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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think she should have known better? Trigger warning - DV

80 replies

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 12:37

I've name changed for this as I know these people personally.

Three years ago a 'man' was sentenced to 6 years in prison for a horrific attack on the mother of his child which included horrible violence and what can only be described as torture. During this, he told her he was going to kill her and very easily could have done. The offence was published in the paper and online, outlining exactly what he did and what he was capable of. He plead guilty and made no attempt to deny it. He couldn't.

After serving half of his sentence he was released and within a few weeks he's in a new relationship with another local woman who knows all about the crime. This woman has children of her own, daughters.

Yesterday this new girlfriend posted on Facebook a photograph of her swollen and bruised face saying he has beaten her up. Cue 100+ comments from people offering their support and at least 5 of those saying they "can't believe it'

Far from wanting to victim blame my initial reaction was disgust and sympathy, but the more I think about it the more I wonder how she could have expected anything less than this to happen. Why would you get involved with somebody you know to be capable of something like this?

I can't fathom why you would knowingly expose yourself and your young daughters to a person like this.

So many women wish they had the benefit of foresight when it comes to dangerous men. I wish I had.

If you already know, you knew you were getting into.

The mother of his child has seen this now and feels as though what she went through was for nothing, her sole motivation in taking it to court was to make sure it couldn't happen again to somebody else.

Do you think I'm an awful person for feeling this way? I'm in no way saying she deserves it, it's deplorable and I genuinely hope she's ok, but just why would you put yourself in this position?

OP posts:

YgritteSnow · 17/07/2020 12:39

I agree with you but some people are just so damaged they'll accept scraps of "love" wherever they can find it.

ComplexPTSDmaybe · 17/07/2020 12:41

She obviously swallowed the 'I have changed and paid my dues' line. These men can be very persuasive and there is a reason why they are able to get into position to abuse women.

From the outside it seems simple but when you are damaged it is anything but.

Mydogisthebestest · 17/07/2020 12:43

She’s abused. She’s been abused. It messes up your thinking. And these men are good at lying.

Pemba · 17/07/2020 12:46

Social Services will probably be getting involved now. She has put her children in danger from her association with this man. And she can't even say she didn't know about his past history! Foolish woman.

flirtygirl · 17/07/2020 12:48

I don't really feel sympathy for her. For many of us we have no idea that the man we love, who we have been married to for years will be a monster. Sometimes there are red flags and sometimes there are none. Some men start to abuse years and years later.

But this woman, etc? She knew about it. She chose to put herself in that position, so no I don't have any sympathy for her.

I would have sympathy, if she had moved into the area and was not local and like so many others didn't have any clue to the sort of man she was getting involved with.

These men are charming, persuasive, manipulative and very very likeable. However if she knew his history then she should have walked away, having never got involved with him.

user1493413286 · 17/07/2020 12:50

Sometimes your own experiences mean that as much as you might want a healthy relationship it’s not what you know and you find yourself attracted to what you know (toxicity and abuse).

Original poster

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 12:50

She's 40 and for all intents and purposes has her shit together. Job, nice house. The 'man' is 28 and fresh out of prison for exactly this type of behaviour. I just can't wrap my head around how she thought it was a good idea.

Luckily for her, her daughter's are above 16 so she needn't worry about them being removed from her care, but they've now had to witness this whole thing and will probably take from this that people deserve a second chance, don't judge a book by its cover etc.

OP posts:

LycraLovingLass · 17/07/2020 12:55

If only it were that simple.

Men like that are excellent at being charming, at playing the victim, having believable excuses at hand and by being honest about what they have done you believe that they are being honest about why they did it. You swallow their lines about how ashamed they are and they wish someone would give them a chance to rebuild their lives.

And thats when your conditioning comes in, we are programmed to make mens lives easier, we know how it feels to have had a hard life and we think people deserve a second chance. Everyone makes mistakes don't they?

We think if we treat them right it will be different with us, we won't drive them to act that way.

And the low self esteem, that we don't actually deserve better, that this os the beat we will get. Actually flattered that someone has taken an interest at all and is willing to take us on.

And you convince yourself thatits wrong to judge people on their past,that you should judge them on how they treat you instead.

It's incredibly complex and whilst its easy to stand on the outside saying should have known better, sometimes you cant see the wood for the trees.

I would guarantee that the woman in question has been in at least one and probably more abusive relationships before this.

labyrinthloafer · 17/07/2020 12:55

"far from wanting to victim blame" my arse!

You are victim blaming. I just feel really sad about the whole mess when I read things like this.

Humans are messy and in many cases foolish. But you don't know very much about any of these people really.

sillysmiles · 17/07/2020 12:56

He more than likely love bombed her and she thought he had changes.

Also the serial nature of these guys is often not something people are aware of and they think it was because of the relationship rather than just the person.

A 40 yr old woman with her shit together does not get with a 28yr old ex con.

Pemba · 17/07/2020 13:01

Frederiki, but with the assault on their mum, surely they will take the opposite position, ie men capable of this always revert to type?

