AIBU to think it wasn't harsh enough?

[Morgzmum]

A few days ago, 1 of the neighbours children, who was playing on the communal area/road(!) came and knocked on my door and asked if I could stop my daughters from looking at them (he was with another neighbours child) while they were playing! My daughters are 3 and 4 and during lockdown their favourite hobby is looking out of the living room window for delivery vans who they've name (Mia the DPDP van).

I wouldn't have been as annoyed if he asked politely but this little 9 year old banged on my door like a bailiff and stood on my doorstep with the biggest pigeon chest I've even seen.

I asked him if his mum knew that he was knocking on people's doors telling their children when and where they can look outside, he told me to shut up and stormed off towards the other neighbours child who was telling me that they told him not to do anything as they're (my daughters) are only babies. I went round to his house to inform his mum what he had done, she shouted him over and said "please don't do that again, you know what happened last time" then sent him off to play again!

I don't know what happened last time but this child will jump out in front of cars while they are going down our road, refuse to move from SITTING AND LAYING in the middle of our road and throw pebbles (from his own driveway) at parked cars, so I'm guessing it isn't good.

AIBU to think that he wasn't even punished?
As far as I'm aware he hasn't been punished for any of the other idiotic things he's done and his mum will quite happily let him hang out of the window at his waist while she's driving.

Do I still have a right to be pissed off with how she handled it? My children wouldn't dream of doing anything that child does including my 3 year old.

I think a word is fine, but he should've been told 'you know you don't talk to people like that, it's very rude, now say sorry to Mrs 76' or similar. I think that uncomfortable feeling of being made to apologise when you've crossed the line as a child is important in establishing where the boundaries are in social interactions. Shame or feeling embarrassed in small amounts like this can be a very positive thing in terms of emotional consequences to behaviours. I used to work in psychotherapeutic work with offenders and we'd do lots of work around shame, accepting the emotion, rather than minimising, denying, blaming, filtering etc to justify the behaviour and avoid the uncomfortable feeling, because accepting the emotion means you have to accept responsibility for your actions and their impact and that affects whether you're likely to repeat or escalate the behaviour.

Do you know more about this boy's background?
It is odd behaviour and he might have some sort of special needs rather than just being a "little shit".

And to be fair to him, most people probably wouldn't like to feel watched anywhere.

Morg it's more that at this point you know what will happen with that strategy.

Think about it he comes to yours. Gets a sense of entitlement he's able to speak to you how he likes and gets to decide what your dds can do in their own home.

Attention from you, then you go to mum, 2 adults talking about him is more attention. Then he gets direct attention from mum who speaks to him.

Some kids a stern word from an adult is enough.

Some it's not because behaviour is attention seeking and the way to stop that is withdraw attention.

When ds was growing up one of the mums in our group had a child who tittle tattled on everything. She would feed it.

Child "x is doing"

Mum "why don't you tell x mum/ tell x not to/ oh dear that's not good is it blah blah"

The rest of us learnt

Child "weird, your ds os banging his cars together pretending to crash them"

Us "that's nice" - back to conversation we were having

Just ignore them.
I probably wouldn't have gone to the DM's home I'd tell them sharply to MTOB at the door cheeky little thing.

@whydobirds I think that children from a very young age should know right from wrong and be held accountable for their decisions (praised for good decisions, explain why others are wrong as a young child) so then as they get older when faced with a choice they hopefully pick the right 1. My son is very respectful of other people not just adults and knows what language is acceptable and what isn't. I would also expect a minimum of an adult telling me if any of my children where disrespectful to them or their property so I could deal with it.

Most parents will not punish or seriously reprimand their child in front of somebody else, so you don't know what else she may have said or done. In any case, she did tell him not to do it again. And this particular piece of behaviour was cheeky but not evil IMO. His consistent disregard of road safety is far more serious, but I don't think there's anything much that you can do about it.

@morgzmum I wasn't aiming that at you, more at pps who said it was a non issue cos he was only 9.

I also really REALLY (And again this isn't aimed at you) wish people wouldn't automatically assume SEN when there's poor behaviour. It doesn't help those who have SEN. Nobody believes DD struggles (ASD) because she's well behaved. Her peers at school (who don't know she's autistic as she won't tell them, and it's secondary so different groups throughout the day) 'oh I never want a friend with autism, they're all horrible, violent, badly behaved'
Both my kids have ASD. DS also has ADHD. I teach in a SEN provision. I've not encountered any greater a level of genuine poor behaviour than with NT kids. Behavioural difference, sure. But that's not necessarily/always/often even what would be looked on as 'bad' behaviour. It's more often a stress response.

