Any former gymnasts or parents of gymnasts our there?

[PurpleRiverIsland]

news.sky.com/story/british-gymnastics-claims-athletes-beaten-into-submission-amid-culture-of-fear-12022525

I witnessed and was victim of a lot of physical and emotional abuse when I was an elite gymnast at 3 different clubs and from 4 different coaches. I know some of the clubs these girls (speaking out in the media) went to and I’m not surprised at all about the allegations.

I’m wondering how prolific it was. What were your experiences of the sport?

YABU - I was/am involved in gymnastics and have never seen anything untoward

YANBU - I was/am involved in gymnastics and I witnessed physical or emotional abuse.

Please comment too if you would like to share your experiences.

@KatherineParr4 oh also everyone was telling me that the coach was great and gymnastics is just hard and I needed to be strong and plough on. So I was being told I was wrong to leave by all the adults too!

If it looks like a cult, walks like a cult, and talks like a cult...

I didn't do gymnastics but I did do ballet, and I'm afraid if was the same toxic culture of fetishisation of extreme thinness, and normalisation of (often self-inflicted) physical abuse.
"Now let's sit on you to help you do the splits. It's good pain, don't cry. Lift that leg higher. If it doesn't hurt you're doing it wrong. Tuck your tummy in. Don't forget to smile. Of course it's normal to have blood in your shoes, we all get blisters. No, she's not crying. Let's see how far we can bend your back. Oh was that a crack? Now don't be silly it doesn't hurt. Don't forget to smile. Etc."

More than the physical violence, it's the brainwashing... Eventually I switched to martial arts as it was less brutal. At least you were not expected to smile when you got hurt.

It really fucked my brains up, though. I'm so detached from physical pain, I can feel it very clearly, but I can't tell when my body has reached its limits. It's always "Yeah whatever, I'm fine, I'm fine... Whoops, I just collapsed, trip to A&E". And all the while I'm still poker faced or vaguely smiling, so medics are confused (you can imagine how well that all went when I was in labour...)

I was in the not very good group and, like a previous poster, very envious of the intimate relationships the top level girls appeared to have with their coaches.

I broke my arm once and nobody cared. I was made to keep going and they took no notice that I cried, especially on floor. My mum gasped when she collected me as she could see the misshapen bone from several metres away. Still, nobody cared. I walked out one day and said I wasn't going back, and thankfully my mum was fine with that. The whole environment was dreadful - girls making mean comments about other girls bodies and the coaches sniggering along. Horrible.

But, reading this I think I had a relatively easy time of it. So sorry to all those who endured years of abuse

I would only ever let my daughters join a just for fun low level gymnastics group. Same with most sports to be honest. There's a very sinister side to competitive sport for children that really gets brushed under the carpet.

YANBU I used to be a gymnast and there was a guy there that used to handle the girls in a way I felt was far too close for comfort. I can only imagine this is not a uncommon thing

Yeah the force stretching was pretty brutal and being told at 11 I needed to lose weight (I absolutely didn’t) set me up for a life of body issues.
But I still loved gymnastics. I moved into trampolining as a teenager and loved that too.

I have two daughters involved in gymnastics. One in artistic and one in a different discipline. Neither have had negative experiences, even though it dominated both their childhoods. I have said if I had known what I was signing them up for when they started squad, I'm not sure I would have done it. But both daughters have loved their time in the sport and have said they would encourage their children to do it.

The daughter who did artistic (bars, beams etc) got as far as taking her nationals, but not to elite level (the top level - they take their compulsories). She trained 20 hours a week, and still considers her best friends to be the ones she has made in the gym. She loves the sport, still coaches and has gained so much from it. But she was never going to be elite. She had a fab coach, who I now consider to be a good friend. She would say she gained far more from gym than she ever gave up.

My other daughter still trains. She does less hours a week, but because she is not in artistic, I think you can do less hours and still make it. She hopes to make British Championships in the next few years and her club has produced many British Champions.

