AIBU to think that actually, voters don't care if politicians lie, cheat, are racist or even break the law, we'll vote for them anyway?

[KenDodd]

And politicians have realised this.
As proven in recent years.

This actually isn't a go at Tory voters, I think if the roles were reversed other voters might act exactly the same and also not care about any of the above as long as their side won. I remember reading about an election in the US a while ago were one of the two candidates had just been arrested for child sex abuse, he didn't lose any support despite this. Some of the electorate were interviewed and said better him that the other guy. I can't remember which party was which but I don't think it matters, I don't think it would have made much difference if it was the other way around.

We should demand better, it's our fault politicians lie, cheat, are racist and break the law, we let them.

I'd love to vote for an upstanding, honest, diligent MP but sadly there seems to be a shortage, let's hope it's not for much longer. Until then it's a case of try to figure out which one will do least damage.

@SheepandCow

Lots of people do care. The problem was there was a choice between shit or crap.

I know several lifelong Labour voters who reluctantly voted Tory in the last election (I'm a floating voter so less tribal). They couldn't vote Labour whilst a racist misogynist was leading it.

And Boris Johnson ISN'T a racist misogynist?

In fact on the Cons side you could argue they captured the imaginations of the less informed.

I'm a floating voter and voted tory this time. Corbyn and Johnson were equally as unattractive to me, but I felt safer having continous shit rather than radical change shit.

We know the tories are dodgy, and they seem to accept that we all know it. Labour and lib dems are equally as dodgy but have such a strong sense "we are on the right side of history" which worries me.

My tory MP has also been very helpful on a personal level, the Labour and lib dem candidates live in different constituencies!

Starmer will get my vote in the next election if its Starmer v Johnson, he seems a little more open to debate and I cojkd not vote for incompetentcy vs (what seems like so far) competency. If it's a Sunak vs Starmer election (my personal prediction) I think a lot of people will vote for smaller, radical parties that reflect their view son very particular issues. I'd probably still go with Starmer.

@contrmary

I'd rather have a racist PM who runs the country well than a liberal woke PC one who didn't know what the fuck they were doing. (I know, we've got a racist PM who doesn't know what the fuck they are doing, I'm just saying that their egregious personality is irrelevant to their ability to do the job.)

Mumsnet in a nutshell.

I'd rather have a racist PM who runs the country well

Do you think Johnson/Cummings are running the country well?

YANBU. But what's the alternative? You can only vote for people who are actually available to vote for.

We should demand better

How?

The problem is that most people are entrenched in their allegiance and would vote for a dead dog if it had the right colour ribbon on.

It's too tribal and partisan. Like football.

Staunch labour voters regard staunch Tory voters with hostility and think they'll turn into rabid baby-eating bastards if they vote conservative.

Staunch Tory voters regard staunch labour voters with equal hostility and think they'll turn into filthy communist hippies if they vote labour.

Voting the way you always have done regardless of what bastard is leading the party or what's in the manifesto is the way you end up with people like Johnson and Trump in charge. People will say they're idiots but will still vote for their party because it's what they always do.

I've always been a floating voter and I cannot fathom this attachment to certain parties that people have. Think about not just what's best for you but also best for the country, think about your preferred party's behaviour and the actions of the members at the top, think about how well your current local MP represents you, read the damn manifesto.

People won't, because it's too much like hard work. It's so much easier to vote for X because the Y party and voters are bastards.

I've always been a floating voter and I cannot fathom this attachment to certain parties that people have.

Same here. There isn't anyone I want to vote for these days though.

I don’t vote for terrible people.

So last election, I couldn’t vote.

I don’t vote for terrible people.

So last election, I couldn’t vote.

I do think we need a 'None of the above' option on the ballot paper and if None of the above wins, they rerun with new candidates. Of course to have that as a system, MPs would have to vote for it and they would never do that.

Ooh, this has got going while I mucked about writing mine! I’ll rtft of yours instead.

Instead of bitching about it, in the usual 'I'm not judging people who vote differently from me, but they are stupid/evil etc' that is a constant on MN, why not get involved in politics?
Every party needs people at grassroots level, and, that way, you can influence the direction of politics.
Or you can moan about it.

fwiw, I have a brilliant MP, Thangham Debonniare. So decent politicians do exist.

Amen to that.

Most voters don't care about politics. That is why the support for the current government seems impervious to their actions.

