A Level U turn

[Jargo]

Holy shit, now based on teacher predictions.

@Dishwashersaurous Grades can only go up, not down.

But yes, what happens to people who say went through clearing and now the university has to offer their place to someone who didn't reach the grade on Thursday, but has done now?

@manicinsomniac

This is great news for the affected students' long term future.

but it's presumably come too late to stop many missing out on their first choice (or any choice) university place. It's been several days, good universities will be full by now.

My understanding - I work in HE but not admissions, so happy to be corrected - is that a conditional offer is essentially a contract, it isn't an option for the university to say 'you've met your offer (now) but we're full so you still don't have an place'. What that means in practice, though, is very unclear; the most popular universities can't just find space for all those extra people. And if they do other universities, who are much more reliant on clearing, will go bust.

but if they lift the cap, where will all the students live??

Oh I know there’s other problems if the cap is lifted, but if it’s not then the entire conversation is a non-starter.

It was the only thing to do - the algorithm was eye wateringly unfair - but what an enormous headache for universities. No doubt the government will drop this bomb then leave universities to try to sort it all out...

@manicinsomniac

noble but if they lift the cap, where will all the students live?? They can't instantly build new halls/colleges. Especially if they'll never be needed again. I assumed caps were to do with how many could be accommodated per year, not taught?

The caps were to stop the Russell Group madly recruiting to make up for their lost international students and so other universities going bust because their student numbers dropped below viability. Which might be exactly what now happens.

How do the numbers of overseas students affect things this year? If there are fewer international students does that give Universities some wiggle room?

I don't think the number of international students has fallen as people predicted according to the ucas daily releases, so some unis are going to have a real problem now with capacity

@noblegiraffe

There’s a cap on student numbers that was expected to be lifted at the same time as this announcement so that unis could accept more students, however this announcement hasn’t been made. So no idea if that’s coming later, or if those who lost out on offers are screwed.

Once they've worked out that removing the cap benefits the RG (cos everyone will want to ditch their place acquired in Clearing and trade up), and reduces the numbers going to the lower ranked unis, I'm sure it'll be removed....

GW needs to resign

GW needs to resign

Also, DC, BJ. . .

What would be the purpose of GW resigning?

Yes, he's utterly incompetent but it's not as though there's someone more capable waiting in the wings.

Overseas applications to UK unis have held up more than expected, BUT, unis are unclear how many of those students will be able to take up their places due to travel restrictions, visas issues etc - so another headache for them.

The cap has been lifted which helps.

I wonder if some of the Covid planning unis have done - increasing remote learning etc will help a little with the logistical pressure. It might give students and unis time to sort out support, accommodation etc.

As a number of 'home' students will have decided to defer starting uni until next year, hopefully universities will have enough space this year to accommodate at least some of those students who now have the required grades. If not, in some cases they'll offer them a place for 2021 but not in all cases, as that would be unfair to those taking their A levels next year (Canbridge have already said this).

My understanding - I work in HE but not admissions, so happy to be corrected - is that a conditional offer is essentially a contract, it isn't an option for the university to say 'you've met your offer (now) but we're full so you still don't have an place

Yes that’s correct. The government will know the absolute difference between cags and moderated, so I suspect it’s not that huge a differential.

@manicinsomniac

This is great news for the affected students' long term future.

but it's presumably come too late to stop many missing out on their first choice (or any choice) university place. It's been several days, good universities will be full by now.

They're not going to be able to refuse if applicants have met the requirements of conditional offers, are they?

@christinarossetti19

What would be the purpose of GW resigning?

Yes, he's utterly incompetent but it's not as though there's someone more capable waiting in the wings.

... Yes but the new bod would be an incompetent shit who has not - yet - fucked up,

as compared to an incompetent shit who has just fucked up serially

Government must supply any extra funds needed

Money won't solve all problems, but it can help a lot

@manicinsomniac

noble but if they lift the cap, where will all the students live?? They can't instantly build new halls/colleges. Especially if they'll never be needed again. I assumed caps were to do with how many could be accommodated per year, not taught?

Now is obviously the time to invest in potential student accommodation in University towns.

I hope they think about what's going to happen to next year's cohort when they take GCSEs and A-Levels - given the variety of education and learning they will have experienced.

@christinarossetti19

Because he is shit at his job. If you are incompetent you get sacked. A tory minister shouldn't be exempt from this. The rest of the world works in this way.

Same mess as in Scotland. Same devaluing of grades.

[quote DrManhattan]@christinarossetti19

Because he is shit at his job. If you are incompetent you get sacked. A tory minister shouldn't be exempt from this. The rest of the world works in this way.[/quote]
Would be good if you could persuade John Swinney to go at the same time (Scottish Government) for presiding over exactly the same mess.

@Jargo although 40% of grades were downgraded it doesn't mean 60% will receive lower grades - only a very small proportion were upgraded (eg 85 downgrades at ds school, only 5 upgrades). Many pupils got their CAG - it seems lower ranked students who 'fell off' the end of the algorithm scale will benefit (e.g. those with CAG of B who ended up with an E)

@IncidentsandAccidents

It was the only thing to do - the algorithm was eye wateringly unfair - but what an enormous headache for universities. No doubt the government will drop this bomb then leave universities to try to sort it all out...

They shouldn't have been so hasty to turn students away who had offers and a. Rot those who didn't. They should have just waited, this U turn was entirely predictable.