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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The alphabet and 'H'.

458 replies

Thatbliddywoman · 01/09/2020 22:50

So we say
Ay.
Bee
Sea
Dee
Ee
Eff
Jee
Aitch. Except we don't. We say 'Haitch'.
Why?
We make the aitch have its own letter as the sound of the word for it
We don't do that with any other letter. Why H?
We don't say 'wubbleyew' do we, It's 'doubleyew'?
I don't understand it.

OP posts:
MindyStClaire · 02/09/2020 07:00

And don't play the "Irish isn't a race" card, it's old and tired. Race encompasses ethnicity so yes, prejudice against Irish people our language is racist.

CaptainMyCaptain · 02/09/2020 07:02

I say Aitch.

FOKKYFC · 02/09/2020 07:02

Good Lord. I'm out of this one. Insanity.

Thatbliddywoman · 02/09/2020 07:02

Thank you for the replies. A lot of them are fascinating. Of course I have no issue with how a different language says things. I should have specified 'english people's pronunciation' in my title
I also should have specified that I don't personally say the 'H' sound. Smile

OP posts:
FOKKYFC · 02/09/2020 07:03

Just looking at my passport and having a quick chortle.

Doccomplaint · 02/09/2020 07:04

Irish people speak English due to colonialism.

But we do speak English. (Some also speak Irish)

It’s not a different language just because an Irish person is speaking it.

Hmm
CherryValanc · 02/09/2020 07:05

H is possibly the most contentious letter in the alphabet.

Dropping Hs is seen, these days, as vulgar, used by "lower classes", probably considered by some h-users as uneducated and lazy.

There was a time where dropping H was a good thing, a positive social marker (by those who care greatly about social markers) and not that long ago. Probably, at a guess, originated from the Normans (words such as humble, hospital, hypocrisy, heritage and hotel. "An hotel" might still be used today.) I imagine this is why haitch is considered correct as "aitch". Don't know for certain.

There is no academy to rule on words or pronunciation. (No, not the dictionary, that reflects the common parlance. There's some way of recording usage and once a word gets to a certain level it can go in. Never to leave.)

When people judge object to the words other people use or the way other people say words there's is no linguistic logic. It's down to snobbery, because they dislike the social feature that word or that pronunciation belongs to.

In a nutshell "haitch", is said by a lot of people and isn't wrong.

Camomila · 02/09/2020 07:05

I say aitch.

I struggle with the English 'th' sound and say 'f' occasionally though.

Principally because the people on my race-relations course said I had to.
What were you saying before? I'm not sure why loo or bathroom would be offensive.

MindyStClaire · 02/09/2020 07:06

@FOKKYFC

Just looking at my passport and having a quick chortle.
? Confused
FeltCarrot · 02/09/2020 07:08

In phonics “h” is an unvoiced sound, we don’t teach it as “huh”, otherwise as you blend h a t you would say hu-a-t.

FOKKYFC · 02/09/2020 07:09

'Irish people speak English due to colonialism.

But we do speak English. (Some also speak Irish)

It’s not a different language just because an Irish person is speaking it.'

Hmmmm. Graeme Le Saux was the first Channel Islander to play for England. As we're doing complete non-sequiturs . . .

How on Earth do you know where I was born? And to what nationality parents? Creepy.

Doccomplaint · 02/09/2020 07:10

I was answering @Thatbliddywoman not you @FOKKYFC

Apologies for not tagging correctly.

ChangeThePassword · 02/09/2020 07:14

Just to confuse things further..

I say 'itch'

Grin
FOKKYFC · 02/09/2020 07:15

Fair enough.

nestisflown · 02/09/2020 07:17

Grew up in Wales and was taught Haitch. I did go to a Catholic school but I’m pretty sure most people there say Haitch. To be honest I can’t even imagine “Aitch” - I’ll have to listen out for it

But can’t stand the mumsnet snobbery- already had people calling it common etc. And then the middle class English wonder why so many Scots/Welsh/ Irish dislike them - maybe try and speak more kindly about legitimate regional varieties without turning it into classism. Just a suggestion.

LongPauseNoReply · 02/09/2020 07:21

Aitch is awful. It sounds pinched and cold. I’m Irish, we say haitch which is much more gentle.

EggysMom · 02/09/2020 07:25

I love the Scottish Jy (Jeye) where I was brought up singing saying Jay. I lived in Scotland ten years, picked up some words from the dialect, but still pronounce Jy as they do Smile

EggysMom · 02/09/2020 07:26

sorry, that should read "still cannot pronounce Jy as they do" (durrrrrr)

alittleprivacy · 02/09/2020 07:28

Sounds fine to say Haitch if you're Irish. It's a regional thing.

It's not just a regional thing. Haitch is correct in Hiberno-English. It's a distinct dialect on English and has it's own slight variation of rules, it's no different to how "color" is correct in American-English.

MindyStClaire · 02/09/2020 07:29

And Ireland isn't a region of the UK.

dudsville · 02/09/2020 07:31

@kursaalflyer

I say 'feff' for F, doesn't everyone?
Grin
nestisflown · 02/09/2020 07:31

Just reading the whole thread and I do say N-Aitch-S but I guess because it’s mid word I assumed the H sound was dropped to make it roll off the tongue. However I say GBHaitch and would use Haitch to spell any other word with the letter H in.

nestisflown · 02/09/2020 07:32

And Ireland isn't a region of the UK.

NI is, and Wales is where we’ve established Haitch is normal there too.

mrshoho · 02/09/2020 07:32

Laughing at the the comments of haitch sounding like nails on a blackboard or giving them the rage.

Tend to find these people who judge people like me and somehow think I'm uneducated or shock horror working class for say haitch. It's a way to sneer at people but little do they know how ridiculous ^they^ are. Get used to it people as believe it or not language evolves. Teachers do not 'correct' students on this issue and both are acceptable.

And to the poster saying the h sound is not used when teaching phonics and sounding out words, well it is in my part of the country that is London!

And honestly who gives a shit. Going by the vote it appears not that many.

alittleprivacy · 02/09/2020 07:34

@Doccomplaint It’s not a different language just because an Irish person is speaking it.

Nope, we speak a distinct variational dialect Hiberno-English. There are regional variations within H-E, just as there are in British-English but it is classified as it's own distinct dialect.

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