Original poster

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 13:09

@labyrinthloafer

"far from wanting to victim blame" my arse!

You are victim blaming. I just feel really sad about the whole mess when I read things like this.

Humans are messy and in many cases foolish. But you don't know very much about any of these people really.

If only that were true.

I know the POS man very well because I'm related to his ex and their daughter.

His ex is in bits today having seen all of this playing out on social media like some episode of Jeremy Kyle.

She feels as though she went through court for nothing and that what happened to her clearly wasn't a big deal to other people, when in actuality it was horrifying.

Unfortunately the bulk of my sympathy is with her at the moment.

She had no warning.

OP posts:

Original poster

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 13:10

@Pemba

Frederiki, but with the assault on their mum, surely they will take the opposite position, ie men capable of this always revert to type?

I hope so for their sake

OP posts:

Crunchymum · 17/07/2020 13:11

She posted pics on FB?

Crunchymum · 17/07/2020 13:13

Also you know a lot about how the initial victim feels @Frederiki.

Are you her?

differentnameforthis · 17/07/2020 13:15

I do feel for her, regardless of knowing his past, she did not ask for nor deserve this.

Probably thought she could change him, probably thought she was "special" enough to make him want to change. She found out in a horrible way that she isn't and wasn't special after-all. She is guilty of being naive, and way too trusting.

Far from wanting to victim blame yet you did with this but just why would you put yourself in this position?

When you put the onus on the victim to prevent a crime against them, you are victim blaming.

She made a mistake, however the blame is firmly at his door. It's easy to think that someone who has served time is a changed person, and you have no idea of the amount of grooming her would have done to her in order to pull her in.

labyrinthloafer · 17/07/2020 13:16

I honestly find this ghoulish.

Original poster

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 13:17

@Crunchymum

Also you know a lot about how the initial victim feels *@Frederiki*.

Are you her?

No, she's a member of my family. I don't want to say exactly who I am to her for obvious reasons but I'm close to the situation and have supported her throughout.

The new girlfriend posted pictures of her injuries on Facebook yes, to name and shame him.

She said she's put a statement in so he will be getting recalled as soon as he is picked up because he's still on licence for what he did before.

OP posts:

tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz · 17/07/2020 13:19

What Ygritte said. A piece of scum like this has a remarkable talent for picking and grooming damaged women. Reactions like "what did she expect" help enable him.

differentnameforthis · 17/07/2020 13:25

See, that was her mistake. You can not ever prevent it happening again (unless you execute the perp), so you should only really take your abuser to court because YOU personally want justice/want them punished for what they did to you. Her sole motivation should have been herself, not everyone else. But In understand her position, when violated in some way women are usually told "think of the others they could do it to..."

She feels as though she went through court for nothing and that what happened to her clearly wasn't a big deal to other people, when in actuality it was horrifying

The thing is, she can't take the weight of this on. She did nothing wrong, but there will always be people who will downplay violence against women, including rape etc (there are threads on here daily with apologists etc). I hate to say it, but she is making this all about her, when the focus shouldn't be on her, because it's not her crime.

You are even empathizing with her, and not the victim, as are others around you, I don't doubt, so his new victim will not be seen as a victim. Attitudes like yours and some others on this thread will be why she will now find it hard to prosecute (even if it's just from a personal POV because she knows what you all think, and/or get her own conviction because the attitude is "she knew what he was like.."

Unfortunately the bulk of my sympathy is with her at the moment. Well if you are related to her, of course it is. But the other lady is as much a victim as your relative.

SpinningLikeATop · 17/07/2020 13:29

You'll get flamed on here, but IMO YANBU.
However, he probably gave her all the flannel about how he changed, how his ex "made" him angry etc etc. It was probably a massive shock to her, and at the least she's reported it to the police and it sounds like she's not going to stand by him.

Original poster

Frederiki · 17/07/2020 13:29

She has made a statement already apparently.

I've seen the 'man' on a post saying he didn't hit her and that she was attacking him so he pushed her and she fell over and banged her head.

Nobody who knows him will buy it. It's clear what he's done but he isn't admitting it this time because he knows they'll throw away the key.

OP posts:

Kassandra1 · 17/07/2020 13:33

This is exactly victim blaming.

Your poor relative. But this poor woman too. Starting a relationship with someone does not mean you deserve to be beaten and all this thread and that rationale creates is an extra excuse for the abuser.

Shame on you

SchrodingersImmigrant · 17/07/2020 13:35

I have great sympathy for victims of DV, but in this case, even I have problem to muster it up. I feel sorry for he, no one deserves to be beaten, but...
He's gone to prison for what he did, that's how serious it was. It's not he said, she said. There is just no way around the thought of "you lie, how you make your bed". As harsh as it sounds.

Tinamou · 17/07/2020 13:38

It's awful that this has happened. OP, tell your friend that she definitely didn't go through all that (the court case etc) for nothing. If she hadn't, it's likely that this woman would be hiding what has happened to her rather than being open about it. Hopefully that means that the man will receive justice (again).

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