To think the monarchy will end with the death of Queen Elizabeth 2

[Gingertea2020]

As an Aussie am curious to know if British monarchy can really prevail beyond life of Queen.

Recently there has been the biography of Megxit and details, intricate, of the fall out between the two Princes and their wives.

Added to this there is the Prince Andrew saga.

With all that is happening in world, will it really continue ?

I can’t imagine a Prince Charles.

I genuinely wonder why the British bother with it all.

Prince Charles will be Regent that's all.

Unless the Queen becomes mentally incapacitated I doubt PC will ever be formally created as Regent - he will just gradually take on more and more of the Queen's duties, as he has already started doing.

MrsNoah

It's a good thing none is saying anyone is tied to anything, then.

But many people think that the symbolic parts of a government also should be considered carefully.

If you take a more practical view, then the empirical fact is that constitutional monarchies have a very good track record as a form of government, it works well, it tends to be very stable, it has some inherent flexibility. Changing the whole form because you don't like it from an ideological POV is a lot like thinking about it as a symbol.

@BadLad

*A regency just makes even more of a mockery of the whole farcical setup."

"We hail Prince George! We hail Prince George!" "We hate Prince George, sir. We hate Prince George."

I definitely think it would be appropriate to put it to a referendum, as it's a discussion that needs to happen. There are also different forms of Republic so it's simplistic to think of it as one or another. Countries like France and the US give the President too much power; President Macron replaced the PM because the previous PM was too popular, as he handled the pandemic very well. As for Trump, there really isn't anything to say.

By contrast, in Germany and the Irish Republic, the President have a President that's above politics and that would be the system I would favour.

But it depends who stands. We could end up with President Johnson or President Starmar. Or worse, President Farage (that's a joke btw). Or maybe Lord Sugar should emulate Trump in hosting a TV show called the Apprentice. (He would be a lot better than Trump, though.)

You obviously realise that Charles or William could stand for election, as they would be private citizens.

We could end up with President Coe or President Beckam with Victoria as First Lady (she'd love that).

In reality, Charles has spoken about slimming down the Monarchy, so there won't be all the hangers on that annoy people now. That would reduce the incentive to abolish the Monarchy. What's far more likely is Scotland becoming independent.

Apologies for being a bit facetious; it would be really good to have a proper discussion and referendum.

@Pelleas

Only if his mum lives to a minimum of 103 which, even with her genes, would be a stretch.

Not that much of a stretch - her mother lived to 101 and by all accounts drank much more heavily than QEII. The present queen will also have benefited from healthcare advances since her mother's early lifespan and having the care given to royals all her life, whereas her mother only married into the RF aged 23.

The QM was a member of the aristocracy, she had the best of healthcare available from birth too.

The Queen will be 100 when Prince Charles is 77. It’s highly unlikely she’ll live far into his 80s.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Queen reaches 105.

It was considered normal that children should come out to comfort the mob after their Mum had just died and then walk publicly behind her coffin in their own grief.

I thought the whole thing was sick. The crowds insisting on the princes coming to shake hands so they could share their grief. Diana was their mother, that had been completely lost sight of.

Yes, it was awful. As was taking them to church the morning their mum died. The entire handling of Diana’s death was one of the Queen’s very rare major mis steps.

I wouldn’t put money on the Queen living to any age. I doubt she’d be far behind Philip. It’s very common for both to go very quickly after decades of marriage. He’s definitely not going to make 110.

The only thing the royal family got right around the death of Diana was staying quiet and keeping the two Princes in the privacy of Balmoral.

The British public and their ridiculous sense of entitlement over their "grief" forced them to change what they were doing rather than realising that she was being a Granny and they were focussing on two children who'd just lost their mother.

I wouldn’t put money on the Queen living to any age. I doubt she’d be far behind Philip. It’s very common for both to go very quickly after decades of marriage. He’s definitely not going to make 110.

I've thought this too.

I wouldn’t put money on the Queen living to any age.

At 94 she already has lived to a good age, she's way older than the average life expectancy for women.

the empirical fact is that constitutional monarchies have a very good track record as a form of government, it works well, it tends to be very stable, it has some inherent flexibility

Correlation is not causation. You seem to be assuming that countries with constitutional monarchies are stable, because they are constitutional monarchies. In fact, constitutional monarchies are stable because they exist in a region (western Europe), where all the countries - monarchies and republics - are politically stable. All these countries experience political turbulence at times, but there is no evidence that democracies with a monarchy outperform democracies without one.

