Page 9 | If we could go back do you wish we went down the herd immunity route?

Sakalibre · 2020-09-08T22:19:07+00:00

Just curious YABU - no YANBU - yes

PremierInn · 11/09/2020 03:14

Did we not go down the herd immunity route? I thought we were doing that but with a load of shit thrown in for good measure like random 'go out, don't go out, go to work, don't go to work' messaging. We're not doing very well if the idea was to not let everyone catch it. We're doing really well if the idea was to let everyone catch.it but not blame the government for trying to kill granny.

notanoctopus · 11/09/2020 05:27

Yabu no

TomPinch · 11/09/2020 06:58

@eaglejulesk

I don’t think New Zealand have got the right idea This could never be over. Will people from NZ be ok with never seeing any overseas family again. Never travelling again.

How long before someone gets sick of the restrictions

Pandemics in the past have always become manageable, why do you think this is any different? In the meantime life is pretty much business as usual in NZ (even though there are some reintroduced restrictions, which hopefully will ease again soon) - apart from the travel - very different from life in the UK at present.

We in NZ have got it right for us. It's still been at enormous cost: our tourism industry is dead. But it doesn't follow that the UK could have ever done the same.

The point is often missed that there is a lot more water around NZ than Britain. You cannot cross the Tasman in a leaky boat or swim it. NZ is a very hard country to sneak into.

And the virus still got back in, and will do so again.

PurpleFlower1983 · 11/09/2020 06:59

No, at least 300,000 would have died. Far too high a price to pay.

MarshaBradyo · 11/09/2020 07:00

No but I don’t think NZ was possible for U.K. either. Mostly due to timing. They had evidence very early in their numbers to lockdown.

Unfortunately our path is what is likely for early Western Country

MarshaBradyo · 11/09/2020 07:01

Country no cap

MarshaBradyo · 11/09/2020 07:10

Not as interesting sounding as Sweden or NZ but if we were to follow anyone to do it better, Germany is good.

eaglejulesk · 11/09/2020 07:20

The point is often missed that there is a lot more water around NZ than Britain. You cannot cross the Tasman in a leaky boat or swim it. NZ is a very hard country to sneak into.

Indeed that is true - but at the height of the pandemic the UK were allowing people to fly in from anywhere, leave the airport and head off to their destination with nothing at all done, no checks, no quarantining etc. That to me is sheer madness.

maddening · 11/09/2020 07:26

Look at India, 4.5 million cases, 76000 deaths

Is 6.9m cases and 192,000 deaths

Yabu

maddening · 11/09/2020 07:27

Sorry US

ChasingRainbows19 · 11/09/2020 07:45

Thing is if we peak again the NHS will still be Unfortunately unprepared in some ways. Yes it wasn’t overwhelmed but that’s because everything else that wasn’t acute was stopped

Yes we know how to treat it better and have PPE but so many trusts haven’t the space in winter with normal illnesses. See previous years news reports about ambulances queuing etc.

It won’t be as simple as moving patients as they’ll be needing to stay in hospital not just ( hate this term) bed blockers needing a safe home. less staff will be able to be redeployed to covid areas.

Add covid in the mix.... lots are still old buildings with fewer isolation areas. We had over 200 positive patients at the peak in the trust I work in.

I really hope it isn’t like March/April.

wafflyversatile · 11/09/2020 08:29

I'm pretty sure it wasnt refugees in boats driving the numbers up FFS.

PremierInn · 11/09/2020 08:45

@wafflyversatile

I'm pretty sure it wasnt refugees in boats driving the numbers up FFS.

No it was hospital consultants back from ski trips at Feb half term

iolaus · 11/09/2020 08:54

Herd immunity only works with vaccines - not people catching diseases

Vintagevixen · 11/09/2020 09:27

@shockingstocking - I didn't vote Boris! Leftie here, voted labour all my life. Also a HCP (ITU nurse.) I still think a version of the Swedish approach would have been better. Also Germany is a good point.

Vintagevixen · 11/09/2020 09:29

And yes to hospital consultant - there were several cases in London ICU's of a consultant arriving back from hols and infecting most of the unit. In one case they had to close the unit mostly down and divert all ICU cases for a number of weeks.

