To ‘cause’ argument between BIL and DH? (#metoo related)

[HundredAcre]

BIL has some kind of obsession with a particular famous person who has been accused of sexual assault; he posts regular provocative Facebook posts about it, often derogatory about the woman who has made the allegation. I occasionally comment that we can never know for sure but otherwise keep out of it. On one of them recently however, he extended this to bitching about the #MeToo movement, how trial by media is outrageous, that people should not just believe whatever women say, not even as a starting point when they talk about what has (allegedly?!) happened to them.

I tried to debate and had barely said anything at all except that it was positive that people were becoming more aware of violence against women, and he was really nasty. He and a Facebook friend of his basically started saying I was incapable of identifying any rational aspect of any argument - and also generalising that to all women - and just made it very personal too, it got really misogynistic and I could barely believe what I was reading.

DH told me to just ignore him. I told DH it was fucking outrageous and he should have stood up for me. I got so angry I blocked BIL on Facebook. When BIL text DH to ask if things were ok, DH just said yes it’s fine. I told DH that standing by and letting BIL speak like that about women was unacceptable, and we had an argument about male privilege, which ended in him storming out, then storming back into the room again with clenched fists and screaming at me “you ungrateful bitch, you fucking cunt” pacing towards me until I actually put 999 on my phone and held it up with my finger ready to call, and he stopped instantly. I pointed out the irony when he’d calmed down.

DH is now super apologetic etc etc, says he will never do it again, will always stand up to BIL if he speaks to me like that again. So now there is this huge tension between me and BIL and I don’t know how we will ever be able to meet up in future and it be normal again.

This was a couple of weeks ago and I can’t get over it. Was I unreasonable? Should I have just shut up and kept the peace?

Today is 5 year anniversary of when I was raped, DH hasn’t remembered and is wondering why I look so sad. The police didn’t believe me when I reported.

So many women excusing her husband's awful behaviour on this thread, telling her not to "cause problems". Why so many pick-me's on this site.

@yellowsunset

So many women excusing her husband's awful behaviour on this thread, telling her not to "cause problems". Why so many pick-me's on this site.

Are you reading a different thread?

OP I am so sorry that you were raped. It must have been awful for you to pluck up the courage to talk to the police about the rape especially as they are your DH's colleagues, and then to be disbelieved. Dreadful conduct from police.

I would not hang around as wife and home sharer to someone who would shout and swear at me like that. The fact that he is a police officer only makes the whole situation worse.
Think about leaving. Do you have DCs, if so, you really can not have them around a person like this.

I don’t think you can ask DH to wade in on the BIL thing BUT what your DH did was totally unacceptable. I would be asking him to go to counselling immediately or I would be packing my things and leaving. Next time, it may not end there. If he has aggression problems he needs to get them sorted ASAP.

If I’m honest, my DH wouldn’t remember that anniversary either, he remembers nothing, so I wouldn’t be too upset about that personally, but it’s good that he is more understanding of it now, which I guess makes sense in why you would expect him to defend you with BIL, but people are funny about family.

You need him to get counselling now. Breathing and yoga are not going to sort this. You need to tell him he gets professional help or you go. Totally unacceptable to speak to you like that and raise his fists.

Your husband sounds terrifying and emotionally abusive. He's the biggest problem here.

I hope you're being gentle with yourself today.

He won't change and you know who he is. Your BIL is obviously a misogynistic shit but less of an issue than the other one who's married to you (and a police officer, God help us).

I can't do angry men. I hate them. They are horrible even when they aren't sexist turds (and I've actually never met one who wasn't). It's not your job to change him or save him or service him or whatever the fuck else he thinks you're here for. Look after yourself, he sure won't.

I think I am being a bit nuts with him wanting him to get involved. I think it is because nobody ever stood up for me, I have a history of childhood trauma and nobody stood up for me then, there was nobody to help me or protect me when I was raped, and the police who were meant to deal with it just didn’t believe me. Not DH’s police force btw, it was referred elsewhere because of DH and me not wanting his colleagues to know. Reading the stuff BIL I was hurting and wanted DH to step in and look after me. It’s pathetic I know.

Re: him being a police officer, he didn’t rage before joining the police. He had a very traumatic experience when he was just trying to do his job and the anger stems from trauma and feeling anxious and at risk all the time, it’s hyperarousal. He does need to have more therapy, he doesn’t want to but I think this is a sign it has to happen. Not excusing his behaviour by any means, but that is why. And people should be concerned about the police force because of the extent and frequency that officers are experiencing trauma. And like me, their families are the secondary victims. We do have children too.