I do watch, and I can honestly say that I have never seen or heard them ever make any reference to either daughter's weight or shape. They are encouraged to eat healthily and live a healthy lifestyle, but nothing I feel uncomfortable by.

My overall feeling is that yes, there are problems, but I don't think it is in all aspects of gym and children can gain an awful lot from the experience. Both my children have.

@Kaiserin

Totally agree. Both my daughters dabbled with Ballet / Dance for a while, and there was much more in dance that made me feel uncomfortable than there was in gymnastics. The emphasis on appearance / body shape and acceptance of pain (especially when going on pointe) that I really felt uncomfortable with. Both my daughters left dance before they got to that stage, but the talk of bleeding feet as a badge of honour never sat comfortably with me.

@StillGardening

At the gym near us they used to do these brill soft play sessions, and toddlers could go in and use all the equipment during school hours. It was ace and I loved it. The session was run by a lovely lady. We were there once and a young girl / probably 10, was receiving coaching during the toddler session - 2 adults, 1 child. She was obviously amazing at gym. But they were being such bullies to her. I’ve never forgotten - this was about 8 years ago. She was in silent tears And the adults were being rude about her in front of her. Questioning her commitment etc. I didn’t say anything. Felt that it was her parents‘ (who were up in the viewing gallery) decision - as they could see what was going on - even if they couldn’t hear. So I just glared at the adults and carried on. But it has never left me. It was an overweight woman and a younger bloke, and they were poisonous. I’m so sorry for all the young athletes who just love their sport and have had to put up with this.

Was that in Buckinghamshire by any chance?

It really fucked my brains up, though. I'm so detached from physical pain, I can feel it very clearly, but I can't tell when my body has reached its limits. It's always "Yeah whatever, I'm fine, I'm fine... Whoops, I just collapsed, trip to A&E". And all the while I'm still poker faced or vaguely smiling, so medics are confused (you can imagine how well that all went when I was in labour...)

Oh fucking hell. I’ve just remembered something. I disassociated in labour. Was standing at the door to the labour suite watching me writhing on the bed. Figured it was a combination of the pain, the gas and air and sleep deprivation. I did look it up afterwards as I was curious. Everything I found talked about abuse victims doing it which surprised me as I wasn’t abused as a child but I just shrugged and forgot about it. Oh.

perhaps they get some kind of endorphin rush.
reading some of this reminds me of anorexia nervosa, the push to go beyond what is physically possible, mind over matter to an unhealthy degree, then a kind of altered awareness or lack of judgment, cult/brainwashing mentality.
all very worrying.
and a real charter for abusers; no parents allowed, what. alarm bells.

My daughter belonged to 2 different gymnastics clubs. They were both such a toxic environment. I was so pleased when she told me she had enough and didn't want to do it anymore.
The second club has stopped parents watching the classes now from the viewing area because they couldn't stand any criticism.
I had a few rows with them over their behaviour. They used to also take part in a gym/dance weekend. In one routine they had 9/10 year olds dance to a fifty shades of grey song, wearing a provocative, lacy outfit. When I saw it, I went mad.

Kaiserin-yes-I am strange with pain too. I find it very difficult to tell anyone if I am unwell or if I’ve hurt myself. I wonder if that’s part of the legacy.

My daughter did acro and ballet from age 3. When she showed an interest in gymnastics at 8 years old we attended a taster session from then on she was fast tracked onto the regional squad as their new rising star. She trained 20 hours a week on top of schooling and would travel all over to compete. She was genuinely very good and I am still immensely proud of her abilities.
She’s 10 now and last year she moved to cheerleading where she can flip and tumble to her hearts content without the pressure! Her poor little ankles couldn’t take it much longer.

We still quote one thing we overheard from a coach to a poor tiny little gymnast who was sobbing after doing some core strength exercises. (Hanging from bars whilst slowly lifting legs to your chest so your feet hit your ears) she was having a drink of water and he came and stood over her and said in his quite heavy accent ‘why you cry? Why you cry?’

I’m very glad she stopped going.