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/09/2020 09:44

I supported lock down initially but we as a family can’t go on.
Especially now things have taken a sinister turn and dd has it looks like lost her business.
Anything to do with Covid and all sense goes out the window. It is being used as a tactic to not pay people or get rid of people without just cause.
It is looking like only a judge will hopefully see sense. But the damage has been done.

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/09/2020 09:59

it was hospital consultants back from ski trips at Feb half term

It is now being looked at that this virus was in the population in November/December time. So a few people coming back from ski trips weren’t going to make that much difference.
I saw somewhere that they started to test the blood they still had of patients that died of flu/pneumonia/chest infection symptoms in November/December and found Covid in the samples.

I always thought that the first wave was December time and the 2nd more lethal wave was March and we are facing the 3rd and lesser wave over the winter months.

I think there are a lot more people who have had this disease than is being reported and although it doesn’t give you full immunity having had it. From what people are experiencing having Covid for a 2nd time it does look like you don’t get it as severely.

PremierInn · 11/09/2020 10:03

@Oliversmumsarmy

it was hospital consultants back from ski trips at Feb half term

It is now being looked at that this virus was in the population in November/December time. So a few people coming back from ski trips weren’t going to make that much difference.
I saw somewhere that they started to test the blood they still had of patients that died of flu/pneumonia/chest infection symptoms in November/December and found Covid in the samples.

I always thought that the first wave was December time and the 2nd more lethal wave was March and we are facing the 3rd and lesser wave over the winter months.

I think there are a lot more people who have had this disease than is being reported and although it doesn’t give you full immunity having had it. From what people are experiencing having Covid for a 2nd time it does look like you don’t get it as severely.

I do agree with that as well,but the links to Italy and ski resorts in particular for UK infections from March onward are clearly documented. It wasn't just hospital consultants - that was a bit facetious on my part

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/09/2020 10:04

Maybe I am being cynical but they had to blame someone for bringing the disease into the country

hoping4onlychild · 11/09/2020 10:15

@Oliversmumsarmy that is somewhat surprising from you! I remember you were very pro lockdown and you prioritized lives over the economy. Which I guess was the prevailing sentiment at that time.

If you are losing patience, i guess most people are?

I am quite over it tbh. The thought of viewing rosh hashanah and yom kippur services at home is not very nice. at least I can still see family.

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/09/2020 10:27

Up until what has happened to dd we were still struggling through (having lost tens of thousands since March). We thought everyone was in a similar position.

We now see it very differently.

This virus is being used as an excuse for doing all sorts of things under the guise of we are living in a “worldwide pandemic”

Dd is devastated and can’t see a future.
It was the only thing she wanted to do and was just starting to get going having doubled her net profits each year since she started.

Her reputation was everything and it is now trashed.
It will lead to a court case as she has an email trail and Covid test results from before and after the event to prove she couldn’t have infected anyone.

But even a win in court will not remove the question mark. Mud sticks.

hoping4onlychild · 11/09/2020 10:40

@Oliversmumsarmy i am sorry for what happened to your DD.

I don't really think it is as sinister as that. its just that in any crisis, there are people who benefit and people who are completely crushed. Some billionaires have done very well out of covid i.e. Jeff Bezos. Judging from the house price rise and wealthier home owners buying large rural homes, some people are clearly earning more money due to pandemic on account of not paying season tickets and childcare.
Basically, having a stable salaried job during the pandemic makes you a winner. However, in more peaceful times, people who are more interested in wealth creation would have been better off self employed or a small business owner. However during covid, they absorb all the costs of covid which most are unable to do.

Oliversmumsarmy · 11/09/2020 10:52

Well if big companies (and it was a big company) can get away with not paying for work done in the name of Covid then of course they are going to do well and to make sure no one will employ her again they threaten to trash her name with all the agencies where she gets work from.

People can only take so much.

Badbadbunny · 11/09/2020 16:00

@Vintagevixen

And yes to hospital consultant - there were several cases in London ICU's of a consultant arriving back from hols and infecting most of the unit. In one case they had to close the unit mostly down and divert all ICU cases for a number of weeks.

And that's an environment where the staff should know about cross infection, hygiene etc. It's no wonder it spread like wildfire in hospitals.