To take my family and go live in Gibraltar

[wigglysmiggle]

Dh is currently working from home until at least next year.
Dc about to return to private school and this year has been incredibly stressful for us financially, I now don't want to commit to fees for the rest of time after the scare of this year but our local state is rubbish and I'm finding it all extra complicated due to coronavirus, I did contact some state schools to see if they had space but I didn't get a reply.

Dh thinks he's in a good position to negotiate permanent wfh with the odd trip to London which is easy enough from Gibraltar. We would sort that out before we go.

We were about to sign a new rent contract due to our current landlord selling where we live in the U.K. but that's fallen through. I hate the town where we live and feel stuck due to the school and even if we move to a nicer area there's no guarantee we would get a place in a good school.

We had already planned to move to Gibraltar last year but at the final interview for a job there my dh was told they weren't actually going to hire someone after all and so we stayed in U.K. and stopped looking.
Now I'm thinking of just moving out there while we're both wfh, the rental here has fallen through and I am fed up with everything's that's gone on.

Renting in Gibraltar would be cheaper than where we rent now, and both of us will attempt to get a job there once we have an address as I've heard it's easier to get a job with a local address, we both are in careers that are available there but regardless my job is stable and I wfh permanently anyway so we'd have an income. If it doesn't work out I believe we can always return to the U.K. no school fees means we would be much better off financially and more able to save.
Wibu to just go for it and get dc into a school there? We have no family to leave behind and I can't think why we wouldn't other than pure fear of the unknown,

Do I need sense talked into me? Literally thinking of cancelling school fees, getting out there and restarting life before dc too old to do it (they are in primary)

Gibraltar has good weather, macaques and I imagine it's a great place for children, especially where learning is concerned but what are the people like? Is there quite an insular culture, where people talk of 'newcomers' or are they generally welcoming to all?

How would your employers feel about you being based in Gib? What if they need you for a meeting? Who pays for the travel and hotel?

WFH means you are well situated for a move, but think carefully because if one of your jobs goes pop, how are you going to manage? Do either of you speak Spanish?

I wouldn’t. As a previous poster suspected Gibbos are not welcoming to outsiders, the job market relies on nepotism and most people who aren’t local live in Spain because it’s cheaper. Also the non Fee paying schools are not great and most people with any cash choose to go private in Spain anyway. Brexit could mean a huge change to the job market so it would be a very risky move.

How old are your children? I lived there for a few years as a teen and was accepted by the other kids with no problems, but I think younger children can find it a bit harder to integrate.

I lived in Gibraltar a while. I found the rent very expensive and struggled to buy a property as there are some odd mortgage requirements. There's a few supermarkets including a Morrisons but it is so expensive! Most Brits live in Spain for a cheaper lifestyle.

The days that cruise ships were docked were awful as Main St was just packed out.

I'm not sure what else to say but please do DM me with any questions.

Thanks for the replies. I work entirely from home no meetings have done for years. Only go to office about once a year for Christmas with a gift!
My dh is happy to do this and all of his meetings are now via video calls around the world and the company is actually trying to cut costs through continuing this and reducing office space etc. If he really had to come back to U.K. for a meeting we would cover the cost.

@DebbieFiderer why do younger dc not integrate? Dc year 2&3 from September. We don't speak Spanish but I do understand a lot of it and have grandparents that live an hour from the border, forgot that bit, the only family we have left is actually in Spain, I would be happy to integrate as fully as we could but obviously if the locals don't allow for it then perhaps would be a mistake to attempt it.

Thanks @SuperPixie247 we wouldn't really go for cheaper cost of living more for a change of scenery and break from our current situation. Would consider returning to the U.K. for senior schools if it didn't really work out in the long term.
Feel like if we don't try we won't know but obviously not looking to make a massive mistake.

I hate to be dull but yiur DHs employer will need to know if he's working for them from overseas, because if he remains on a UK company payroll but he is working outside the UK permanently it causes all kinds of tax problems for both his personal tax and the company tax. So yes you might BU unless you are upfront with your employers about it!

Sorry didn't read thread properly, both of your employers will need to know if you are both on a UK payroll

There will be.tax implications if you WFH won't there?

We went for a week a couple of years ago and I was claustrophobic after about three days. There must be more congenial places to go for a change of scene.

Do you need to speak Spanish? It is the UK.

Only spent one day there and didn’t notice any Spanish in shops.