I don’t really mind him not remembering the date. I know some of you have said why dwell on the date, but for me it helps. It’s the day I allow myself to grieve, the rest of the time I take a breath and try not to let it consume me.

I really just don’t want to see his brother again but it is going to cause so many arguments if I don’t 😞

Your husband is abusive

He's a police officer working with victims of domestic abuse and his response, when he calmed down after coming at his own wife with clenched fists, shouting abuse and frightening her so much she dials 999 is to apologise.

He knows abusers apologise. It's easy to be sorry after the event. I have a beautiful apology letter written by my grandfather to my grandmother when she was in hospital. Telling her how much he loved her and how right she was about everything and conveniently ignoring that he put her in hospital during a viscious attack.

If he was actually sorry he would be taking very serious action. Including probably moving out, seeing a GP, seeking mental health support. If he's just saying sorry and doing nothing to prevent a recurrence, he's not that sorry at all.

@AlexisCarringtonColbyDexter

He's a police officer? My God, thats worrying. No wonder the police are losing support if thats the calibre of their employees. Bloody hell

Don’t be shocked. The DV rate is not insignificant among police.

You're not overreacting, you're under underreacting. What your husband did was abusive. Does he lose control like that at work? In front of friends and family? Or is it just when he's alone with you? If this only happens at home, it means be can control it when he wants. That he stopped when he realised his colleagues would find out if you dialled 999 also means he still had control of himself.

Don't stay with a man who calls you a cunt. You deserve so so much better.

At least your BIL is upfront about who he really is - a misogynist - online. Your husband hides his misogyny under the veneer of respectability he gets from his job.

There are some independent domestic violence advocates who specialise in partners of police officers. It is scarily common. Please know that if you speak to the right professional you will be believed and helped.

He had a very traumatic experience when he was just trying to do his job and the anger stems from trauma and feeling anxious and at risk all the time, it’s hyperarousal. He does need to have more therapy, he doesn’t want to but I think this is a sign it has to happen.

If his behaviour, the rages etc and this latest incident towards you are truly due to a traumatic experience that he hadn't been able to deal with .. perhaps he should separate from his loved ones, the people he's supposed to live anyway, until such times as he no longer behaves like that; otherwise he's being abusive. May seem extreme but I don't think so .. he's subjecting his family to abusive behaviour while he has not "solved" his issue. That's not fair on you or anyone he lives with or has close contact with.

Take it he managed to keep in top of the rages and anger (and verbal abuse/ and being aggressive/threatening at work ... Funny that.

Fwiw I do think he should have backed you up against his brother .. his brother espoused opinions, you challenged them/didn't agree .. ok, bug you say then the brother (and someone else?) became really bullying, nasty, malicious, misogynistic etc on SM towards you .. at that point he should have backed you up and told his brother very clearly & firmly that you two can have a difference of opinion and can express it, but not become derogatory, malicious etc on SM or through any other means.

And that's without even considering a woman as a partner who's been personally affected by rape and being disbelieved. Given what he knows happened to you, that's a thousand times more important.

When he's challenged on nor backing you up he becomes extremely verbally aggressive and derogatory, and quite threatening ... Hmm bit of a pattern there with his sibling.

I suspect your DH has a veneer but wonder what he really thinks underneath. Seems like he isn't entirely cut from a different cloth.

Again, funny how he packed it in immediately when he thought you'd call the police and people, his colleagues, would come to know .. seems like he can exercise control when he's really motivated to, which means he's not really motivated to with regard to you.

What are you supposed to be grateful fur exactly?

Does he think he saved you?

Does he think he's the bread winner and not value your contribution?

*Take it he manages to keep in top of the rages and anger (and verbal abuse/ and being aggressive/threatening at work ... Funny that.

He'd have been disciplined or sacked by now if he couldn't, I presume.

the anger stems from trauma and feeling anxious and at risk all the time

So he makes others, people he supposedly loves, feel anxious and at risk .

Do you have rages and feel angry and act like a powder keg near a light too - you've been through a serious trauma, or is it only men who get to act like that as a result of trauma.

If he was actually sorry he would be taking very serious action. Including probably moving out, seeing a GP, seeking mental health support

This.

Your DH knows that in his job he needs to acquire a veneer of sympathy and neutrality/support towards domestic violence and sexual assault victims ... Bit I do wonder how deep it goes.

