AIBU to ask if people still think COVID-19 is fake

[doodledo92]

Just heard my elderly neighbour speaking to a mother neighbour saying "it's about time all this SHITE come to an end now". The other neighbour agreed saying "yes, people should have realised by now it's all FAKE"

AIBU to ask do people still believe this virus is fake?
I couldn't believe what I was hearing from the 2 of them.

@ClearTheDecks

Did the 1919 flu not come from chickens and pigs being kept in close quarters in wartime France?

I'm of a never say never frame of mind.

I agree with Faith. The goal appears to have shifted from not overwhelming the NHS to complete Covid elimination.

No, patient zero was a duck farmer from Kansas, Clear. In 1918 he was conscripted to go to the front during WWI and brought the disease with him to the barracks where he was trained. Some of them brought it to Europe.

Hundreds of people die in the UK every single day some of them old/ill some of them from previously undiagnosed conditions some of them perfectly healthy and killed in accidents as a result of crime.

I live in an area which was hit particularly hard.

The old, ill, and those with undiagnosed conditions weren't fucking expendable.

They would still be here if it weren't for covid-19. These are people whose families could have had years or decades together and now they don't.

Just because the MIGHT have died from some other cause doesn't mean we shouldn't make every effort to prevent those deaths.

I’m always intrigued by people who believe in an international governmental conspiracy as most of the world leaders I see on the news these days are barely capable of finding their own arses with both hands.
This is the best argument against it being a government conspiracy - who would be capable of it?

There are always one or two comments on the local Facebook page about it being fake but I think they are from the same couple of people. I don't pay much attention.

Yes, seems like quite a worrying number of people think it is fake. My theory is they can't handle the whole situation and this is how they deal with it.

Yes gwennah I agree. When did we get so lackadaisical about public health?

A UK conspiracy run by Boris , Matt Hancock and Dido.

Imagine it..

My sister thinks it's fake, invented by governments, to control people. She's frontline NHS.

It's a coping mechanism.

If we can't develop effective vaccines or treatments for Covid (and similar zoonotic viruses) it theoretically has the potential to become an extinction event. Many people can't cope with that thought. By comparison, they know where they are with conspiracy theories.

It's weird and disconcerting trying to talk to someone like this, though.

Statistically half the population are of below average intelligence.
A tendancy to seek simple answers to complex problems, alongside a lack of critical thinking inevitably leads many to conspiracy theories and snake oil salesmen sadly.
It is no coincidence that there is significant crossover between brexit/trump/climate change denial/anti vax/anti mask/covid-is-a-hoax (the list goes on!) disciples and many are literally the same people, unfortunately with some of the loudest voices (radio shows, newspaper columns etc) spreading and giving false legitimacy to some very dangerous ideas. Its not new and it will probably never change.

@ClearTheDecks. Excuse me. I thought you said swine flu. Forgive me. I’ve not eaten for 4 days and not slept for 2 (medical issues). It’s made me stupidly stupid!

Many of those now claim it’s really not that serious and are anti mask wearing and witter on about their civil liberties being taken away

I have heard that a lot too, sneering at mask wearers and thinking they are such critical thinkers and not sheep like everyone else.

Or if you do wear a mask you must be feverishly policing everyone else and enjoying the drama.

No middle ground people like me who just try and get on with following guidelines and not obsessing about what other people are doing.

Comparing it to a communist regime is really offensive and trite.

@ClearTheDecks Yes. The argument that the people who died from covid-19 related complications would have died from something else is like saying "Sorry you have cancer, but you'd just have died anyway so might as well just let it go."

The mind boggles at the hideous lack of empathy for real people.

Just because the MIGHT have died from some other cause doesn't mean we shouldn't make every effort to prevent those deaths.

Well, we've sure done that when it comes to those who have cancer just now or may have had - stopped their treatments (particularly among those who were terminally ill, some of them could have had some more time), given them less aggressive treatments due to Covid, delayed treatment or screening or follow up. Tens of thousands of them. Guess they are considered expendable because it wasn't Covid. They weren't given a choice.

Not to mention just about every other condition out there.

And disabled people having all their support taken from them at a stroke in many cases.

I don’t know any who think it’s fake. Not sure why think ICU was over run or the death toll came from of they think it’s fake.

I know many who don’t follow the rules/guidelines as they haven’t yet been personally affected by anyone with it.

I've heard the 5g thing but not that it's fake. What would the purpose of faking it be? control?

"This virus is now just one of the many that circulate amongst humans, and like those other viruses it the symptoms it causes vary in severity, from people just carrying the virus to causing fatal complications.

