The NHS has collapsed.

[brahmahda]

It's great that no Covid wards have been overwhelmed for lack of ventilators - Clap Clap. But ...

1. My regular preventative treatment for a chronic condition has stopped, with no sign of it restarting.
2. My 13yo son needs diagnostic tests for symptoms he's had for several months, but the diagnostic clinic is closed, again with no sign of it restarting.
3. A vital service that the GP would normally provide has been redirected to a "hub" with a convoluted appointment booking process and a very long waiting list.
4. My elderly, isolated/ing mum who urgently needs a face-to-face with her GP due to a sudden decline in her health has been messed around with a complicated process that changes depends on who she speaks to (she was phoned and told she'd need to get a Covid test 10 mins before setting off for the appointment, so had to cancel it).

Of course issues of delayed cancer treatments etc have been widely reported in the news, but it's clear that they are just the tip of the iceberg. The problems must be impacting almost every family in the country to some extent, and there's no sign of them being temporary. I just can't see the NHS getting back onto it's already-shaky track in the foreseeable future.

Anyone else find this terrifying?

I have had a couple of descent appointments, no issues

In fact it’s been much easier to speak to GPS

A and E waiting times are faster as less people are going with silly complaints a pharmacist could sort

Yes appointments have been cancelled but are now being rebooked

But we are in the middle of a pandemic and if we hadn’t done what we did no one would be getting anything as there simply would not be a nhs now,

Even without the pandemic people in different areas get different levels of care and access to things

I agree and I think it will get worse.

I'm waiting for surgery to have a tumour removed. They think it's non cancerous but it's never been biopsied so who knows. Though it hasn't grown. I was meant to have it removed in March, it was cancelled, 2 days before lock down. I am struggling to walk some days.

I spoke to the hospital last week because they accidentally sent me a letter for a pre op appt and then said it was a mistake. They say they have no date yet for when they can resume non urgent operations.

I'm seriously worried that just as they decide to start up the UK will be hit by a second wave and that will be it until summer 2021. By which time the services will probably have been outsourced and they'll decide I don't meet criteria or something.

The nhs is underfunded and has been for a while.i think it is a ploy to get people to think that the service is not for for purpose and seek private treatment, I do think this will become the norm eventually.

I had a non emergency scan at the start of covid. I had not heard back from my gp about a referral so had assumed it would be postponed. I then got a phone call to say that the consultant still wanted to see me and an appointment had been made. Once I got to the ward I was asked a series of questions, given some sanitizer and had a scan. So my personal experience has been good.

My sister experienced a miscarriage and when she asked to be seen for a scan was told to wait it out and that it wouldn't be done due to covid-19. She paid for one privately.

A friends mum needs a 3 month injection of vitamin b12 but her surgery are refusing to do it as noone is available and impossible to give an injection and socially distance (fair enough but why can't they wear ppe).They are not referring her elsewhere for her to get it. She is in her 70s and will not argue for herself but is suffering ill effects.

This winter the nhs are expecting unprecedented demand for people wanting the flu jab. How are they going to get it if surgeries are not seeing patients for even routine appointments? In pharmacies we are being versed about doing flu jabs this year, we are expected to do them wearing ppe. If we can do it why aren't drs surgeries seeing patients for blood tests or bp tests before supplying the pill?

Some industries can not shut during lockdown and healthcare is one of them. It really has been a postcode lottery and that just highlights the inequality often faced by the poor, elderly and the uneducated who are maybe less able to speak up for themselves.

Many of the experiences posters have shared are really upsetting.

I agree OP. Whilst some people seem to be having good experiences and acute care seems to have been maintained, diagnosis and treatment of chronic conditions seems to have fallen by the wayside in many areas. I'm slightly worried that there doesn't seem to be much of a plan for the way out of this. Things were already in such a bad state that I don't think your title is dramatic at all. I know people are trying their best but the system is undoubtedly letting people down. DH's consultant made the effort to call him, but he needs to be seen face to face by a different specialist which he has been told will be at least 6 months from now, and that's being optimistic. We'll be adding that onto the 2 year merry go round of waiting for diagnosis, it has really taken its toll on my DH and I know many have it far worse.

My son's grommets have fallen out which take over a year to be replaced in normal times. It's taken months to even get on the waiting list for a hearing test. His hearing has deteriorated massively and we have been given no support at all. We've been trying to learn some basic signs on YouTube

My son's skin condition has been treated through telephone calls with a lot of photos provided before the call, including follow-up. DH's and my medication have been regularly renewed. Friend's wife has a very complex surgery rescheduled for August now, delayed but by only around 3 months and not a question of life expectancy. Sorry you are having problems of course but I think this is not across the whole country.

I agree. My hospital announced yesterday they have no cases of Covid in the hospital anymore, yet none of our appointments are going ahead.
Also my town hasn't been hit very hard with covid (my mum works in the hospital so we've been kept up to date) so to be fair, I'm actually starting to get really angry at the nhs.