As a poster above said .. his dw challenges him on something (justified imo) and he's coming at her with fists clenched and calling her an ungrateful cunt, the c word being pretty much the worst thing someone could call someone in our society (esp when aimed at a woman I think). Towards a woman he knows has been a victim of rape/sexual assault, so threatening she has to demonstrate she'll phone the police. ....

Doesn' really fit, does it.

How long have you and your H been together? Do you have children?

My DP wouldn’t be in a relationship with me if he ever swore at me or squared up to me. He’d be out the door so fast and staring at a divorce petition he wouldn’t have a chance to take a breath.

This is really scary--your husband will hit you one day. He only stopped himself from hitting you when he saw you were going to ring for help.
He needs counselling now and I'd probably tell him to leave while he has it.

I don’t know why some posters a treating OP like a child. The OP’s husband doesn’t have to defend his wife on social media but when then brother texted he shouldn’t have pretended that all was okay and belittling his wives feelings.
OP your husband sounds abusive and you’re having a normal reaction to being let down by your husband.
You know deep down that this man is not for you. I can bet this is not the first time he’s shown his “temper”

YABU for thinking you or you or your DH need to get involved with your BILs behaviour your views. If you know he can’t talk or debate rationally then don’t waste your time.

I disagree. Misogynists by definition aren't rational, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't stand up to them. If women don't - who will?

@NailsNeedDoing

This is really difficult. Your DH was wrong for the way he treated you obviously, but you did knowingly cause an issue where there didn’t need to be one.

Your BIL is entitled to his opinion and while it might be a bit of a dick move, he’s not doing anything wrong by positing his opinions on Facebook. There are plenty of women that don’t agree with the #metoo movement for the obvious reason that it is dangerous to automatically assume every person is always telling the truth. Our differing options on that are irrelevant here though.

Your BIL sounds like a twat, but you chose to engage with him knowing that it would stir up drama, and then you threw a tantrum when your DH didn’t stick up for you. It doesn’t sound like your DH was the only unreasonable one here.

I cannot believe what I've just read. Seriously? OP is also unreasonable?

Normal people can have a debate without it turning into disgusting and hateful comments. OP backed off and blocked him and then when BIL said "is everything okay," her DH said yes when he knew full well it wasn't. He should have told him the truth then and there. He didn't have to have a slanging match, but he could have told him that his behaviour was out of order, he could have supported his wife.

Your "throw a tantrum" remark is something you've decided happened, not what did happen. One can be angry without it being a tantrum and to think that anger is a tantrum is really fucking patronising. Her husband was the one who stormed off which is more akin to tantrum behaviour, but I don't think he was having a tantrum either given that he came straight back.

And when he came back he had his fists clenched and called the OP an ungrateful bitch and a fucking cunt. Does anything that happened deserve that? Is it okay for someone to approach you, screaming abuse at you with fists clenched so you - rightly - fear they may attack you?

The #MeToo stuff is pretty much by the by here, she was verbally abused by two members of her family and came close to being physically abused by her husband until she showed him she was about to call 999 which would shame him in front of his workmates.

I think you're a really horrible person.

Oh OP... I just knew you would have had a difficult childhood. Staying with a man who makes you so afraid you consider calling 999, screams of rock bottom self-esteem.

I'm so sorry for what you've gone through I hope you find the strength to see your worth some day and get rid of that horrible prick. Trauma or no trauma, there's no excuse for his behavior, none. You've been traumatized since childhood and you manage not to scream and threaten him... he's deeply misogynistic. There's no cure for that.

OP Do you realize you are worthy of being treated with kindness,respect and love? You mention a rape and childhood trauma-did you receive therapy? Your husband is a human landmine waiting to be stepped on and if any man spoke to me or behaved that way towards me would forever referred to in the past tense

I feel I may have been put into a box of abused wife a little here. I don’t have low self esteem and I do know my worth. I had trauma focussed therapy as a teenager and again after the rape. DH was a massive twat speaking to me like that; in several years together he has spoken to me badly twice, four years apart. In our day to day life we are the most soppy couple, if we have a shared day off we walk the kids to school holding hands and make my friends roll their eyes, we laugh a lot and he does make me happy or I would have left already. I’ll never meet another man who matches me like he does, when we are together I feel like I’m at home, if that makes sense. So no I’m not going to split up with my love because he behaved badly, but I will be insisting he goes back for more trauma therapy so that it doesn’t happen again.