To those who make friends easily

[Binny36]

How do you do it? What are the secrets/tips?

I feel I attract 2 types of people in my life: users and clingy. I’ll give some examples so maybe someone can tell me where I’m going wrong: 1)users met a new mum friend from baby group and very early on she wouldn’t hesitate to ask for things - childcare, borrowing stuff etc I just avoided as I felt quite uncomfortable and used. 2) clingy I met a lovely girl in a baby play activity I went to every week, we quickly became friends and I went back to work 4 days a week. On my day off she would always want to meet up (I know it sounds lovely! But wait till I finish) she’s the one that used to arrange it not me and I said yes every time. I’d be waiting for her where we arranged and she would text me saying “oh so sorry hun I can’t make it xxx”. I’m not exaggerating it would happen a lot! I started resenting her as I felt she booked up my only day off and I never knew if she would follow up or cancel last minute. I felt suffocated by her and every time my phone beeped for a meet-up my heart would sink. I did carry in this friendship for 4 years! I tried so hard to just let things fizzle out but she would contact me every time. Our boys ended up in same primary school so I saw more of her. She thank god did a shitty thing so I had perfect excuse to “break up” with her. She still tries to catch my eye and is sorry for what she did but I rather be friendless than have Someone like her in my life.

Sorry I waffled on! I really want nice friends who don’t take the piss and I can have nights out with, why is it so hard? Not sure how post - covid will work. I’ll be going back to work 3 days.

I am only sad about my kids missing out on social interactions

It’s difficult now with covid as I would have suggested invite them for a play date! But a lot of people will be nervous about play dates with new friends. I know it’s difficult but hang in there x

@Binny36

I am only sad about my kids missing out on social interactions

It’s difficult now with covid as I would have suggested invite them for a play date! But a lot of people will be nervous about play dates with new friends. I know it’s difficult but hang in there x

Have tried that.

People would either find excuses or come and never reciprocate.

I am done trying to be the one that puts myself constantly out there to be rejected.

One so called friend, would consistently come over to mine for 7 years and not once invited me to her house. Happy to accept my hospitality and never even invite me over for a cuppa.

Fuck that shit.

It's more a kind of feeling that you never know who this person is because they never show you...because they can't stand the idea that someone might not like them. Even if they don't like the person themselves! It feels like a lack of gumption and far, far too much investment in what other people think. It leaves you not knowing if they genuinely like you or not, and realising that it wouldn't make a difference either way. I just can't warm to those people because, like I said...I don't know who they are!

This point by @ShebaShimmyShake is exactly right, and it appears to be something a lot of women don't understand, judging by all the posts on here that essentially run 'I do everything for my friends and they never do anything for me'.

These women are not actually being generous, they just never say no to even the most outrageous requests because they're terrified of being disliked -- and in their disordered world, saying 'no' to any request gives other people a legitimate reason to dislike them.

And because their entire method of relating to others involves trying to avoid being disliked (even by people they don't themselves like or respect), they become invisible service-providers to the people they know.

No one really knows them, because their social persona is being whatever they think the other person wants - a shoulder to cry on, a runner of errands, a provider of free childcare, a lender of money, an agree-er.

Again, I've spent my entire life watching the consequences of this in my mother. She has spent her life believing herself to be a generous friend, trotting about after other people, and she's unconsciously deeply resentful that she has no friends at all in her seventies, and is completely baffled and resentful that her daughter (who often says 'No, that doesn't work for me' or 'I don't have time to talk now, but I'll call you later') has lots.

But nobody knows who she really is -- not even she does, she's spent so long being what she thinks other people won't dislike!

You can't really trust that this person would have your back in a situation where you were being exploited, because they haven't even got their own...they're so scared of someone not liking them.

Exactly. I've heard my mother nodding and 'yes' ing along with a nakedly racist 'friend' because her fear of being disliked dominates what she actually thinks is right and wrong. She has allowed it to govern her entire life, and to cripple her relationships with other people. And yes, she doesn't even have her own back, which is the saddest thing to witness. And her terrible loneliness, after a life spent (she believes) putting herself out for other people.

I just kind of lurk about until an extrovert feels sorry for me and adopts me as their friend

Limpid

Great post. My mother was similar.

It's also striking that this is a notably female trait because, surprise surprise, a large number of women have been socialised to believe that a) their needs are subsidiary to everyone else's b) their financial and emotional security depends on keeping a man happy and c) that its impolite to be assertive about what you really want, think and feel.

OP I think many women have a tendency to be like this. and as a society we have a lot of deprogramming to do so I wouldn't be too hard on yourself.

But I think you need to work quite hard on developing a sense of self and learning to articulate it honestly to people.

@thepeopleversuswork, I had you pegged for someone else with a similar mother. It gives you (alas) an excellent education in the dynamics of this kind of person.

And yes, absolutely, it is a trait far more commonly found in women because women are still socialised to consider other people's needs before their own, and I don't in the least want to add to these women's troubles by pointing an accusing finger at them.

I certainly had to deprogramme myself as a teenager, as did my two sisters -- and I remember to this day my mother's fury (and, looking back, her fear) the first time I publicly said no to a male authority figure. (Completely unimportant request, he was just able to move on to the next person.) Because, in her view, it would give rise to dislike on his part for me.

