How to set boundaries with manager contacting me in personal time?

[Anonincase]

I work at my main job 26 hours/week (ranges between 21-31 depending on project cycle - shifts termly) and am having a hard time with boundaries.

My manager expects me to work 4 x 12 hour days - start at 8 am with start of day call and regular evening meetings 7-9 pm, always checking in every evening (obvs I work daytimes doing my actual work, hosting external meetings etc). I don't work one set day a week, I work somewhere that day, my manager always contacts me that day for a phone planning. Most weekends she will ring recently saying she was driving to visit inlaws so we can use that two hours to work - it was a Sunday morning.

All staff were given a mental health day last month by ED since covid we've been working extra hours for no extra pay. My manager told me we don't need it and scheduled all day planning meeting that day for our department.

While my manager is a very nice the way she works 24/7 and her expectation others should do the same is v hard. I work this job plus another 15 hours/week at another job. My reviews are v positive, in the last month my manager has received two emails about the difference I've made for two external projects I work on. I'm also a single parent with dc including dc with complex disabilities. That Sunday am call resulted in that dc having a meltdown, with more limited verbal skills change in routine hits v. hard.

My manager does not react well when given boundaries, seen it twice from other depts and was shocked. Yet, I need to set boundaries. In Sept my hours will go down to 21 hours and I want to set boundaries that is 3 days/week not 4 x 10/12 hour days, plus a few hours each weekend. This last year has been hard and I need evenings with my dc. I need more balance for me too.

How would you recommend doing this as a single parent that really needs this job? I feel like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Btw manager contacts me on personal cell, home phone and home email outside of work hours. It isn't a work phone I can just shut off. And yes, she is also a parent (though older dc than mine, sometimes I feel she's forgotten what it is like - her dc are at Uni).

I don't really understand. Are you working 26 hours per week or 48 hours per week? If you're working 26 hours per week then that's when you should be available - it's not acceptable for them to say you're working 26 and expect you to work unpaid overtime constantly. How exactly is it decided how many hours you're working? How did this situation even come about? If it ranges up to 31 then how are you working 4 x 12? Do they say to you that you're now working 31? What does your contract actually say?

God I’ve had this before, it’s a nightmare. Is it possible at the start of the week to note your working hours for the coming week in your electronic diary that she has sight of? If you agree a call at the start of the day and then if she’s talking about evening meetings explain you’re not available or tell her you’ll adjust your working hours to allow you to attend - so morning meeting, long break in the afternoon then evening meeting.

Ignore emails to your home email address (and also check your companies IT policy - I’m not allowed to receive work information at my home email). Withdraw your permission for her to call you at home on your home number.

How long have you worked there? I’d be keeping a note of all my working hours (including ad hoc calls etc) and asking her how she’d like you to take the time back. You only owe them the hours you’re contracted for.

It depends on the level of seniority of your job tbh
At a certain point you’re supposed to be contactable pretty much most of the time - emails appear all hours but it’s expected that you reply when convenient. Anything more pressing is a call or text

You are meant to work 26 hours yet your manager expects you to work 48? Is that correct?

If we weren't in lockdown, when would you actually work and when would you be advised what your hours of work are for the upcoming week?

The way I understand it, you are contracted for 26 hours but she wants 48, and even outside of that she calls you randomly?

You either need to stick to set days and hours, and/or put your phone on 'do not disturb' - if questioned, say you were at your other job. Turn it off at the weekends/down time, or even better ask for a work phone so your personal one cannot be invaded.

I used to have similar issues. Colleagues would message me on my personal phone when I wasn't at work to ask me work related questions. To begin with I would reply but it was affecting my mental health so I just stopped reading them and would only respond when I was in the office. If it was an emergency I would have helped but it was always things that could wait till I was at work. Could you do something similar? Or have a long conversation with her about her expectations vs your hours and caring responsibilities.

I’ve been there, it’s absolutely awful isn’t it. I had to leave my job as it was relentless (there were other reasons) but my female boss called and I text constantly. Other than making your hours clear each week and not responding to your boss outside of hours, there isn’t much else I can suggest.

Make the boundaries clear. Work your hours and the rest of your time is your own, it sounds like you're doing a decent job. If you're being paid for 26 hours, you work 26 hours, not 48+.

Don't answer the phone if she calls out of hours. Just let it ring out and ignore any emails. If she says anything, you were at your other job, asleep, doing things with DC, cleaning, cooking, etc etc. Does she have a manager? Do you have upward reviews/360 reporting etc?

What would happen if you don’t answer her calls out of hours?

Put your mobile phone on 'do not disturb' when you do not want phone calls from her - you can put certain number sin who you want to be able to contact and they won't be silent.

Turn off the ringer on your house phone out of your hours.

Do not open emails from her out of hours

She isn't boundaried, so you have to be. She will eventually realise it is pointless trying to get hold of you outside of your working hours and will give it up - and if not, you are not going to be noticing it so much either.

You need to set boundaries, ensure there is a paper trail for those boundaries and put up with her losing it.