They’ll care when it drives food prices sky high.

YouGov says people with a degree or higher were more likely to vote Labour in the last election by 43% to 29%.

I think the right -wing MSM has a huge impact and the fact that newspapers don't sell well doesn't mean people aren't accessing it online or just hearing the soundbites second or third hand socially or on SM. Just being on Twitter it's amazing how many people just trot out things they've heard or seen as a headline as fact without bothering to question whether it's true. Eg Johnson said there would be a 'great summer catch-up' for children this year. It was never mentioned again but because it was widely reported at the time I know people are certain it happened. People don't seem to question or remember anything. I can't understand why it's not constantly mentioned that Johnson had an 'oven ready' deal that he campaigned on but now we're heading to no deal!

@Fandajji

I'm a floating voter and voted tory this time. Corbyn and Johnson were equally as unattractive to me, but I felt safer having continous shit rather than radical change shit.

We know the tories are dodgy, and they seem to accept that we all know it. Labour and lib dems are equally as dodgy but have such a strong sense "we are on the right side of history" which worries me.

My tory MP has also been very helpful on a personal level, the Labour and lib dem candidates live in different constituencies!

Starmer will get my vote in the next election if its Starmer v Johnson, he seems a little more open to debate and I cojkd not vote for incompetentcy vs (what seems like so far) competency. If it's a Sunak vs Starmer election (my personal prediction) I think a lot of people will vote for smaller, radical parties that reflect their view son very particular issues. I'd probably still go with Starmer.

Can you honestly tell me you feel safe under this government? They have fucked up their Covid response and they are crooks! Even before the election they had illegally prorogued parliament but you felt safe?! Labour and Lib Dems are nowhere near this dodgy and it bothers me that people trot out shit like that without looking at what is actually happening.

I can't understand why it's not constantly mentioned that Johnson had an 'oven ready' deal that he campaigned on but now we're heading to no deal!

It is in the broadsheets but how many people give a shit about Brexit now? In some ways Covid has been very convenient to this government.

Sadly a lot of people do still seem to care about Brexit above all els, though I know a couple of people who assumed we left as soon as the result was announced. There was an independent/loony-type candidate in my area saying his Brexit policy was to say it was already done and then just stop it, which I think was a brilliant idea!

I don't think it's even that complicated. Most people don't follow politics and don't know anything about the candidates apart from:
Person A= Labour
Person B= Tory

Loads do no research at all and they go with who they've always voted for, or who the tabloids tell them too.

@YummyJamDoughnut

I don't think it's even that complicated. Most people don't follow politics and don't know anything about the candidates apart from: Person A= Labour Person B= Tory

Loads do no research at all and they go with who they've always voted for, or who the tabloids tell them too.

Which is how Johnson had his majority.

Fandanji but by voting for this Tory government you have voted for radical change. It was all there in their manifesto. Exiting the EU, putting a customs border within our own territory, curtailing Judicial review which they are in the process of which also attacks the Union as they want to change Scots Law.

I knew it would be bad, but they’ve actually been so much worse than even I anticipated - I never thought a Tory government would try to breach international law. Just look at how many senior Civil Servants we have lost in the last few months, it really does speak volumes.

If this Internal Market Bill gets through it will speed up the end of the Union, cause us to end transition with no EU trade deal, end any hope of FTA with America because of GFA, possibly re-start violence in Ireland as removing our customs border in the Irish Sea will inevitably mean a hard border in Ireland. No FTA with EU will be massively damaging to certain sectors, including car manufacturers, chemicals and agriculture. And the justification for all this madness is just as radical as the means - Dominic Cummings thinks we need a fourth industrial revolution in Tech so doesn’t want to be bound by the EUs state aid regime. Conservatives traditionally hate state aid (for good reason imo).

On top of this, with the Govs recent track record of Cronyism I have zero faith that they will be able to pick ‘winners.’ The recent £100bn! (double defence budget) possibly being given to the Moonshot programme for technology that doesn’t even exist yet to implement something pretty much all experts agree is a bad idea is more an indication of how this is all going to end imo.

So please tell me how all the above is less radical than possibly giving poor people free broadband and ending the charitable status of Private Schools, and that’s before we take into account that Labour would have had a minority government and as such any of their more unpopular policies would have gone nowhere.

"I love the poorly educated". D. Trump. Well, of course he does.