Today 07:13 Miserablemoan

Kaiserin-yes-I am strange with pain too. I find it very difficult to tell anyone if I am unwell or if I’ve hurt myself. I wonder if that’s part of the legacy.

Thanks for posting. I’d never thought of this as being related, but I’m the same. Gave birth in silence with no painkillers - couldn’t express how I was feeling even then.

I have tried to write a post for this thread four times now, but I keep panic deleting everything before I hit send. It's hard even now, over 10 years on, to see my experiences for what they were. Brainwashing is the right word. I thought I deserved it. I they were the things I needed to see and hear to make me better, to fix the parts of me that were wrong and bad. I developed an eating disorder. I still can't express negative emotion without panicking that I

Ah I hit enter too soon!
Panicking that I'll be punished or told off.

Not gymnastics for me, competitve swimming. But I'm sorry for everything you and your children all experienced because some of our experiences sound very similar.

Hi, I've named changed as I've been talking about gymnastics for years and don't want to out some of my other posts.

I did gymnastics over 35 years ago so it was still forming properly. I went to one of the first proper gyms in my area. I started late (8/9) so was good at club level and the lower grade nationals. But was never going to be very good as I started too old.

The club trained 4 days a week - a huge amount in those days - and I couldn't make one session as my parents insisted on me doing something else. The club were furious and wouldn't accommodate me any training on one piece of equipment. So I remained disproportionately bad at that equipment at every comp. Once I had a competition where this equipment routine was set and was challenging. I prayed for 2 weeks that I'd break my arm so I didn't have to go. I found it humiliating but the coaches didn't care. However overall I don't think they were cruel, just disinterested in anyone except the stars.

There were away camps to different gyms, some abroad. I remember a 2 week trip being a huge focus. A couple of the parents, including mine, refused to let their kids go because they weren't allowed to come as escort and in any event, who can escort their kids abroad for 2 weeks? I hated my parents for refusing to let me go at the time but am relieved as an adult. The kids came back so much better than me so it was the writing on the wall to my involvement then.

We did similarly stupid exercises like walking on each others backs, pushing people into position etc. One girl developed crippling arthritis in her late teens. I am another who gave birth quietly without drugs.. I never thought of a link before.

I left at 12/13 when I started developing - it is not a kind sport in that regard and I think puberty is often delayed. By that stage I had fallen behind the progress of others and wanted out. I did enjoy myself and the fitness was amazing but I think it's a tough sport and never encouraged mine to do it. Watching a friend stand on a beam for a whole session because she couldn't pluck up courage to do a backflip isn't normal.

I think there are parallels with many sports such as ballet, swimming, etc. where body shape is such a focus and it's solo.

@peoniesandpastels - spot on! As I wrote above, ballet and swimming stand out for their intensity. Do share your thoughts though - this thread is about competitive sports rather than gymnastics.

County squad and British Champs level. I was mentally bullied by one particular coach who would sneer at me and make comments about my weight, hair, tracksuit, anything she could pick on. Coaches would encourage girls to eat tissue to keep weight down, slap our legs, sit on us etc. I can remember being made to sit in splits with front foot on one bench and back foot on another, keeping legs straight and being sat on by this horrid coach to go past splits. I was in agony but daren't say anything as I knew if I did I would pay for it later in the training session. The coaches mentality was to tell you you were fat (although extremely underweight) a useless little bitch, in the squad to make up number etc and that this would spur you on to be better. I used to train 4 evenings a week and squads Sat and Sunday with competitions nearly every month. Despite the pressure and my parents literally paying grown women to call my names and hit me I continued to train until I was 14. I loved the sport and like other posters I didnt tell my parents as still wanted to train.
I saw the worst coach a few years back in a car park and I froze. I was 30 at the time and I couldn't physically move. She had obviously aged but I recognised her straight away.
Sometimes get invited to squad reunions - no chance I would go!
I now think about finding her and sending her an email to tell her just how much she affected me and how much of a bully she was, then I remember the way she used to sneer and laugh when we injured ourselves and just think she would do that.
This wasn't artistic. Was rhythmic gymnastics so happens across the board.