So email is easy - you just remind her of the company's technology security policy and ensure all her emails are automatically deleted so you never see them.

With phones you tell HR plus put in measures to block her calls and withheld numbers.

I manage people and don't expect them to work on holidays or if I work late/weekends. Meetings are also in working hours.

How does the boundary around your 15 hour job work? You seem to imply she can understand you are not available on one particular day perhaps the hours for that might ‘expand’...

You are meant to work 26 hours yet your manager expects you to work 48? Is that correct?
Yeah, I'm confused about this too.
What are your actual hours as per your contract?

Go to HR and ask for confirmation/clarification on the company's technology security policy and the policy on contacting staff outside of work hours/on personal contact details.

Maybe try ‘Ask a manager’ for a script you could use. Or search that site to see if this is a problem others have had and the script that was used.

How on earth has this become the norm? I mean I’ve known some managers to blur the line a bit on occasion but surely you’ve pointed out “actually I don’t work those days/past X time”.

I’m certainly not a clock watcher and will go over my contracted hours on occasion for something that’s time sensitive but you’re being a mug to put up with this. You have to tell her and if you don’t feel you can do it face to face or over the phone then an email explaining that the expectations around your availability and hours worked are completely out of line with your agreed/paid hours. Say that you want all work contact to be by work email and phone and during working hours. You can’t carry on with this!

Calling you on a Sunday morning is so ridiculous, does she have a senior manager?

This is outrageous. I'd stop answering calls outside work hours. Get caller id on your home phone so you know it's her and don't answer. Never answer any emails to your personal account. If you do need to reply, answer from your work email account. I'd be tempted to block her emails on your personal account. You have to instil boundaries or this won't change.

Get 2 mobile phones, 1 for work, 1 for home. Only have your work mobile on during work hours, switch it off outside of this with a voicemail message stating your hours. Do not answer your personal mobile if it’s a withheld number. You could even consider blocking your bosses number on your personal mobile. Set your boundaries and stick to them. In the meantime start looking for a new job.

God this is hard - I agree it’s a mixture of being brave and open with her and sticking to your own boundaries

With her you should have an explicit conversation eg. “The last couple of months I’ve worked 40+ hour weeks instead of 26 hours, this is not sustainable as I have a second job and am a single mother, I’m going to start putting out of office on for internal emails to remind everyone of my hours, I’m going to stop taking calls and messages/emails outside of those hours unless prescheduled and explicitly agreed with me, if it’s an absolute emergency text me and I will reply only if it’s an emergency.” You can always frame it as other unnamed colleagues are the issue and not explicitly make it obvious it’s her (although it probably won’t be as effective).

Then the other angle is your own boundaries - just decide you won’t answer the phone from her when you see her on caller ID, won’t open WhatsApp from her outside of office hours, won’t reply to anything that isn’t super urgent (and define urgent as something that if you left it until the next work day someone would lose their job or die or substantial money would be lost immediately). Decide you won’t agree to meetings outside of your call hours. Decide you won’t check work things on weekends. She’ll quickly learn that you aren’t just her dogsbody and you’ll still get the job done.

I work in an industry where almost everyone works 9-9pm or longer 5 days a week. I’ve done very well despite only working 9-6pm most days. Just have the confidence to know you’re good at your job without working all hours under the sun.

I'd speak to HR and her manager if you know she won't react well

One reason I left my last job. The manager would phone me on my days off , then when I ignored her calls she told me that wasn’t acceptable.

Much happier now I’ve left, and I wasn’t the only one to leave.

God, I had this with a boss, was a nightmare. I was being paid for 10 hours per week and started off with a clear set of roles and responsibilities - bit by bit she added extra things to do but with no extra pay or acknowledgement that things would take longer. My mother was also dying of cancer at this time and I had a new baby but she piled on the responsibilities and was very angry when I couldn't meet them all.

I wish I'd been more assertive OP. You need to email her with very clear times that you will be available. Refuse to pick up at other times. Her behaviour is bordering on harassment and you are not obliged to tolerate it. Don't ask her to respect your boundaries, calmly and politely state that you will not respond outside of work hours.

Good luck - it's not easy to stand up for yourself but your work, parenting and health will suffer if you don't do it now.

Yeah, dont answer the phone.
Or, if you are scared of laying down boundaries clearly, can you ask her for a chat and say 'hey, i only work 26 hours a week but you've been needing me a lot more outside of that time, so i think we need to take a look at hiring someone - how about xyz'

Trouble is as I understand it, you need this job.

How about starting the week with 'could we schedule my 26 hours for this week in a firm schedule. They seem to have grown to much more and I've been happy to help out. But this is taking a toll, so much so I cannot care properly for my ad dc, so I would like us to agree how you would like the hours distributed'.

Something to that effect, do buy a new home mobile phone, if you can afford it. Then she can have a field day without you noticing it. Finally is there a hr department, that could be your last resort, if she doesn't respond positively. And oh you probably have to say this every week, in a nice but firm way.