Hundreds of people die in the UK every single day some of them old/ill some of them from previously undiagnosed conditions some of them perfectly healthy and killed in accidents as a result of crime.

Life is not safe - death is inevitable and unpredictable.

We didn't live in fear of this fact before we need to learn not to be again."

Thousands of people might die every day for all sorts of reasons. However if you are in your 40's catching covid at least doubles your risk of dying that year ( from all causes you refer to) If you are in your 50's it at least triple it and in your 60's the on average is about 5 times the normal risk. That is without thinking about chronic condition conditions that add to your risk which become more common with age.

It is perfectly rational to be a little more cautious about how you go about living your life with the pand mic going on. It's pretty patronising to tell others about how life is risky and you shouldn't let covid affect your life as you might get killed by a criminal.

If a vaccine proves to be impossible then we may need to adjust to a new normal where covid causes life expectancy to fall and people attitude to mortality/ risk has to change but it seems pretty premature to to jump to that conclusion already.

@Badbadbunny

They're losing everything to a disease with a mortality rate nearly as low as flu

It's stupid comments like that which are the problem. Yes, numbers are similar, but it killed 45k in just a couple of months DESPITE the lockdown, precautions etc. Highly likely it would have been 450K if left to run wild. 45K in two months is VERY different to 45K over an average year. People need to understand exponential growth which is what was happening in February and March.

Exponential growth. Every so many days, cases double. The higher the transmission rate, the less days to double. Before lockdown, it was about every 3 days. It's much slower now, but if you don't stop those little numbers, they become bigger numbers pretty quickly.

1
2
4
8
16 Why are we worrying about this, more chance of getting struck by lightning
32
64
128
256
512
1024 I can't believe people are making this much fuss over such a tiny percentage of the population
2048
4096
8192
16384
32768 - stop me when you think we have a problem
65536
131072 - getting some pretty big jumps here, aren't we?
262144
524288 - maybe we should have done something a bit earlier....
1048576
2097152

That's not very likely considering Sweden never locked down and has less deaths than the UK.

[quote gwenneh]@ClearTheDecks Yes. The argument that the people who died from covid-19 related complications would have died from something else is like saying "Sorry you have cancer, but you'd just have died anyway so might as well just let it go."

The mind boggles at the hideous lack of empathy for real people.[/quote]
People who have cancer have heard that already. I work with a lot of cancer charities because my daughter died from it. I wonder if there will ever be any way to count or quantify just how many lives that could have been saved or who could have had more time did not due to the obsession with totally eliminating Covid19. As it is, people who have cancer, particularly replapsed, are commonly told this due to some treatments which might give them more time being deemed too expensive. No Nightengale hospitals for cancer. As for people suicidal from mental health conditions, that's a standard answer they're used to hearing often enough.

@JKRowlingismyQueen It's not entirely true that Sweden didn't lock down. They didn't have the same very strict rules that a lot of the rest of the world did, but they certainly closed a lot of businesses and many people started to work from home and socially distance.

JKRowlingIsMyQueen but even Sweden didn't just continue as normal, they implemented SD and trusted their population to follow the guidelines.

"Sweden never locked down and has less deaths than the UK."

Sweden has a much smaller population, has much lower population density, and apparently a far more compliant population. Although they never had a formal lockdown implemented plenty of social distancing measures.

At the height of the first wave in the uk cases were doubling every 3 days. Without a lockdown it would have continued to do so or perhaps accelerated. How high would the peak have gone? We don't know and thankfully never will. The government of most countries are still aware of how exponential growth works and are stamping down hard on outbreaks for that reason.

That's not very likely considering Sweden never locked down and has less deaths than the UK

Sweden has a lower population and don't live on top of one another. Our lockdown, with people still crammed onto public transport and schools never totally closing was probably comparable to their normal, where it is a lot easier to avoid crowds.

I have a lovely, intelligent friend who thinks the same as your friend, #DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult
It does worry me!

Wasnt it all about creating a lockdown so the CIA could recharge the birds?

@RoseTintedAtuin

Ah well the “man made” is a very different question. We are very capable of genetically manipulating viruses and biological warfare is still an open field so it would be likely the Big players are competing to be best. And look how effective it would be as a weapon! It is unusual for a virus to adapt for human to human transmission quickly and this one seemed to do it in weeks. So I’d still think that idea has some credit to it. It has certainly been debunked that this came from a bat sold at the Wuhan market and spread from there.

How do you know how long it took to adapt to humans? How would anyone know when it began the process?

And how was it debunked about the bat/wuhan market? I'd love to see a link.