..to consider shopping my friend for her benefit fraud?!

[NadiaBaggyTwat]

My friend and I both work in local government. We are quite close and I have known her for years but she is incredibly bad with money and never makes any attempt to get herself back on track. Usually her mother bails her out and she just goes on spending. She is a good hearted person, but this is the one aspect of her that I find really hard to stand by and watch.

Close to Christmas, a group of us, including said friend and our DHs are going to France for the weekend. This was arranged months ago. It's costing £200 per couple and my DH and I are having a really really hard time financially at the moment (not from overspending but problems with DH's business) so we weren't going to go but friend owes me £150 from something I paid for on my card (because it was a surprise from her to her DP and which she's - obviously - never paid me back for ) and to my suprise she said "well you can come because remember, I owe you £150..."

So we agreed to go. Anyway the time came for this money to be paid and I gave her the £50 as agreed (for the rest of the £200 for her to pass on to another friend who was paying all the money in) and she said she needed at least £100.. she couldn't afford to pay our money (that she owes!) because she hadn't paid her mortgage for months. I gave it to her (the trip has to be paid for!) but really resented it as I only agreed to go because I knew we wouldn't have to find much of the money!

Meanwhile, at work she is constantly talking to everyone about her posh meals out with DP, her tanning/nails/waxing appointments. And next thing, she's whining to me about the terrible state of her finances. And she does really spend money like this.. she isn't just saying it to impress!

Worse still, despite is both working for a government agency she is actually defrauding them! For well over a year now, since she has been living with her new partner, she has been claiming as a single person (with children). This amounts to over £100 a week that she isn't entitled to!!

I have told her outright time and again she needs to stop spending money like water and on luxuries she can't afford and START declaring that she has a partner living with her and the children, but nothing changes and she says she just can't afford to declare that he lives there. (They even bought a HUGE posh new house on this basis!)

I am so upset about the whole money thing and having to listen to her day in and day out talking about what she's bought (she shops compulsively as well in v.expensive clothes shops) all the while owing me money I lent her in good faith to help her out (albeit for another extravagance.. a birthday present she couldn't afford to buy her DP)... that... (and this is really bad .. I want to report her.

But if I did she may even lose her job, bearing in mind where we work.. Not to mention her house. And I would probably feel terrible forever.

I am an extreme regular with a (very inappropriate; sorry!) name change to protect various identities.

What would others do? Please?

yeah shop her, then you can visit her in prison, her kids in the care home, her husband in his cardboard box in a shop door way and remind her of what a true friend you are!!!!!!

Have only read the OP.

Nadia, I used to work in local and central government. As I'm sure you know both organisations have internal Legal/Audit/Insurance teams who work together with the Benefit Fraud team. Employees can and do get found out.

I haven't really got any advice except to say if you are good friends then I really think you should take the bull by the horns and tell her what could happen.

Does she know that you know btw?

Furryfiona - your comment is completely unncessary and racist.

law3; agree. a "grass" is not a happy place to be. most are usually just jealous anyway.

the onus here being on FRIEND, hurting a friend would be like hurting yourself. Call me old fashioned but i thought friendship was about being there for each other, support, trust, love. Not back stabbing - theres another word for that and its not FRIEND.

mercy; agree with you on furryfionas comments. jaw droppingly racist.

talulasmum - I've reported it.

not racist - classist!!!!!

sorry law, but those terms are racist.

Don't really understand the logic of telling her she's doing wrong and giving her the opportunity to put things right. For god's sake, it's made very obvious that it's a crime. Even if it weren't, ignorance is no defence. If I shoplifted, mugged a passer by or whatever, i'd expect to face the consequences. It's exactly because of this kind of thing that hard working honest people pay ridiculously high taxes. Think of it as stealing money out of your purse - it isn't any different. Of course you have a duty to report this crime.

mercury - racist is based on race or reglion.

The term pikey is slang used to refer to a wide section of the underclass of the country, bit like chav.

And as for the other word?

I think both terms are racist - but that's for MNHQ to decide at the end of the day.

themmj; would never put benefit fraud in the same league as the gangland killing of a child [humm] this discussion is on benefit fraud, not murder!

Pikey comes from turnpike. The way it was used was as if 'Pikeys' dont have any money and are an underclass. Sterotyping or classist, not racist as comment was not based on race or religion.

Sorry it doesnt matter anyhow, not a nice remark to make.

my attitude is not to stab a friend in the back. if my friend had commited an awful crime (murder etc) of course i would report it. but i would tell her what i was doing.

being a "grass" in gangland culture has far darker consequences unforunately.

As my Nan always used to say "Never a lender or a borrower be" and it is very true.
AB

mild mannered - if your friend told you she did 40 in a 30 zone, would you go behind her back and report her?

I read regularly about tax credit fraudsters being given suspended sentences or punitive fines. People who work for departments which administer benefits and steal from them are treated very harshley by the courts, she would almost certainly get a custodial sentence. She would never be able to work again, and lose her pension etc, her kids could go into care. Personally as a matter of conscience I wouldn't turn her in but I would remind her of the consequences of being caught and that she eventually will be. If your workplace is anything like mine, regular reminders are sent out about the consequences of fraud etc and people who are caught are made an example of.

Tell her how easy it is to find out that her partner is living there. The Govt has access to all sorts of personal information if it suspects fraud and her partner must have left some sort of paper trail using that address. It could be anything; a finance agreement, phone contract, bank statement, PAYE record etc. It is also likely that others know about it and will blab.

I don't think this is a genuine friendship anymore, what was there once has died or you wouldn't even consider informing on her. I would distance yourself from the whole thing - try and get a transfer to another department or something. Frankly there is a danger that if you know about it you could be culpable as well. I would join a union (if not already in one) keep away from your ex-friend (let her know the reason if you like) and cover your own back!

I was in a similar situation a few years ago. A neighbour of ours used to work as a motor mechanic (or so everyone thought) but he actually used to clock the mileage back on cars for a lving and making a good wack out of it. He works on company vans/cars etc.

In the meantime his bragging wife walks around in designer gear openly boasting what her hubby does and how much dosh they earn - they moved from our street and bought a massive house in an expensive area,go on expensive holidays etc.

I thought about reporting him to the police but they have 2 young kids and they were the reason I didn't.

I am suprised no one has shopped them though as she was always bragging about how much money he was making out his dodgy business.

I know its not quite the same as your situation but still...

So I couldn't shop her simply because I would feel sorry for the kids.

Just don't lend her money EVER again.

good poimt mildmanneredjanitor. If we all take the view that it's up to us to draw the line as to what kind of law breaking is acceptable and what isn't, where does that leave us as a society? The whole point of regulations and laws is that they apply to everyone! We can't simply re-write what we don't like. I agree, benefit fraud isn't in the same league as a gangland killing. But then neither is mugging someone for their mobile. Or burgling someone's house. Some criminals would justify these acts by saying that " they're only stealing property and not hurting anyone". As I said in my earlier post, this person must know what they are doing, the opportunity is there, and has been there, to take a different course of action and they have chosen not to.