Traffic and parking was horrendous

What does yohr employer say about it? I know when we had someone wanting tondo similar there was a condition of employment that meant we couldn't have anyone outside of the UK due to tax and bizarrely, IT.

An amazing tiny bit of Britain. Literally walk round in a few minutes or leisurely a few hours. Highly recommended but as some may have said already you will need to double check with your accountant/tax adviser/wealth manager/financial advisor as to latest terms Brexshit and tax status with your employer etc.

Very small but ideal for exploring rest of Spain and Mediterranean by car and of course pop over to another world just a short ferry ride away (or shortest intercontinental flight) to the delights and contrasts of Morocco etc.

A lovely lady bastion of olde England but make sure you use up your local Gibraltar pounds cash there (or insist of English change) as although same value it's hardly excepted back in mainland UK.

Real estate despite Brexit is still expensive (per square foot) and always in limited supply as "locals" tend to live a short walk over the Spanish boarder and only buy deep duty free alcohol and fuel but everything else in Spain.

It's on my return radar but with Covid and Brexit plus Monarch (formerly cheap UK Gibraltar shuttles) I am having a rethink on future plans. I personally believe Gibraltar, possibly Malta too etc will suit your average Mums Net type!

Most Gibs are bilingual Spanish and English.

It’s not the U.K. It’s a crown dependency.

Island mentality although not an island. Think carefully.

I would be very worried about the effect of Brexit.

I don't think it's easy to get a bank account in Gibraltar - but you may not need it. I liked it but crowded in summer - in normal times. Also difficult to get a hotel booking - seemed everything always booked up.

I would. A great opportunity to try out living there before taking the risk of handing in notice. If you hate it no loss. If you like it, probably easier to get a job there. Win win.

The education I found was poor, my DD who was 9 at the time Was assessed on return to UK and was over 6 months behind even though they follow the same curriculum.

Locals are nice enough, however there is still a lot of resentment towards the UK. The housing is expensive and the country as a whole is a concrete jungle.

You'd be far better moving to Spain and sending kids to the international school.

I think tax problems will be your main issue. I work for a Uk registered financial services company and they've had massive problems with lots of directors buggering off to work from Spain, France and Italy this summer.

Also as management of confidential information and data varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, they will need to be aware and cover you for working from Gibraltar....

I live in Gib . I think you either love it or hate it, most love the place. There is always something going on, it is cosmopolitan, full of history friendly and safe. Sunshine 300 days a year ( though bloody hot this weekend 35 plus ). The schools are good with excellent exam pass rates. Direct flights to U.K. You don't have to speak Spanish though it is desirable, the local lingo is Llanito a mix of English/ Spanish so you learn quickly. Downside is it is very expensive to get accomodation here, many rent in Spain. If you want open country and don't like noise then live in Spain. There are 30,000 people here but you can make friends easily the locals are very friendly as long as you make the effort to join in. Kids have loads to do sports, dance etc and you can walk around and feel safe at all hours. We have Morrisons a small Tesco M&S and Eroski plus several other supermarkets or you can shop in Spain.

I have friends from Gibraltar and as a country it sounds lovely to live but they are incredibly concerned about the impact of Brexit and what it will mean for their future. Spain have made no bones about the fact they want Gibraltar 'back' and may resort to incredibly strict border controls to force the country into a terrible position from an economic and supply perspective.

Very risky time to consider moving there.

Best of luck but it's not something I'd even consider doing until Brexit dust has settled.

I'm aware it's not U.K. and yes good points. I will check with finance tomorrow to see about tax implications. Both our employers are laid back easy going and we don't think should be a massive problem unless it will cost them in extra taxes.
We do own a small property in the U.K. that we don't live in (now used as a holiday let) but would keep as a base to go to and from the U.K. easily. This would also allow dh to stay there to get into London if necessary.

It's actually due to brexit we wouldn't consider Spain. Grandparents live there but are able to apply for residency. I think we're too late in the day for that. I didn't realise Spain will have so much of a say in what happens to Gibraltar. Would that mean U.K. citizens would be affected then and no longer allowed to reside there? Or simply that tensions are high?
I think I'm going to try to go out there next week and start asking around and then have a serious think about everything, this thread is very helpful.

Shame to hear the schools might not be so good. Despite dc in private here I do a lot of work at home with them so would be willing to continue this though.

Don’t assume you can cross the border with ease
I was there once and the Spanish Police decided to check every single passport, we were there for hours
Brexit would worry me