My DC's GP referral to CAMHs has been rejected, but I feel that may have happened regardless of coronavirus. He's clearly not suicidal and anxious enough for them. Private therapy is an option but DC doesn't deal well with videocalls and clams up, so we may have to wait until face to face consultations are allowed again.

This is definitely differing from trust to trust. My daughters orthodontist called her as soon as they were open to tighten her brace - admittedly 3 months late but they had sent self care info in the meantime. No ill effects, it will just delay the end of the treatment by a couple of months and as I pointed out - people were dying, so she can live with that.

We've had no issue getting GP appointments using the online form and call back service. Me and both of my older daughters have had repeat prescriptions issued - we've signed up to Echo who have been amazing. Only one prescription was queried due to a blood pressure check being needed, we have a home BP monitor and the GP called us the same day, asked us to do it ourselves, noted the result and issued the prescription.

I've had a blood test - there is an online booking system for that which was put in place really quickly.

My mums under hospital treatment, there were a few weeks where appts were delayed and one was done over the phone to check symptoms, but then she went in as planned for her operation.

An elderly relative has moaned that she cant make an appt to go and see the GP for a chat because "she likes to do that every so often" but I've pointed out to her that she doesn't have any medical condition to discuss and perhaps she could consider not time-wasting like that when they do properly re-open and leave appts for those who actually need them.

So our experience has been ok - compared to what stress the NHS has been under. It definitely needs some re-organisation, because clearly some areas aren't coping as well as ours.

Partners on continuous low dose chemotherapy and it was stopped at the beginning of the pandemic. He's now showing serious signs of original illness returning yet still no sign of an appointment or restart of treatment.

I have a neurological condition. Just got my appointment for addenbrookes hospital....for August 2021!

Youngest has ASD and hit a real low with their mental health. It's taken weeks and a near suicide attempt to get a camhs crisis team out to her. And treatment is not available entirely

I understand that nhs are now preparing for winter and possible second wave etc but right now a close relative who works in itu in a huge hospital is telling me it's normal day when they are on shift. So where are our consultants! Why are our gps still not in most if the time and if they are it's a telephone appointment. Everything else is going back to a new kind of normal, I'm back at work, shops are open, we can go for a pint! But we are still not able to get basic medical care

We have had superb care for a variety of things from GP all the way through. In fact I love the new systems in place, the service is so much better. Appointments on the day by telephone when you want and only called in if need to be seen which we have twice. Prescriptions sent straight through to pharmacy.Dh also had a skin cancer scare seen by gp (via photos) then referred with a face to face hospital appointment by the consultant done and dusted in the middle of lockdown in a very short period of time.

CAMHs and orthodontic has been dire but we are in a shit area for CAMHs, I started to complain and we’ve been taken on by somebody much better. Face to face still non existent though.😩

Its an imperfect beast but we just dont appreciate how f*ing amazing it is.

Its almost time for the tories to start making the argument that large swathes of it should be privatised which will give better service and reduced wait times for this introductory offer of only £1000 a month with only a £20 per appointment co-pay.

All we have to do is do nothing and pay up and boom...we're America.

Just dont be poor...if you are, youre dead.

MP's voted to allow it to be put on the negotiating table on Monday.

I was diagnosed with breast cancer 3 days before lockdown. I had my surgery on the day of lockdown and I am now nearly halfway through active treatment. I've been very fortunate and everybody I have come across through this process has had expedient treatment. Last week my daughter had a strange looking mole come up and had a next day telephone/video appointment with GP who has dealt with it swiftly. However, I have a friend who has suffered terribly over lockdown with a difficult combination of health issues and has literally been left to get on with it with repeated prescriptions of ever increasing strength painkillers that are clearly affecting her stomach and liver. This is simply unacceptable. We live in the same town, the treatment from her GP and mine is miles apart unfortunately.

It's the discrepancy in care thats also an issue, as has been pointed out. @Hyperion100 yes the concept is amazing, and most of it is incredible. But there seems to be no middle ground between staying as it is (wildly inefficient) and selling off of the whole lot to 'fix' what is broken, and undo years of ineffective procurement. Just because someone is questioning aspects of it doesnt mean they want to see it torn apart.

I imagine it very much depends on where you are in the country and what your condition is.

I know a man in his early 80s, pretty healthy, still working, playing golf, so no major issues. He's had several hospital appointments and diagnostic procedures over the last few months.

He's in London and has been seen at some of the countries leading hospitals.

NHS seems fine for him.

I agree they shut down way too many treatments for a lot of other medical issues for far too long.

We'd already waited 18 months for my son's orthodontics needs; still waiting for braces after several cancelled appointments from their end. We shouldn't have to pay for them and will struggle to do so, but at the rate the catch up will begin, a lot of 'children' will age out of the free orthodontics care! And he truly needs braces to close a massive gap from teeth that had to be pulled because they were impacted and migrated to the wrong places in his mouth!