Other than Japan, the only constitutional monarchies that exist in democracies are in western Europe (or are ruled by European monarchies, in the case of Australia & NZ). Every country in western Europe is stable, in the sense that they continue to function as democracies. The country that experienced the greatest challenge to its stability in the 21st century - Greece - is not a monarchy but it has remained politically stable despite the turbulence. Monarchies did not do any better than republics in their response to the 2008: Spain was one of the worst affected countries, for example, whereas Germany was one of the least affected.

In the 20th century, two out of three of the countries in western Europe that initiated aggression/oppression (Germany and Spain) were monarchies.

It was considered normal that children should come out to comfort the mob after their Mum had just died and then walk publicly behind her coffin in their own grief.

It was horrific. Those poor boys. Being wheeled out in front of crowds of ghouls pawing at them and wailing when they’d just lost their mum.

Who can blame Harry for wanting to stick two fingers up at the whole circus

When Charles becomes king, it wont be for a long, as he is already over 70.
Rather than become a Republic, I would prefer the monarchy to be 'downgraded', as such. By which i mean, to lose this almost worship of them. But this only happens, when people stop flocking to stand as they drive past in their carriages on the way to a wedding, or similar, and stand around to view them waving from the balcony.
I am not really interested in any of them, but accept the queen works hard, etc
Did I watch any of the royal weddings? Not at the time; just the highlights later for all the fashion (ie not the service, but to see what all the guests are wearing)
I have never been to watch them in real life, and have never met any if them.

By which i mean, to lose this almost worship of them. But this only happens, when people stop flocking to stand as they drive past in their carriages on the way to a wedding, or similar, and stand around to view them waving from the balcony. I am not really interested in any of them, but accept the queen works hard, etc

So basically you’re saying you want other people to change their view of and behaviour towards the royal family

When Charles becomes king, it wont be for a long, as he is already over 70

I wouldn't bet on that, going on the age (so far) of his parents. He could have 20 years.

I bet that if Princess Diana had died when social media was like it is today , those boys would not have walked behind her coffin as the uproar would have been all over Twitter, mumsnet , Facebook and I bet it would have been dropped and just had the older men walking behind. It was awful making them do this.

*When Charles becomes king, it wont be for a long, as he is already over 70
*
I wouldn't bet on that, going on the age (so far) of his parents. He could have 20 years.

And he's obviously very healthy, demonstrated by how mild his COVID symptoms were.

Charles seems very fit and didn't have to go into hospital with covid , unlike Boris Johnson who is about 14 years younger ( I think ) and did end up on an ICU ward!
I think he'll live a long time myself : he could be King for many years..
I wonder if he really wants it though? His been waiting a long time!
It'll be strange having a King and not a Queen.

@The80sweregreat

Charles seems very fit and didn't have to go into hospital with covid , unlike Boris Johnson who is about 14 years younger ( I think ) and did end up on an ICU ward! I think he'll live a long time myself : he could be King for many years.. I wonder if he really wants it though? His been waiting a long time! It'll be strange having a King and not a Queen.

I reckon he’s gagging for it. He’s been groomed for it all his life.

OP - didn't the Aussies vote to keep the monarchy (always thought that was bizarre).

In answer to the question - I hope it does end with Betty - or sooner!

I think Charles will want it. He actually does care passionately about global warming so he'll want to make the most of his status as King of the United Kingdom and in the Commonwealth to push that issue. He's also very politically aware and will probably have too much to say on some issues.

Stone of Destiny, the last referendum about the monarchy here in Australia, was in 1997. The result was 54% to keep Monarchy.
I think they then decided to try again when the Queen passes.
I’m an Aussie and I love the Royal family, Well, most of them.

@janaus50s it will be interesting in Aus when the Queen dies. My husband is Australian, I know his parents & their generation are very pro the monarchy but the younger generation seem disinterested in them at best, those that I have spoken to about it all say they would vote to get rid (obviously this is a very tiny % of the voting pool!)

The referendum question in the Australian republic vote was very skewed and made people nervous about what they were voting for. That was a generation ago. Since then I personally have given birth to 2 people who will vote for a republic.