To limit contact with siblings

[pancakeloverrr]

My brother and sister both constantly tell me my plans/vision for my career are not 'happening' or 'going to be v. Difficult' (it's not, it's a model used many times by a lot of people in my profession).

I am unable to really go into it further but it's always some shaming of my incompetence, and I would like to limit my contact with them.

They bring me down, some else I know is able to accomplish what they did due to them being more 'clever'.

Then they say what they said is out of 'love'.

Am I being unreasonable to keep my career plans to myself and keep it very light during family gatherings? Or should I cut contact unless my mum wants to see everyone ?

I'm at the end of my tether with my siblings.

Where do you fit in age order? Are you the same youngest by any chance?

I'm in a similar but different situation: much younger sibling of a jealous sister. Spent a week on and off with her and mum and her recently, and had a horrendous time. Was in tears many times, woke up feeling sick every morning and couldn't wait to get home. My mother's is scared of her (she's a histrionic narc) so will do whatever it takes to appease her, usually sacrificing me in the process. She told me on my recent visit she 'didn't realise it upset me so much' - something she's said before. The truth is she can't face me being upset so ignores it and pretends it doesn't happen until she believes it. She'll no doubt already have 'forgotten, how awful last week was, and will be expecting a repeat later in the year (especially because my sister had a 'great time' and that's all that matters!!!!)

I have as little to do with my sister as possible. I certainly couldn't see her weekly. For a decade I saw her once every five years and that was manageable. She's pathetic really, and I should pity her but it's hard when being confronted by her in the flesh. Keeping her at a distance is best.

Yes, I have had many rows with both of them. I've left in the middle of supper and told them they're a nasty bunch, anti-intellectuals, etc. dealing with my anger.

Brother is high up in his company- not much education but makes a ton. For him, money is the only thing that matters, whereas for me, helping clients and being a advocate is more important. I judge myself by how many people I help, and do pretty well financially to take a break when DD was born.

Mum has seen us fight, and calls me the next day to say that everyone needs to be more kind, but that at the end of the day, they're my siblings. And she won't allow me not to break off the relationship. So she will then have 'talks' with my brother or sister and go off on them, they'll text me a week later acting like nothing happened.

Mum really wants us to get along, she told me it would literally break her into pieces if we were not a big happy family despite our differences. She has also accused me of being too argumentative, with too much passion, that it angers them.

I dislike them a lot, I have always had many close friends that have been my 'sisters', and it bothers my sister and mum.

This seems very toxic, but my mum has repeatedly told me 'your friends won't be there when times get tough, but your sister will, despite her crass behaviour."

Maybe I don't want my sister to be there for me due to her countless insults and laughing them off? Mum doesn't get it, I can't even make her understand. She seems to think this is just sibling rivalry and that it's normal. 'Your sister doesn't have children, she is not married, she's not as educated, give her some sympathy, please. Don't you feel a bit sorry for her?'

I am thinking of going low contact with all of them- they make me feel awful when I'm around them.

Thank you all for responding; I do know none of their insults and abuse is normal.

I just love mum to death, really have had a tough time not giving her her days of the entire family being together. She raised us as a single mom, and she would do anything for her kids. She still thinks we are at that place, and can't see how they have made me feel for decades.

@TimeIhadaNameChange

I am the middle child. Typical, isn't it.

A barrister with a former “mentor”, ok...

This past Christmas, I purchased premium skincare products on offer for my mum, and when mum opened her gift, she was so delighted since she she never spends on herself.

Sister's response? 'She bought it on offer! How cheap!'

Yes, I did buy it on offer, but it still cost me a lot. It's that type of dig into anything I do that just spoils my mood.

Mum said 'well how smart of her! I love them!'

This is typical sister response to anything I do. Why would I want to be around her?

Your sister will definitely be there if/when things get tough for you: what a brilliant opportunity for her to gloat!

There's a similar dynamic in my family, except it was our parents who decided I would be the black sheep and my brothers just went along with it. The other difference is that I'm objectively less successful career-wise than them, although none of us is as successful as you. I guess your story illustrates that becoming an overachiever doesn't make siblings stop putting us down, because that just brings out the jealousy. Your mum is very wrong to turn a blind eye and accuse you of being "sensitive": she might feel a bit sensitive too if she were the one enduring a barrage of insults at every meal!

