to wonder if school uniform should be worn

[manicinsomniac]

I know all the arguments about school identity and poorer/less fashion conscious children not being teased. And I've always agreed with them. Plus I just like uniforms.

But I've been helping with a charity over the summer (a clothing bank) because it does big school uniform events where people can come and get their uniforms for free. It was a really hot day when we did the first one and, due to a combination of the number of people who turned up and Covid rules meaning only 5 could come in at once, many of them queued for 2 hours!! It actually really upset me that so many people are in a situation where it is preferable to queue for that long to avoid spending maybe £20 (don't actually know?) in the supermarket.

All the children who came in had clothes. The only reason they needed the uniforms was because the schools say so.

AIBU to think that really, when families are struggling this much, uniform just isn't that important?
YABU - uniform is important
YANBU - I agree with you, it shouldn't be needed

I was very against school uniform because i thought it squashed creativity and expression. But my dd's school went back after lockdown with non-uniform so parents could wash clothes every day (I used to anyway!) And it's been tough trying to find enough clothes that she likes and are practical and don't get absolutely filthy. I'm glad shes going back to uniform in September now!

@CountFosco

I've worked in various schools and on free dress days, the kid's who turn up in primark clothes do tend to get picked on by the ones who turn up in something designer.

If one of the senior school kids go walkabout, we can look around for them in town and they are a lot easier to spot in uniform than plain clothes

Our uniform Policy is Very sensible. We have logo polo shorts, sweatshirts and fleeces available but plain white / navy is totally fine along with grey bottoms.
My concern is the waste as kids grow out. The polo shirts are often ruined after a year but the sweatshirts rarely are.
We have a second hand swap shop (or did before Covid) and I will happily use it because I’m relatively wealthy and not worried about people thinking I can’t provide. But I know the poorer families won’t use second hand because they feel judged for not being able to afford new. It’s a tricky situation all about the psychology not the practicalities.

A generic school uniform should be OK, but it is the school logo stuff, which you can only buy from the school shop at exhorbitant prices.
Far better to have a badge to sew on (blazer), and otherwise plain generic stuff in school colours.
Separate stuff for PE, etc also adds to the cost. And dance attire (which I had at my state secondary school, many years ago, and hardly wore)

I'm a teacher and am very anti school uniform. Schools with smart, expensive uniforms attract parents (maybe because they think formal uniform equals good schools and well-behaved kids, which is obviously not true), but the parents then soon get fed up with the posh uniform when they realise how much it costs and their dc start losing bits of it.

The only even vaguely sensible argument in favour of uniform is the idea that it's a leveller, but even that isn't really true. In the absence of own clothes, kids will be judged on their bags, phones, trainers, stationery, lunch etc etc.

Uniform just becomes something to tell kids off about, which is a waste of teachers' time, has no effect on learning and creates a pointless extra source of aggro between teachers and kids. If most other countries manage perfectly well without it, why can't we?

Is the clothing bank supplying only families in need (by some definition), or is the uniform event for all-comers?

Ours is for all comers (the clothing bank itself needs a referral the rest of the year, just like a food bank but the school uniform events are different).

I'm not sure about second hand provision generally. Facebook seems to have a lot. The school I work in has its own second hand shop but that's a private school so I think it's more standard.

I suppose there could have been some who came just for easy access to second hand but I would imagine that queuing for 2 hours would be something you would only do if you were genuinely in need personally. Plus, because of Covid, everything was individually pre packed and labelled and just handed out by size and colour - families didn't even get to open them up and look. It's not a way of getting uniform that I think many would use by choice.

I think the idea is that school uniform is something many welcome help with, even if they're not normally classed as being in desperate need, and making people get referrals could be off putting and stigmatising. I think it's better to get the help out more widely, even if you do end up giving stuff to a few chancers.

I’m generally in favour of uniform, it makes things a lot simpler, but I’m not a fan of compulsory branded uniform.
Basic plain trousers and tops to match the school’s colour scheme should be enough, with logos optional.

My DC’s primary school have logos as an optional thing, and there’s quite a price difference between the branded clothes and the generic supermarket ones.

Although, having said that, I’m not very pleased that the school are insisting on pupils wearing uniform this year - we can afford it, yes, but when further lockdowns are a real possibility, it seems on the wasteful side to demand that parents kit the kids out in full uniform. Especially if they demand a fresh clean set of clothes every day like they were last term when years R/1/6 went back.

If you have generic supermarket uniform then in my experience it becomes the norm to have new uniform every year. Children whose parents struggle to stretch to afford that may stand out in uniform worn for two years or more, or second hand. DS had to have polo shirts and jackets with the logo for primary, but there was a good supply of good quality second hand uniform and it was the norm to buy big so uniform would fit for two years.

I'm a bit baffled as I found school uniform cheaper than a lot of non-uniform, and children have to wear clothes

This may well be true for new clothing but what about second hand?

If you think about an average charity shop - it might have 6 items of clothes in an age 7, for example. But it's not likely to have more than 6 items of school uniform in total, for all the sizes. You might get lucky and find a navy cardigan in an age 7. But you'd almost certainly find a jumper or cardigan in an age 7.