I wasn’t a gymnast but did attend dance classes. The instructor was not a well man and he was very awful to some of the children in the class. This never really included me other than generic shouting etc but I had witnessed him slap a child’s legs or tell them they were rubbish in all sorts of sweaty rants.

After watching ‘Athlete A’ I was so upset about the fact that young children were abused because they had a passion for a sport. This happened also in the football scandal and I imagine common in most sports. The sad part is parents thinking they were encouraging their children but were actually paying for their child to be abused emotionally, physically and sometimes sexually. It’s really scary.

I’m sorry to anyone who experienced this in any sport .

I did gymnastics as a child but not to any level. One of the best gymnasts at my club was the daughter of one of the coaches. She was pushed to extremes by her own mother. I remember feeling extremely sorry for her; I thought she was amazingly talented but it was never enough for her mother and I never once saw her praise her daughter. Extremely sad thinking back to it now.

There is a lovely recreational only club near me that was set up by a former Olympian. It has a really good reputation and there just isn’t the same pressure. I’ve always found it interesting that she chose to set something up for fun and recreational only when she’d reached the very highest levels.

yikes! I'm finding a lot of this really difficult to read. I trained to regional level and national for sets 30+ years ago from age 8-15. 20+ hours a week in a city 30miles away. My parents were not wealthy and the whole family sacrifised a lot for my hobby/love (i was never going to be national/olympic).
I've joked over the years how the stretching etc was abusive and that my arthertis riddled body is almost certainly down to the excesive training on such a young body.
BUT I really dont recognise (or maybe I just don't remember... which is bothering me) the outward abuse that is described here. Maybe shit went down hill from the 90's onwards?
My gym was one of the top in the country. We had national, international and olympic gymnasts train. Men and Women from age 3 to retirement. I know not every gym is set up this way, but there was a veiwing gallery for parent, they were activly encouraged to be involved in their kids training. We were never allowed to train on inguries. Of course, the most determined would get back to training asap, but premature return to training was definatley not encouraged. No one was ever (openly) body shamed, that I recall... I suppose at the level we trained we were already prime athletes. Diet was only ever spoken about in a scientific, sports based, energy, nutrition kinda way.
I alway knew i was incredible lucky to train at the gym I did, at the time I did (its still producing Olympians). Maybe I was much luckier (or completly blind) than i realised, some of the stories here are horrific. The PP whos daughter suffered and trained on SO many inguries (ankle, knee, hip & wrist?) just does't fit with my experience of 'elite' training.
It really, really saddens me there are so many bad gyms/clubs. Its been a looong time since I trained, I've visited my old gym regularly and recently and it felt to have the same ethos as when I trained. Lots of happy smiley, very talented kids. Why/how has it gotten so bad in other gyms and why have so many parents put up with it?

My son, who is at a reasonable level in a related sport to gymnastics ( under the same umbrella) hasn't come across this at all but we had a young girl secretly try out our club because of the treatmentthey were receiving in their gym club. The mother asked me if our training sessions were always so laid back ( we don't think the head coach is laid back - she is firm but fair) and then proceeded to tell me about the abuse her daughter was receiving just for being asked to compete for her school. Parent was terrified to go and tell the gym club daughter was leaving.

Another thing that son gets quite incensed about is why the insistence on girls wearing leotards. He obviously does but lower half is covered by shorts or trousers. Girls wear for training very tight shorts but they cover the upper thigh area but aren't allowed to do so in comp. also much hysteria about bra straps showing. He, and I think it is unfair. You can perfectly see 'the line' in a leotard and tight shorts that cover a bit more than just a leotard. Also, I've noticed in comps that there are a lot of coaches hugging or putting their paws all over the girls/women. I watched one on the tv where clearly the woman was uncomfortable. It all makes me feel a bit ick.

I don’t understand why female gymnasts have to wear leotards without footless tights underneath while the males can wear vest and shorts or a unitard. Just seems a bit off to me.