Racism allegation at work

[Ticklemelmo]

Without outing I know someone that made a genuine mistake at the beginning of the year by putting something unintentionally racist in a work social media group, someone of colour in the group said it wasn't appropriate, and the person I know apologised directly straight away because they didn't realise.
Months later and a week into the BLM coming out they've come back and accused that person and several others of racism in the work place.

I can't speak for the others impacted by the racist allegations, but this person is now going through a disciplinary with a potential of dismissal?

Aibu to think that this is completely unfair? Anyone work in HR who has dealt with this and can give some expection of outcome.

@Bluesheep8 no the matter isn't closed in the workplace as if it led to one of the people who was the target group of the racism seeing it then going off sick due to it, then management is obliged to take action.

The point is if a complaint has been made HR/the company has to investigate.

The two people will have an opportunity to make their case.

I think also it is a reminder for all of us that a work social media group is not a place to share non-work related items like 'funny' videos and images.

Exactly because people might at best not share your sense of humour and at worst get offended by the content you post. Stick to work matters and safe topics...

people are calling out racism

There's a difference between calling out racism and calling people racist because they didn't bother to watch to the end of a video. On this thread I've seen the latter.

And I am serious. I'm against racism and I'm not racist. But I think it's important to keep raising this issue. What do we want? A society that's divided into black/white/poc where we are told we can't even be in relationships with each other? Or a society where your skin colour doesn't determine your path through life any more than your hair colour would?

I want the latter. That is why I keep raising it. Because I think the push for the former is divisive and counterproductive.

To put it simply: there are two kinds of anti-racism. The kind we would traditionally understand, the kind where we push for equality. Where we acknowledge that society has not been organised fairly and we arrange it so that black people have the same access to freedom and power as white people do. Then there's the new kind of so-called anti-racism (I'd argue it's a US import) where we assume that all white people are inherently racist and therefore anything they do in relation to a black person is racist, and the only way to stop racism is to stop white people from having power and freedom.

People on this thread seem overwhelming in support of the second kind of anti-racism. I'm just speaking up for the old-fashioned anti-racists who still believe in equality.

Abigail Shrier often writes about antisemitism, rightly calling it out as unacceptable. Yet here she is being used as validation to minimise other types of racism. So either @queenofknives has misrepresented what Shrier said, or Shrier is a hypocrite. Which is it queen?

Thanks PatriciaPerch. Better than 'uppity' I suppose.

There's a difference between calling out racism and calling people racist because they didn't bother to watch to the end of a video. On this thread I've seen the latter.

I guess we’re ready g different things then because most seem to be pointing out OP’s friend stupidity for sending something they hadn’t watched fully and that no one could tell OP if their friend would lose their job over it given the details.

*reading

How is drinking the kool aid racist? Its origins are the Jonestown massacre and it refers to cults. It has no racist connotations at all.

I'm struggling to believe that someone would like a video enough to share it on FB, when they haven't even watched all of it.

But we have to believe the OP, apparently.

It occurs to me that there's a really shitty conflation on this thread between 'MN only works if we take what the OP says at face value' (which I agree with) and 'if the OP says her mate's not a racist and posted the video accidentally, it must be true' (which I completely disagree with).

Now apparently I must be a racist because I refuse to accept that everything that happens between people of different races must contain racism and racist power dynamics. I know that's not true, as I come from a very diverse background, lots of black people in my immediate and close family.

This is such laughable bullshit. The OP herself has acknowledged the video is racist. The company are rightly considering disciplinary action. And yet we must all accept it's not racism because @queenofknives 'refuses to accept everything must contain racism' even though we are talking about a specific case of racism, and we're not allowed to disagree with her because her family is full of black people. And I'm the queen of Sheba

I also agree that 'I didn't watch the end of the video' is a really spurious defence. If you're enjoying a video enough to keep watching and to forward it on, chances are you've watched it all.