I know there's Ebay but that has postage charges and not everyone has access to the internet or PayPal.

On Facebook marketplace you can get whole bags of clothes in a specific size for very little.

I come from a poor home. Non uniform days were bloody awful. My family couldn't afford brands or styles. We literally had to have what clothes were cheap.

I do though think that schools have a responsibility to enable people to get their uniform cheaply in places like Tesco and Asda.

I agree re uniforms being too expensive and I've just spent £1600 for 5dc, 2 secondary and 3 primary, but I think the alternative is worse my ds11 got slated for having the "wrong" trainers last year, so if I had to try to clothe them all in top end fashion to avoid the bullies it would probably cost a lot more.

My son’s secondary serves a deprived area and I think their uniform requirements are ridiculous. The day to day stuff is just standard blazer and tie with logo and everything else can be optional, so supermarket is fine. But the p.e kit requires logo shorts, logo polo shirt, logo jumper, logo tracksuit bottoms, logo football socks and a pair of football boots. They also need trainers and a waterproof jacket, but these can be any brand. For a while, they told parents that the p.e. Items needed to be embroidered with your child’s initials! But that is now optional after understandable outrage.

At primary, none of it needs to have a logo. But just providing the standard stuff is difficult when we are both unemployed right now . Just two pairs of school shoes and the football boots costs well over £100 and I don’t feel confident that they’ll wear them for any length of time. The primary used to allow black trainers instead of smart shoes and I think they should go back to this now, taking into considering job losses and not getting wear out of school shoes if school is closed again, but they haven’t.

@Chezacheza

I don’t know what the answer is. I helped my my cousins dc uniform last year as she was really struggling. She also got a bit from the school nearly new shop.

Yet I’ve just spent £900 on two dc uniform

£900? Is this for a private school?

Uniforms are expensive nonsense. No evidence to link uniform to higher attainment. Internationally uniforms are a rarity. I moved my ds to a school that happened to be non - uniform. Bliss. Never experienced any problems re status you hear about. At the same time eldest was in 6th form with no uniform. Now I have 2 in uniform. Groan. And why do schools ignore government guidance/regs on ensuring uniforms are easily obtained and not from a single supplier. Any why do parents (including myself) never challenge it?

i like a uniform that can be bought from a supermarket ,what i hate is the school policing skirt length ,i have a 15yr old who is tall and skinny and currently in a age12 skirt, so yes it is not quite knee length , i have spent a fortune inculding buying school approved skirts, got called in to school about the length ,so took 10 of the skirts from various places and sizes that i had not yet returned in to school to show them that it is not as easy to buy a plain black non lycra skirt as they seem to think it is

Uniforms are also tending to be more expensive this year too as dc are expected to wear pe kit to school on pe days, so instead of logo top and logo leggings as before its now logo polo, logo leggings, logo track pants, logo socks, logo zip up fleece, logo skort and all of the above is compulsory jyst this for dd14 cost £243. State school, only 1 supplier

I definitely don’t think not wearing a school uniform would be any cheaper than shopping in George for school uniform. My DS is only in primary school so he doesn’t wear a blazer. I bought 2 jumpers in George for £6! That was both of them. Wear can you get 2 jumpers for that price for both for a 5 year old? Trousers wear around £9 for 2 pairs.

There is no competition with secondary school uniform.
You can only buy them mostly from one shop.
It cost me £200 and thats without the shirts,trousers, trainers,football boots, bag,mouth gard and stationary.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/school-uniform

worth a read

@jewel1968 I've read that and raised it with the school, however its "only guidlines" apparently.

Would you define yourself as poor?

People don't listen to the poor in my experience. They speak over them.

I have been poor. Buying uniform was the worst bit of every year. It made me cry.

I would have had ZERO cost if my children had not needed uniform. I got hand me downs of very nice clothes but they were not uniform.

£0 is definitely cheaper than the cost of any uniform.

I am no longer poor but you never forget!

@Backtobasics5

I definitely don’t think not wearing a school uniform would be any cheaper than shopping in George for school uniform. My DS is only in primary school so he doesn’t wear a blazer. I bought 2 jumpers in George for £6! That was both of them. Wear can you get 2 jumpers for that price for both for a 5 year old? Trousers wear around £9 for 2 pairs.

50p or less for a hoody at a car boot sale.

Have you ever been poor?

I think uniform is good however I think it should be purely polo/jumper of certain colour. Not blazers and ties and logo trousers etc. Just simple red jumper, white polo, black trousers etc.

I agree with whoever unthread said secondary should have hoodies.

I've always felt they should have set colour bottoms (navy/grey/black) skirt or trousers but no denim.
Then set coloured top for their colour code but free choice of what it is but must be plain. So shirt/blouse/polo/v neck t shirt and school hoody in the colour.

Children in secondary develop at all different rates and come come in all shapes and sizes and heights.

This encourages sticking to uniform in doilies but dressing smartley for what suits you and making choices about how to present yourself etc.

It's pretty much what I see as uniforms from backs to cafes to shops etc when I'm town. Far more practice for the world of work than a female in a mans shirt and tie and blazer.