movement and the general sentiment.

When I see a BLM-inspired dance routine I don’t think “they want to dismantle the police, get that political campaign group off my telly” - it’s obviously not the motivation behind it at all.

And this is the heart of the controversy. YOU may not associate the BGT dance routine with what are, as you rightly say, the “questionable aims” of the BLM activist movement, but other people do. Are they right? Are you? You saw one intention, others saw something else. That doesn’t mean they’re racist but then again, who knows?

It’s a tribute to the brilliance and effectiveness of the BLM slogan and the marketing machine of the movement that nobody ever quite knows what it is we’re talking about, but anyone at any point can be accused of racism for saying they disagree with any aspect of the way the message is disseminated.

@thedancingbear

I mean you can throw around vaguely ominous melodramatic blanket statements all you like really, it doesn't change my views.

I'm not interested in having politics injected into mainstream entertainment, because political views are subjective and I dont feel one perspective should be given more of a platform than any other.

So you don't think an anti-racism group should have more of a platform than, say, some white supremacists?

if you really think what you've said in your post, then you are part of the problem, massively. You are wilfully upholding a racist status quo.

I mean you can throw around vaguely ominous melodramatic blanket statements all you like really, it doesn't change my views.

I don't think your views are capable of change to be honest. I think you are a lost cause.

You keep pissing and moaning to ITV about a fucking dance. Others among us will carry on trying to prove things.

*improve things

So now we're suggesting that Diversity had a secret agenda behind their actual stated message? That their routine that said that the world is a better place without racism was actually a code for 'defund the police'?

I thought it was incredible.
Really powerful and emotive.
I can't understand what was so offensive it warranted 10000 complaints.

Oh my goodness. This thread. I'm reading it and I'm getting flashbacks to the Newsnight report in the week about the militias in the US. BLM seems to be upturning quite a few rocks and it's depressing to see what is scuttling out from under them.

YOU may not associate the BGT dance routine with what are, as you rightly say, the “questionable aims” of the BLM activist movement, but other people do

Why don’t you base this on the facts of the performance? If they burned an effigy of a police officer and had a fuck da police banner I see your point perhaps. But they didn’t.

You are basically conflating what they did perform with what you think BLM stands for. Not what they actually performed or did.

This is why it is racist. Your ideas and concerns about the political BLM movement bother you enough that even a reference in dance to the movement or a show of unity and raising awareness means that you automatically see something that isn’t even there. You are wildly exaggerating what happened

In that case Jilly, I can only hope that you stick to saying them from behind the safety of a computer screen an anonymous forum and not in real life

Saying anything “in real life” about this is indeed extremely difficult. I will keep doing so to the best of my ability however because in this country we still believe that even if we don’t agree with what people have to say and no matter how offended we may be, they still have a right to say it. Even those comments we perceive to not be “good”.

Jillyhilly In which case, just exactly what is your problem with the Diversity performance?

You are basically conflating what they did perform with what you think BLM stands for. Not what they actually performed or did.

No, I am explaining that the people who complained may have associated the dance routine with some of the questionable things BLM stand for, as stated on BLM’s website. Whether or not they were “right” to make that association I do not know. Whether or not each and every one of those individuals are racist I also do not know. YOUR knickers are in a twist because YOU are seeing something that isn’t there.

Saying anything “in real life” about this is indeed extremely difficult. I will keep doing so to the best of my ability however because in this country we still believe that even if we don’t agree with what people have to say and no matter how offended we may be, they still have a right to say it.

This is fucking hilarious. No-one is saying that you cannot spout your racist claptrap. However you seem to think that you somehow have a right not to be called out on it, which I am afraid is not the case.

At the same time, you are trying to get some black people taken off the telly for trying to promote an anti-racist message.

The only person trying to shut down free speech is you.

Whether or not each and every one of those individuals are racist I also do not know.

Take a wild guess.

BLM seems to be upturning quite a few rocks and it's depressing to see what is scuttling out from under them.

Depressing, yes, but also quite useful and instructive I think. It is good that racist arseholes are in plain sight. It makes them easier challenge and open the eyes of good people who thought the problem had gone away.

Just to point out that the BLMUK agenda is very different to the US one.

Well yeah the 10k complainants are just a helpful list of racist twats.... I will write in to complain about the complaints! And FYI it’s not a political issue it’s a moral one so bugger off you mouthbreathing bigots

I don’t think the slogan is particularly tied to the political group. I think you can say black lives matter and mean it as just that.

I think people who are trying to make the slogan inextricably linked to the group are trying to destroy its power.

Jillyhilly In which case, just exactly what is your problem with the Diversity performance?

Thank you for asking!

I watched the performance out of interest and thought that artistically it was amazing.

I also think that the BLM activist movement is problematic and political and that an assumption was being made that the audience should all agree with the aims of the BLM movement. Whether or not that is a correct assumption I don’t know, but I found it incredibly annoying. And I really don’t think the place for the message is BGT.

What I object to on this thread is the immediate assumption that anyone who complained is default racist, and that because individuals here didn’t see controversy then there wasn’t any controversy. People are different and they should be allowed to have different viewpoints about things. It’s the grouping everyone together with lazy stereotypes that I can’t stand. It is divisive identity politics bullshit of the worst possible kind. Do we even know the ethnic identities of those who complained? Do we know exactly what they were all thinking? Of course we don’t. It’s all assumptions and it all follows the narrative that if you don’t buy in to an idea 100%, you’re the enemy. That is a really dangerous proposition but you can see it playing out on this thread.

Can they be uncoupled though, noblegiraffe when it comes to action though?
If you were to donate, say, are you donating to people who want to defund the police, or those who want to set up programmes to help black working class school leavers get jobs or whatever ?
It does seem hard to figure it out there seems to be a lot of different groups under the one (self evidently true) slogan.

So you think

(i) The rights of black people to protest about racism, which is still clearly a big problem in the UK

is less important than

(ii) the right of people to draw the inference, correctly or incorrectly, that people who protest against anti-racist activists are likely to be racist themselves?

Have I got that right? If no, which bit is wrong? I'm just trying to understand where your coming from?

sorry, that was to @jillyhilly

I’d donate to a charity based on the work that they do. I didn’t see Diversity asking for donations, and their message was clearly about racism.

I wouldn’t assume that anyone holding a banner saying Black Lives Matter was a member of the organisation, or even aware of them.