I agree that you should start to become unavailable. If moving away isn't a good option for you, at least do what a PP suggests and set up a schedule clash so you have a good reason to be unavailable. (You already have plenty of good reasons, but you need a bland, socially acceptable one that you're happy to say to anyone's face.)

I am sure from my own experience that the less you see of these people, the less you will ruminate on their low opinion of you. I bet you don't obsessively think about some neighbour kid who was mean to you when you were five - siblings obviously have more ongoing opportunities for this sort of thing, but only if you let them have access to you. If you go for low contact (a good start) obviously don't tell them your plans. Make up something ridiculous if necessary,so it becomes you winding them up rather than the other way around. Eventually, they will turn into just people you used to know. Sure, the hurt will remain a bit - they are your siblings after all - but you will feel much better. Never mind your mum, she has enabled this behaviour so she'll have to live with the consequences!

@Charlottejbt

I'm wondering now why mum keeps excusing their behaviour; yet telling me she needs me to be a part of the family she envisions as opposed to the reality of our family dynamic.

I'm the black sheep- always have been. It matters not what I do or achieve; it just will be that im deficient in some way. And they loudly boast about it - whether true or not.

I'm devasted that this is the way it is. I wish to have a loving family. It seems like biting my tongue or talking to them about their behaviour gets me nowhere.

@Charlottejbt

Success is all relative isn't it. It matters not what you achieve - if you're the one they use as a punching bag, it'll never stop. You could become the next prime minister and somehow they will say something to denigrate how you got there, or 'what do prime ministers actually do for us anyway'. Stuff like that.

OP - Surely it is very obvious your siblings are jealous of you. You need to keep your distance or cut them off and do it now!!

Your mum will get over it. Your mental health and self esteem should be your number one priority.

@Charlottejbt

When I was younger- I wanted to be a pianist. Whether is made any money or not, that was my dream. I played relatively well, but I knew watching others I did not have the talent they possessed.

I gave up on my dream of a being one- not due to the money issue (pianist or lesson teachers do not make much), but I saw that my passion was in advocacy (probably due to being bullied by my siblings).

We are all successful in our own right- the teachers, the SAHMs, the nurses, store clerks, etc etc . It's not normal FOR ME that my siblings shit on me any chance they get. I don't care what my occupation is!!!

Your siblings seem to add nothing to your life except pain. I think it would be perfectly reasonable to limit your contact with them. Although your mother would like to pretend that you are all one big happy family, it isn't fair for her to expect you to maintain relationships simply to support her fantasy. It absolutely isn't up to your mother to decide how much contact you have with your siblings.

I had always had a close relationship with my siblings, and I expected it would last forever. But one brother has recently behaved in an appalling way toward me. Maybe someday we will become close again. For now I want nothing to do with him. It is extremely painful. I think for you it might be easier to cut contact with your siblings, because you haven't ever had that closeness. It will be no loss to you to back away. In fact, it will be a tremendous gain.

Your mother has a dream and a wish, and it matters so much to her that she cannot see past her dream to what -actually- exists. Her hard times were probably so hard that the thought of a loving family was all that kept her going.

But as Lady Catherine said "it was the dearest wish of Mr Darcy's mother that he and my Daughter marry"... and Elizabeth answered "then you and she did all you could, but now it's down to the principles involved".

Your mum did all she could, but its now down to your siblings and you. You want a kind relationship; they don't. Until they do, if they ever do, nothing will change. This is what you've got.

You have to protect yourself.

principals* sigh

@SeaEagleFeather

You are spot on. My mum got through her late hours of being a nurse and being the sole provider after my dad passed, by being a good mum. Never whining.

She struggled financially raising three young kids alone, and always made sure to forego things for herself to give us what she could. She additionally felt unwarranted grief for us due to growing up without a father. And she always told me as a young child we are all that keeps her going. That her long shifts were not difficult bc she had us.

But you're right about one thing - I cannot make my siblings want a healthy relationship with me. I can only protect myself and my DD from the type of relationship we do have.

I needed to get this off my chest. And accept that things won't change unless everyone is willing to have a healthy relationship.

They seem to dislike a lot about me. And I can't help their feelings. They can sit around without me and continue with their pathetic analysis of my 'pitiful' life- while I happily raise my DD and get back to work!

@pancakeloverrr Wow, you're a gifted pianist as well?! I know that wasn't the main point of your anecdote, but I'm really impressed.

