To think she should have known better? Trigger warning - DV

[Frederiki]

I've name changed for this as I know these people personally.

Three years ago a 'man' was sentenced to 6 years in prison for a horrific attack on the mother of his child which included horrible violence and what can only be described as torture. During this, he told her he was going to kill her and very easily could have done. The offence was published in the paper and online, outlining exactly what he did and what he was capable of. He plead guilty and made no attempt to deny it. He couldn't.

After serving half of his sentence he was released and within a few weeks he's in a new relationship with another local woman who knows all about the crime. This woman has children of her own, daughters.

Yesterday this new girlfriend posted on Facebook a photograph of her swollen and bruised face saying he has beaten her up. Cue 100+ comments from people offering their support and at least 5 of those saying they "can't believe it'

Far from wanting to victim blame my initial reaction was disgust and sympathy, but the more I think about it the more I wonder how she could have expected anything less than this to happen. Why would you get involved with somebody you know to be capable of something like this?

I can't fathom why you would knowingly expose yourself and your young daughters to a person like this.

So many women wish they had the benefit of foresight when it comes to dangerous men. I wish I had.

If you already know, you knew you were getting into.

The mother of his child has seen this now and feels as though what she went through was for nothing, her sole motivation in taking it to court was to make sure it couldn't happen again to somebody else.

Do you think I'm an awful person for feeling this way? I'm in no way saying she deserves it, it's deplorable and I genuinely hope she's ok, but just why would you put yourself in this position?

I don't see it as victim blaming. Assuming this woman did know about his past then she also knew it was a possibility history would repeat and she had a responsibility to protect herself and her daughters.

She was foolish. A leopard rarely changes its spots

My friend was warned by the Clare’s law people about the guy she got with - he was incredibly manipulative and able to “explain it” away.
She isn’t desperate for love/stupid etc
He played the underdog card and manipulated the shit out of her - these abusers have scary ways of doing things

Well she has learned a hard lesson. She saw what she wanted to see with this man. I hope he is in custody and I hope, over 16 or not, that her children have been safeguarded.

I don’t see how it is victim blaming.
She didn’t think of her kids.
She put having a relationship above her own kids.

It's still victim blaming though. She made a mistake, but she didn't commit a crime. She didn't deserve to be beaten up.

YANBU. Knowingly subjecting yourself and your children to violence from a man who has been convicted of DV... It's a form of mental illness.

It's sad, but completely predictable.

Agree with PP that when you drag your children into this crap, I cease to care so much about "victim-blaming". There is a level of responsibility here, however distasteful that may be to some.

If I intentionally leave an expensive phone on a park bench and it's stolen, I bear some part of the responsibility if it's stolen. Did I deserve to be robbed? No, but I was negligent with my valuable property. Putting yourself (and your children) in harm's way by having a relationship with a man known to be violent is also negligent.

Someone who does these kinds of things needs to seek help, if they can't trust themselves to make wise choices.

@Tinamou

It's still victim blaming though. She made a mistake, but she didn't commit a crime. She didn't deserve to be beaten up.

At no point has anyone said that she deserved it. That doesn't change the fact that she knew what she was getting involved with and it was a potential risk.

Would you have the same sympathy if he was a rapist or a child abuser?

If you are concerned re the feelings of your relative, the original victim, you could point out that because she took action against him in the first place, this woman won't believe it was a one off and has taken action immediately. As a result of which, he should go back to jail.

Also, if he has been convicted twice, no one in future is likely to believe he has changed.

Her actions have helped.

See, that was her mistake. You can not ever prevent it happening again (unless you execute the perp), so you should only really take your abuser to court because YOU personally want justice/want them punished for what they did to you. Her sole motivation should have been herself, not everyone else.

Bollocks, you report and prosecute to try and stop things happening again!

She thinks she's a special sausage and that she'll be the one to teach him to love again.

Unfortunately the ones who go in with all the knowledge tend to be the ones who, in their head, make it still all the ex's fault and help him harass her some more ... until the treatment comes their way.

Women need to be taught early about this in school before early abusive relationships break them and they end up the subsequent enablers of abusive men.

Unfortunately the ones who go in with all the knowledge tend to be the ones who, in their head, make it still all the ex's fault and help him harass her some more ... until the treatment comes their way.

This is absolutely what happened. Nail on the head.

@Tinyhumansurvivalist - At no point has anyone said that she deserved it

Except that is EXACTLY what this is _ That doesn't change the fact that she knew what she was getting involved with

Would you have the same sympathy if he was a rapist Yes, because it is never the victims fault. But people on here would still be apologizing for him, and blaming her.

or a child abuser? Not remotely comparable, because we are talking about an adult v a child here... and the child isn't in charge or control as to who they come into contact with.. but no, I would not have sympathy with a parent who invited a known child abuser into their home who then subsequently abused their child.