Sure, kids with SEN can behave inappropriately due to lack of social understanding but, even if behaviour is down to a neurological difference outsiders don't know about, they help and support understanding why this isn't acceptable, it can't just be used as an excuse. For their sake.

Love how MNers will excuse most obnovious behaviour.

I agree with the dashcam for when he performs in the road, film it and send to the police for the road traffic problem and to Social Services to deal with the neglect from some idiot who allows her child to behave like this. It's unfair that a driver would inevitably be held responsible for any accident the boy caused.

@Polnm

Does the boy have autism? Behaviour and response suggest he might.

and we're off.......... 🙄 I can see where you are coming from OP but people parent differently

I couldn't get worked up about this. The danger of lying in front of cars etc- yes, that would bother me, but I don't think my response to it would be to ask people to agree with me that the kid needs harsher punishment. I would be worried his mum isn't coping and didn't realise how much danger he was in and would want to talk to her about that, but the actual incident you posted about would hardly make a ripple.

This is not just poor behaviour. It’s neglect.

@SmellsLikeFeet something like 40% of our prison population have markers for ADHD. No testing is carried out to find out if there were actual neurological reasons for their poor judgement or lack of impulse control. Wouod there be releases if their crimes could be partially laid at the door of their neurology? Unlikely. People wouldn't give a shit. Just as nobody (rightfully) gave a shit when whichever one of antndec was an alcoholic who got done for drink driving said it was because of his ADHD. If kids, even (especially) those with neurological difference, aren't taught at a young age how to behave towards others, nobody is going to care why they behave the way they do when they do it as adults. It really depresses me that it's used as an excuse for bad behaviour in little kids. It lets them down. Fine to use as a reason and work to help them. But not an excuse.

[quote whydobirds]@SmellsLikeFeet something like 40% of our prison population have markers for ADHD. No testing is carried out to find out if there were actual neurological reasons for their poor judgement or lack of impulse control. Wouod there be releases if their crimes could be partially laid at the door of their neurology? Unlikely. People wouldn't give a shit. Just as nobody (rightfully) gave a shit when whichever one of antndec was an alcoholic who got done for drink driving said it was because of his ADHD. If kids, even (especially) those with neurological difference, aren't taught at a young age how to behave towards others, nobody is going to care why they behave the way they do when they do it as adults. It really depresses me that it's used as an excuse for bad behaviour in little kids. It lets them down. Fine to use as a reason and work to help them. But not an excuse.[/quote]
Yes, I know

He sounds like a little shit. But I'm nit surprised if this is how he's disciplined. Yabu to think you get a say in how other people deal with things like this. Even if she really should have done more. Yanbu to be annoyed at them being little shits and her lack of discipline.

It’s not funny when a kid is as rude as that, it’s sad and will be setting him up for problems at school and in later life. He should have been told to apologise, but otherwise you can’t know how it was handled later at home. If he does it again, tell him you don’t appreciate such rudeness - he’ll learn at least that such behaviour is not okay around you. You don’t need to go ballistic, just be clear and firm.

Ahhh, good old mumsnet... Neighbours kids are feral and mine are angels.

If this kid is your biggest concern in life then your 2020 is working out better than almost everyone else on the planet.

@SmellsLikeFeet sorry, don't mean to rant at you. Just find it so depressing...

Why didn't you just tell him not to be so daft & rude when he knocked your door. You're an adult, just get him told.

I think what she did about the door knocking was fine. The other kids who told him yours were only babies clearly had sense!

I would be much more worried about the lying down in front of cars!

PS I don’t like people hammering on my door either

[quote whydobirds]@SmellsLikeFeet sorry, don't mean to rant at you. Just find it so depressing...[/quote]
Honestly, it's fine

From the very brief thread, sounds like the kid is lacking discipline at home. Unfortunately there is nothing you can do about it. Too many dysfunctional parents raising kids this way, and unfortunately it’s always put down to ‘lack of opportunities’, ‘inequality’, or some other pathetic excuse.

I don't know what you expected them to do ? It was a conversation no punishment needed.

He sounds awful, OP. I'd be very worried about him lying in the road.

Are his parents aware he does it?

The other mum didn't deal with it in the way you would have, OP but she did deal with by telling him not to do it again. It might be that she has a more thorough discussion with him later, I know I wouldn't have that chat with an audience standing there and would save it for once we were alone. I'd also let the DC carry on playing as I wouldn't class that as a grounding offence unless the knocking continued after I'd told the child to stop it.