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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think WFH is going to permanent for most who have switched?

191 replies

elmouno · 05/09/2020 22:29

I was chatting with someone earlier and I said that most people currently working from home will be working from home now permanently. There will be no switch back to the offices in the city.

The other person disagreed and said people will have to go back. If they don't too much of the city economies will collapse which will affect the overall economy (i.e. no coffee, lunch, rail tickets, cleaners etc) that it would be catastrophic.

I'm guessing that businesses will be forced to change, but maybe not? Am I being unreasonable to assume that all the people now working from home will be doing so permanently?

OP posts:
midgebabe · 06/09/2020 08:52

The whole city centre structure has been a headache for decades. The long commute and congestion problems. The centralisation of jobs to London. City centres in many areas were gradually decaying

Here we have an opportunity to move towards a more decentralised way of living , move the coffee shops to the people, create shared company community working hubs which would make the people of this country happier and healthier, and what are we doing? Turning our backs to opportunities

MadameBlobby · 06/09/2020 08:54

@MrsMcMuffins I’m 2 weeks into a new role starting remotely and it’s got some challenges but it’s OK. I was made redundant though so had to find work, not sure I’d have been looking for a new role in the current climate otherwise

Ghostlyglow · 06/09/2020 08:56

Our office can't fit any more people back in at the moment because of the covid guidelines. I'm really sick of the media saying people won't go back-we can't! You only have a chance of going back in if you can prove it's making you mentally ill and it's not just a case of saying so, you have to go through an assessment process.

JamSarnie · 06/09/2020 08:59

What I don't understand is anyone making drastic changes for full WFH like moving home to areas that aren't necessarily good for commutes.

Whilst your job might be full WFH at the moment I would want to hold off a year or two to see how the majority of employers act especially as unemployment is likely going to increase and I would want to be in a place that wouldn't limit my chances of getting another job.

CeibaTree · 06/09/2020 09:03

@k1233

I'm in Australia and where I work it is a huge rigmarole to get approval for people to work from home 1 day per week. 2 days WFH are only in exceptional circumstances. I think it is rather ridiculous. Other places are much more flexible and some haven't returned 100% to the office.
My work was like this too, you had to apply to have a laptop with a VPN, and only certain people were eligible to even apply. WFH was really not part of the culture at all. But since everyone had to WFH they were remarkably quick to get everyone a laptop with remote access - so the infrastructure and technology was readily available just the management didn't want people to WFH. However it has been so successful that no-one is expected to go back into the office unless they want to or need to be on site. It's a real culture shift.
Aroundtheworldin80moves · 06/09/2020 09:05

DH had to go to the office throughout, but they were in their own rooms, rather than the usual popping in and out of people's offices, with meetings down via video conferencing even though they were in the same building. They were extremely busy (moved to shift working as well, as work could just as easily arise on a Sunday as a Wednesday.)

As productive as they were... Productivity increased now they can have spread out 'meeting' once a week again (it's officially a coffee break). Because they talk to people in person about small problems that have arisen.

Oysterbabe · 06/09/2020 09:10

Our company have sacked off their big office and taken on a smaller one without room for everyone. There's been no suggestion of returning at all yet. It's a shame for the businesses who rely on office workers but it's not my companies problem really, they are saving money and just trying to stay afloat in difficult times.

to think WFH is going to permanent for most who have switched?
frustrationcentral · 06/09/2020 09:12

DH is likely to continue, much to my annoyance Grin

His company have said they're going to reopen end of this month - they took advantage and renovated- but have said numbers will be very limited and basically you have to justify being in. DH can do all work remotely so unlikely he'll need to go in

bigchris · 06/09/2020 09:15

Or even my local library, for free.

Ours is limited opening , no space for sitting at desks , 15 people in and out, select and collect style

nosswith · 06/09/2020 09:15

Five days a week in an office I expect will not return for many I expect. I think where I work it will be one day a week or two, except for those for whom wfh is difficult. The young person house sharing or someone without the space to work easily will be the first to go back to our office.