It's definitely different between Trusts and Commissioning Groups.

I can't fault my GP - they've done things differently but in some ways these could be more helpful for their patient population going forwards.

I have an MRI scan in a Central London Hospital Trust next week - it is non-urgent but I was offered a date within a week for the scan. Superb. Usually I am waiting longer than that for an urgent scan.

Our local hospital however is appalling. It seems it has always been that way and it has just gotten worse.

I would imagine that some health authorities are better run than others which is a shame but hard to avoid in an organisation as enormous as the NHS. We have had excellent service from our local health service over the last few months, I was called in for my regular smear, DH had a telephone consultation and antibiotics prescribed for a recurring problem, DS hit his head badly during full lockdown so was checked at the hospital - all absolutely brilliant. Our local surgery is doing much more online/telephone appointment which in so many cases is all that is needed, then frees up time to see the patients that really need the face to face. It might be good if they had a stronger feedback mechanism in the NHS to enable them to improve the quality of the management from the top in some areas.

Our GP is having it easy. The surgery is closed for routine appointments and everything is triaged by phone. He and his staff cut about in their scrubs but to all intents and purposes, Covid has provided them with a four month break and plenty of time for him to attend to his burgeoning property empire.

I receive care for a lifelong condition that affects a lot of different parts of my body.

So far

• quarterly injections of relevant drugs (at hospital) have continued as normal (I was surprised - they're not lifesaving, though they do significantly reduce the chance of me ending up in A&E, so I suppose they may be taking the "a stitch in time" approach)
• still waiting on some non-urgent test results from 6 months ago
• on the waiting list for cardiology appointment (have been for 6 months) with no idea when appointment will come around (but that's mainly due to family history + my condition, not symptoms, so I'm not a high priority

I also had to call my GP when I knew I had a UTI. It was all dealt with very efficiently over the phone, and the prescription was sent to the pharmacy for collection. Probably quicker and easier than it normally is TBH.

Did you continue to work normally during the height of the pandemic or did you have staff dying and others off sick? If so what industry are you in because any service I have tried to use has been subject to delays. Deliveries have gone missing and generally life has been different.

Fortunately the first time we needed the NHS was yesterday - phone consultation that went on significantly longer than a normal consultation. For my OH rather than me so I couldnt hear what was said, will have to have it on speakerphone if he needs another. So no evidence of problems here. Dental care is a whole different story - but that is already privatised so no government bots complaining about that.

The NHS has not "collapsed" but it's been underfunded for years, it has no spare capacity and some of it's staff have sadly died while others had to isolate when they were not sick because there were no tests for them or their families.

In a normal year the NHS does something like 17 million admissions, maybe 125 million outpatient appointments. Covid-19 patients take up beds for a long time and require intensive care, so need a lot more tests and treatment than the average NHS patient. You cant put other patients in beds if a Covid-19 patients is in it and you cant do as much surgery if most of your theatres are Covid ICUs.

Unlike other industries you cant rapidly train up new doctors and most were already working over their hours to cover staff shortages. You are being unreasonable to think things can magically return to normal, very unreasonable if you voted for years of austerity.

You get great value from the NHS and multiple reorganisations have not helped that. It doesnt need yet another reorganisation, unless it's to undo the last one, which even David Cameron admits now was a mistake.

NHS is thankfully working just fine for my family - my children have had a telephone medication review, a routine ear microsuction (after an initial telephone appointment) and a trip to A&E for a broken bone. I've had telephone consultations for my chronic condition and a scan for a referred thing (thankfully negative!). I'm grateful for everything they're doing to carry on!

Seems to be emergency or covid care only here. DD has had constant ankle pain since December and can't walk for more than a few minutes. GP says they can't do anything and she needs an orthopaedics referral. Got referral through in June as phone consultation. Consultant agrees DD needs to be seen asap but asap will be at least end of September. We don't even have an actual appointment through yet. We've resorted to going private as we reckon DD won't be treated this year, particularly if there is a second wave and I have no idea how she will manage school (prior to lockdown it was by being dosed up on painkillers and lots of help from friends). We are lucky to be able to just about afford it but concious others dont have a choice.

I'm increasingly concerned OP. I've been in acute back pain and sciatica that wakes me at night, is 24/7 for the last four weeks and can barely manage to get myself washed and dressed each day. My GP referred me for an MRI but on speaking to the MRI unit was told I'd have to wait over 2 months as they were still dealing with a huge backlog. I would loose whats left of my sanity if I had to wait that long, so have had to borrow money for a private MRI.

@TheStuffedPenguin

I get she is going to need a test, what both of us don't understand is her travelling to a hospital via public transport and going into the hospital to get the test.