If you are racist, apologising means nothing.
You are still a racist.
HTH

@queenofknives for future reference, people 'with lots of black people' in their family tend not use to phrases like "I refuse to accept that everything that happens between people of different races must contain racism and racist power dynamics."

How do you know you aren't a racist though?

Because I believe in equality between all people regardless of their skin colour and I strive to always live and act in accordance with that belief.

[quote Cadent]@queenofknives for future reference, people 'with lots of black people' in their family tend not use to phrases like "I refuse to accept that everything that happens between people of different races must contain racism and racist power dynamics."[/quote]
Please don't @ me.

Well, I don't really know how to respond to that. Not all people think the same? There's nothing wrong with black people and white people being in the same family, getting on well, having lovely times together, supporting and helping each other through life. I'm sorry if that makes you suspicious, but please try to be open-minded.

Fucking hell queen I wish I felt as self-assured about my own anti-racist credentials.

Perhaps a spot of self-reflection would do you good. Spend a bit of time, to, you know, check your privilege and all that.

@queenofknives

Please don't @ me.

@YgritteSnow @'ed you and you thanked her.

How else would you like me to address posts to you if I don't name you?

and if you look at one of its prime propagators, Robin di Angelo, it's clear that she is a racist who has no idea how to even talk to black people, and just assumes all white people are as racist as she is!

Robin Di Angelo is being discredited all over the place by commenters from multiple races and backgrounds, not least because she herself is hugely racist, presenting her racist feelings as fact yet also feels in a position to charge $1000s to attend her seminars (depending on which ticket you buy) where she teaches you how not to be racist, well what she determines as not racist anyway. That white woman sure is making a lot of money out of black people's oppression. I've been interested to note that there was a time when "White Fragility" was recommended on almost every post discussing racism on here but doesn't seem to be any longer (why not?) however the concepts and ideas she asserts seem to have taken hold as fact in the main stream. There's nothing wrong with @queenofknives posts. They're calling for discussion and questioning, as all recently introduced social concepts and ideas should be questioned and discussed, yet that in itself is being labelled racist in this thread.

Dunno about racism, but, in this day and age, posting a video in a professional context on social media, without having watched it till the end, sounds pretty stupid and unprofessional...

@YgritteSnow I'd be interested to see if @queenofknives rebukes you for @'tting her

Because I believe in equality between all people regardless of their skin colour and I strive to always live and act in accordance with that belief.

But you think "small" offences should be ignored?

So to take a "small" example, just how many times is someone supposed to ignore "but where do you really come from" before being allowed to object to gratuitous racism? How many comments about "professional grooming" wrt black hair? And who gets to decide? The white majority?

The problem with ignoring the "small things" is that the attitudes invariably underpin attitudes to the "large things".

I didn't realise @ was contentious tbh. I like it personally. Makes threads easier to follow but when discussions are bordering on heated perhaps it could be perceived as aggressive? 🤷🏼‍♀️. For myself though I genuinely don't mind it.

@thedancingbear

Fucking hell queen I wish I felt as self-assured about my own anti-racist credentials.

Perhaps a spot of self-reflection would do you good. Spend a bit of time, to, you know, check your privilege and all that.

I wish you did, too. I think the world would be a better place if more people felt confident that they weren't racist and acted accordingly.

I've reflected a lot. I think that's pretty clear. And if you don't want to listen to my view, that's fine. But maybe listen to some black people who are talking about these issues? Coleman Hughes, Glenn Loury, John McWhorter and Chloe Valdary are black academics, thinkers, and writers who have helped me reflect on what racism is and how I can be a better anti-racist. Their stuff is on youtube, along with many other black thinkers. As I say, my process of reflection and coming to clarity is really down to the clarity of their thinking and talking on this. There was stuff that really challenged me, but it was definitely worth going through that process and I still follow the debates and reflect on my beliefs as new ideas and approaches emerge.