BatleyTownswomensGuild · 06/09/2020 09:18

Office rental in places like London is very expensive. I think many businesses will move to home working 2-3 days a week to enable them to downsize premises and save money.

DH works in Central London and has been told he won't be back in until Spring and then only 2 days a week.

DerelictWreck · 06/09/2020 09:22

Nah not a chance.

The only people I know who want to continue wfh are those with childcare to figure out! Everyone else is desperate to go back.

I'm big public sector and we are all due back next month.

tentative3 · 06/09/2020 09:24

There have been multiple threads on this and on each one some posters fail to recognise that their reluctance to 'prop up pret' isn't going to start and end with pret going under. The people who work for pret aren't tax dodging multi millionaires, they're your neighbours, the people you see at the school gates, at the gym.

Yes, in the longer term they might find work in these new suburban cafes filled with people working on their laptops (I wonder how long the cafes will tolerate that without having to impose a minimum spend?) but in the shorter term they're no longer buying the product your company sells, subscribing to extra tv channels, buying luxury goods (and insuring them) and food, signing their kids up to extra curricular activities, booking holidays, going to the pub, buying furniture, using public transport, trying a new hobby. And yes, maybe you aren't a bus driver, or a sky technician, or a kids guitar teacher. But are you an accountant? Do you work in HR? New business development? Contracts? Facilities? Do you think those departments will be unaffected when the company's profits start to slow?

It is likely that we do need a change, and more likely still that it's coming whether we like it or not. And as other posters have stated, it might very well be a good thing long term, but to ignore the short term damage it is going to cause because you think you're insulated from the ripple effects is short sighted. There are, too, the very good points made about new starters, both to a particular job and to working in general, work experience, apprenticeships etc. I'll go further and add friendships/relationships, which for a lot of people is something that develops in their first few roles in particular.

I also suspect that a year from now, some companies will not be prepared to accept the hybrid wfh/childcare situation that they are forced to accept now.

RingtheBells · 06/09/2020 09:27

I did choose to retire a bit early rather than wfh as it was so horrible, I went to work part time to mix with people and a change of scenery. DH is annoying me intensely with his work calls even though he is upstairs I can still him.

SerenDippitty · 06/09/2020 09:29

I retired last year and will be very annoyed if my local cafes now start being packed out with homeworkers during the week! Grin

MadameBlobby · 06/09/2020 09:36

@tentative3

There have been multiple threads on this and on each one some posters fail to recognise that their reluctance to 'prop up pret' isn't going to start and end with pret going under. The people who work for pret aren't tax dodging multi millionaires, they're your neighbours, the people you see at the school gates, at the gym.

Yes, in the longer term they might find work in these new suburban cafes filled with people working on their laptops (I wonder how long the cafes will tolerate that without having to impose a minimum spend?) but in the shorter term they're no longer buying the product your company sells, subscribing to extra tv channels, buying luxury goods (and insuring them) and food, signing their kids up to extra curricular activities, booking holidays, going to the pub, buying furniture, using public transport, trying a new hobby. And yes, maybe you aren't a bus driver, or a sky technician, or a kids guitar teacher. But are you an accountant? Do you work in HR? New business development? Contracts? Facilities? Do you think those departments will be unaffected when the company's profits start to slow?

It is likely that we do need a change, and more likely still that it's coming whether we like it or not. And as other posters have stated, it might very well be a good thing long term, but to ignore the short term damage it is going to cause because you think you're insulated from the ripple effects is short sighted. There are, too, the very good points made about new starters, both to a particular job and to working in general, work experience, apprenticeships etc. I'll go further and add friendships/relationships, which for a lot of people is something that develops in their first few roles in particular.

I also suspect that a year from now, some companies will not be prepared to accept the hybrid wfh/childcare situation that they are forced to accept now.