What your relative went through by pursuing the prosecution was worth it. Now he will be recalled and if charged again the first instance can be used as bad character.
Their daughter and your relative have more protection as a result of the conviction as well in terms of access and i hope some kind of restraining order.
Some women like bad boys, some think they can change men, some are desperate for love from anyone or conditioned to think abuse is normal. You can't know why she got together with him but at least she's not suffering in silence and is standing up to him.
I hope the person you're supporting is ok, this isn't her fault and she's been very strong.

I’m afraid I agree with you OP.

His new partner didn’t deserve to be beaten, it wasn’t her fault at all, and she absolutely deserves the sympathy all victims of violent attacks do. but she DID have a reasonable expectation that this would happen and to say otherwise is disingenuous.

I think you’re under estimating the seductive power of “he’d never do that to ME, I’m SPECIAL”

It’s like an extra terrible version of the thousands of women who marry deadbeat dads and are shocked when they don’t pull their weight with their new kid.

Everyone wants to be someone’s exception. It rarely ends well.

or a child abuser? Not remotely comparable, because we are talking about an adult v a child here... and the child isn't in charge or control as to who they come into contact with.. but no, I would not have sympathy with a parent who invited a known child abuser into their home who then subsequently abused their child.

But do you not think that there is likely to be quite a wide crossover in the behaviour of a man who would happily pummel multiple women in the face and torture them and one who would abuse a child? Especially considering that a lot of rape and sexual abuse has a strong element of power and control to it.

If you're the kind of person who believes the former to be acceptable and demonstrates that you frequently act that way, I wouldn't for a moment think it safe to assume that you'd somehow unequivocally draw the line at hurting a child in any way.

I left a violent partner.
When I heard his next girlfriend had a small child I aproached her and told her why I had left him,her reply was he has told me he only beat you because you are a bitch.
He put her in hospital.

A few years later he dated a friend of the woman I approached.
Same thing happened.

She is definitely not to blame for what he did to her in any way, but I think it's a valid question to ask why somebody would do that with full knowledge of what he's like.

What would you say if somebody climbed the high bars and got into the tiger enclosure at the zoo? Two different kinds of creature that are very well known to physically harm humans (albeit one of them driven by instinct and self-preservation rather than pure evil): why would you put yourself in that position and choose to be at close quarters with them?

You are quite right and not victim blaming in the least !

A great read for many on this thread is Gift of Fear by Gavin De Becker. It talks at terrifying length of how an abuser will select their next victim, groom (part of this will involve a very edited version of events with an ex, you will hear what he wants you to) and then abuse them. It is literally a selection process. Often it ends in murder (2 women a week in the UK).

I also think it's valid to question what goes through someone's head who enters into this, especially if they have young kids. But as someone pointed out upthread, we all want to be special to someone. If past experiences mean you're not in a great place mental health wise you will be hugely vulnerable. These women are all victims, I doubt anyone of them thought they would also receive a battering from him.

I wonder how many men in OPs circles are discussing and calling out his actions and questioning what part they could all have in this happening less? I'm guessing not many.

Well...

At a guess:

She may be messed up psychologically by previous abuse she’s suffered

He’s convinced her that he’s changed/his previous partner provoked him/it was a one off out of character/she’s different to ex and he’d never be the same with her/she can change him by loving him “enough”...

I’m the dd of an abusive marriage and as pp say, these men can be VERY convincing basically con artists. Charming, believable, EXTREMELY adept at manipulating people, seemingly loving and generous...

Then you add in the PSYCHOLOGICAL training of their victim that they do. It never starts with a battering, it starts with undermining, gas lighting, wrecking their victims confidence and self esteem, removing ANYONE from their lives who is REMOTELY capable of supporting them to see the truth or leave...

It’s really NOT as simply as “well what did she expect” ?

You ARE victim blaming, you clearly don’t understand how such abuse works.

The mental abuse is FAR MORE damaging and harder to pull out from than the physical.

A staggering lack of understand on here as to how these scumbags operate and control and manipulate people.

God knows what went through her head, same as when you see tales of women who penpal death row inmates and end up getting married etc, cannot fathom the thought process behind it, possibly because there is no ounce of rationality there at all.

Sometimes we spend so much time debating why women enter relationships with abusive men we don't even bother asking why men keep abusing women over and over again.

The system is set up in this country which allows men to keep being abusive. We keep helping women leave whilst the abuser moves onto the next target.

To answer your question though: maybe she thought he'd changed, maybe she thought she could change him, maybe society has conditioned women to be responsible for abusers behaviour. Abusers can be highly manipulative. They often convince new partners that the previous partner was at fault (she nagged me, she kept the kids from me, she cheated on me . . .)