Anyway, I totally agree that it's self-defined success that matters, and that life isn't a competition. If I dwell nowadays on my oack of outward success relative to that of others, it's usually an attempt at self-motivation: "Pull your finger out, woman! Do you want [name of obnoxious relative or former classmate] to be more successful than you?" It works pretty well when I'm stuck in a lazy rut. :)

They can sit around without me and continue with their pathetic analysis of my 'pitiful' life- while I happily raise my DD and get back to work!

That's the spirit! They will sound pretty stupid blaming and obsessing over someone they barely or never see. And they won't be your problem any more. I find that the more I focus on my own goals, the less I worry about what other people think, even family. Hitting 40 a few years back has also worked wonders when it comes to not giving a damn.

They seem to dislike a lot about me. And I can't help their feelings. They can sit around without me and continue with their pathetic analysis of my 'pitiful' life- while I happily raise my DD and get back to work!

Good stuff :)

In a funny way you serve a function for them: to unite them so it's 2 against 1 and they can feel superior. It probably actually makes it worse that you -are- successful. You've hit the nail on the head: you can be there for these "analyses" or you can be absent, but they'll go on either way.

Haters gonna hate. Even siblings.

Don't discuss your life with them, ever. Don't answer questions, don't volunteer information. Deflect, change the subject, ignore. As a barrister you know all the techniques - use them on your family.

(I used to go out with a barrister - never, ever won an argument!)

@Charlottejbt

Yes, an accomplished pianist to my mum , not very good when competing against others.

But yes-In my honest assessment, my mum is a true success. A single mum working erratic hours as a nurse trying to make ends meet, raising 3 kids alone, being a widow, crying with us when she had to forego so many things for us and explaining why, telling us we can only afford second hand bikes, second hand pianos), but having the strength to give us lovely birthday parties with lots of other kids. So much fun!

TO ME, she is a success. It's all relative.

Good luck, @pancakeloverrr.

Don't allow your love and obligation to your mother guilt you into these family gatherings. Low contact sounds essential for your mental health.

The last thing I want to state that I cannot ever forgive my siblings for is neither came to visit me in the hospital when my DD was born!!!! How are they even family? They live in the same town, it was easy to get to, but their excuse? I was not in good shape and they didn't think it was all that important considering they had a lot going on?

Neither have kids, neither are married.

I feel so much pain and resentment remembering laying there. My friends came to visit, some sent flowers. But NOTHING, not even a card, from these two heartless people!

I am definitely going low contact, or no contact soon.

@pancakeloverrr

I am definitely going low contact, or no contact soon.
I think this is the right thing for YOU, OP. You have been remarkably patient thus far in biting your tongue to spare your mother. You now have to do what's right for you.

Be strong now and be prepared to protect yourself both from their incredulity and anger that you would go LC/NC with them. Also, protect yourself from your mother who loves you, but doesn't seem to appreciate that her other children are doing to you. That will be harder for you than withdrawing from your siblings. Be very honest with her though - don't hold back on how you've been made to feel for so long.

Don't allow this:
Mum has seen us fight, and calls me the next day to say that everyone needs to be more kind, but that at the end of the day, they're my siblings.

dissuade you from the decision you've come to. You are not the one not being kind.

Lean as needed on your DP/DH and your friends. You will need their support I think. Good luck. 🌹

Had a short but very stern convo with mum- she lost her cool and said she understands but to take away my daughter from having a uncle and aunt who live her (they don't even call o. Her bday?!!!) is cruel to my child.

But she did say as long as she gets to see me and be a part of my family, especially her only grandchild, she's understands, though she is not the least bit happy about their behaviour or me not wanting to work on things.

She kept going on and on about how she doesn't liek everything about her sisters but she wouldn't dream of a life without them. (I guess I'm still the monster of the family).

I feel crushed to be stern with her, but it needed to be done.

That must have been hard, OP. Keep it up... 🌹

I think your loyalty to your mum does you a huge amount of credit. My three DCs are the same with me: perhaps it's characteristic of single parent families. It was immensely unfair of your mum to blame you for the situation and accuse you of cruelty to your DD though - the situation is not of your making, and it would be worse if your DD saw you being treated as a scapegoat. I wish I'd stood up to my parents more and sooner and thus modelled better family relations for my DCs, but they were our landlords so it was tricky.