I agree with your last paragraph. My kids are older now, 11 and 14, so them being there doesn’t impact me at all wfh. However many jobs that allow home working have a provision that (younger) children must be in childcare - my last job did, I worked from home 2 days a week and my children went to a childminder/after school club. Many employers have had no option with the current situ but to accept workers having kids running about, this won’t last forever.
tentative3 · 06/09/2020 09:43

Yes @MadameBlobby I know my brother who has always done some work from home has never previously been allowed to do so without childcare in place. It'll be interesting when people aren't prepared to prop up parents (and I also wonder whether this finally might be the point at which the younger generations refuse to prop up pensions).

IsAnybodyListening · 06/09/2020 09:44

I agree with those saying they can't go back, as social distancing would be impossible.

I think if you can WFH effectively, then there is no to go back to the office atm.

Both DP an I are still WFH from different rooms. My productivity has actually increased, no commute, no being pulled away by colleagues. No random meetings that drag on. I even got a little £700 bonus a couple of months back, and a very small payrise added to my salary.

Yes, I feel for small businesses, but in the office I NEVER went out to get coffee, buy lunches. Our local town was dismal before all this anyway, the high street has been in decline for a long time.

I don't know the answer, but I won't be rushing back because the government tell me to. Although if my boss asks, that's a different story ;)

FAQs · 06/09/2020 09:48

The company I work for is preparing for this but most employees don’t know yet. Although I can’t think many will have much of an objection. It’ll save our company at least £90k per year.

Oysterbabe · 06/09/2020 09:54

My company never relaxed the rule on WFH not being used as childcare. My kids are in school / nursery in the same way they would be if I was in the office.

Baaaahhhhh · 06/09/2020 09:54

I can't wait for DH to get back to work. We have a big house, separate office etc, but it is really toxic to live and work in the same space 24/7.

You have to get out of the house, meet new people, see life going on. Just think how many friends you have met along the way in your working life, maybe even your life partner. I think it is awful to contemplate a life worked in isolation. Flexible working, absolutely yes, but not full time at home.

sleepyhead · 06/09/2020 10:00

My team already works across cities and spread across different floors/areas of huge open plan offices.

We were already heavy users of vc and communicated more by phone/messaging than face to face.

Id still like to get back to the office though, even just a couple of days a week for a change of scenery and face to face chat. It also feels like I'm more isolated from what's going on in the wider organisation.

Youngatheart00 · 06/09/2020 10:00

I get really upset hearing sweeping statements like “everyone I’ve spoken to loves WFH”. I think there’s a big difference between being able to work flexibility and a full time WFH life (also known as living at work / isolated and solitary). Zoom and it’s peers are absolutely no substitute for F2F interaction.

2 days in office / 3 days at home or vice versa will work best IMHO

EmpressoftheMundane · 06/09/2020 10:06

It all depends upon the nature of the work you do. Work that can be done effectively from home. Is often the sort of work that can be automated or sent overseas. Work done in isolation in the UK can just as easily be done in India at a fraction of the cost.

I fear the golden age of working from home won’t last long.

SuitedandBooted · 06/09/2020 10:11

I can't see it working for everyone in the long term, as PP's have said: there are tax, compelled childcare, isolation etc issues to contend with. This is all very new at the moment.

I'm a bit Hmm at all the "We're more productive comments". Maybe YOU are, but the sales team in the company I work for most certainly weren't ( and a further 2 have been made redundant - they were serious piss-takers).

WFH just won't work in many situations. I work for a very niche design/ manufacturer company. Last week, I noticed an irregularity on a design. As I was in the studio, I could immediately stand up and ask, " Hey, did we ever use this widget before on a Q34T?. Response was "Not sure - Carl would have worked on it". Found Carl, located client file- sorted in moments.
How would that have worked on line? How would I even know who to ask? I would have had to email the whole team, wait for a response, hope Carl had seen the email and had the info to hand. We would have got there in the end but it would have been much slower. This is the reality for many companies, and they won't accept it long term