But I think that women who do this need to recognise that it's not a benign thing, where they're the nice, put-upon 'people pleasers' and other people just don't appreciate the extent to which they put themselves out for others. You are choosing to engage in behaviour which prevents you from having healthy friendships because your fear of being disliked means you are making yourself invisible and unknowable.

Nods along to @Limpid and @thepeopleversuswork .

As you guys say, it isn't benign and it isn't based in kindness and compassion. It's not genuine or sincere.

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

I used to think the same as you, that those types targeted me! But the truth is, they try it with everyone except very confident people. I've learned to set boundaries and say how I feel nicely, so they know when I'm annoyed. E.g. if friend keeps cancelling I used to say okay no problem, now I say oh no I was really looking forward to it! What a shame as I have nothing else to do that day. That way she knows she's annoyed me. Also learn to be less available.

When my neighbour asked me to regularly take her kids to school, I said only in an emergency. If you want it on a regular basis, then we could take turns and do 2 days each. "Oh no" she said," I would never be able to help you!" I no longer allow myself to be used.

Limpid

"I certainly had to deprogramme myself as a teenager, as did my two sisters -- and I remember to this day my mother's fury (and, looking back, her fear) the first time I publicly said no to a male authority figure. (Completely unimportant request, he was just able to move on to the next person.) Because, in her view, it would give rise to dislike on his part for me."

Yep I have had many similar experiences with my mother. She was enraged by the fairly heated discussions I used to have (about anything and everything) with my father because she had been brought up to think that the man was the "head of the family" and shouldn't be overtly challenged. She was therefore profoundly uncomfortable with that fact that my sister and I didn't accept this dynamic. Ironically he treated both of us with greater respect than he ever afforded her.

That kind of overt deference towards men as figures of authority is less prevalent these days than in the 70s when I was a young kid, but the "people pleasing" tendency is linked to this.

As ShebaShimmyShake says an important takeaway from this is that the people pleaser won't necessarily be perceived by others as being a compassionate person, they will be perceived primarily as someone who doesn't have the guts to stand up for what they want.

I agree with you Limpid that one shouldn't punish people for this: its very difficult to unwind decades of socialisation. But OP keep in mind that by learning to be more honest with yourself and with others (within reason) you will ultimately make yourself more likeable.

Remember that if your social persona is constructed entirely around doing what you think the other person wants, you're not going to attract people who like you for you and desire the pleasure of your company. You'll attract people who want to use you and don't care about the fact that they don't know who you are or what you want because that's not what they're after.

I wish we could undo this belief that it's somehow virtuous to enable this crap. The irony is that we would all actually treat each other better without it!

I make friends easily..... Didn't used to when I was younger, mostly because I was shy, tried too hard and cared too much what other people thought of me.

Now I'm much older and really don't care whether someone is friends or not. I'm kindly and pleasant to everyone, if they aren't bothered, it's fine.

I also talk to everyone I meet. I smile a lot, give compliments, offer to help. Some people want to keep to themselves, others are happy to reply and start up a conversation. This approach helps if you are in a completely new place (I have moved quite a lot in my life) and know absolutely no-one....you have to start somewhere.

I also join lots of things (harder in lockdown!), yoga groups, churches, coffee mornings, writers clubs, walking groups, voluntary groups...anything where I will meet new people. Out of every group/class or whatever, there will be one or two who become real friends rather than just acquaintances, and those one or two are likely to lead you to others that they know, who might also become part of your friendship circle....

I don't stay friends with people who turn out to be draining or who constantly 'take' and give nothing. Life is too short to be put upon, and there are always lots of other people in the world....

Remember that if your social persona is constructed entirely around doing what you think the other person wants, you're not going to attract people who like you for you and desire the pleasure of your company. You'll attract people who want to use you and don't care about the fact that they don't know who you are or what you want because that's not what they're after.

I wish we could undo this belief that it's somehow virtuous to enable this crap. The irony is that we would all actually treat each other better without it!

Amen to all that. It should be a sticky that appears on a lot of the posts on Mn about being exploited by 'friends'.

Thank you everyone. I just got motivated by all the responses and got in touch with NDN as her kid is constantly kicking his football in my garden and damaging things. I asked her politely if he could be careful as many times ball has also come very close to hitting my baby on the head. I’ve never done this before as was scared of being “disliked” but my kids safety come first. See I once posted on MN asking whether I should talk to her and majority of people said I should not as he has a right to play in his garden. I don’t care what they do in their gardens as long as it’s not impacting me. An odd ball here and there is okay but this morning alone 2 were kicked!

I’m having a nagging feeling I did wrong but no I need to think of my baby’s safety and my lovely ornaments in my garden he is always kicking into

I find it easy to make friends.

So the key here OP Is that you didn't do what suited YOU in these situations. I choose who I want to spend time with - if I meet someone and don't like how they behave - I stop hanging out with them - would not be waiting for some 'reason' to allow me to end the friendship.

Think of it this way - every moment you wasted on that 'clingy' friend (she wasn't that clingy btw was she? She used you when she wanted and wasn't actualyl reliable) - was a moment you could have been off finding a friend you actually liked.

Every time you arranged to meet her - even though you clearly didn't really want to and found her a stressful presence in your life - you could have been taking that energy and enjoying meeting new people somewhere else.

It sounds like your confidence is a bit low and you don't trust your own judgement - you can work on both those things. Believe that you deserve to be friends with people you enjoy being with and who give as well as take!

That is a really good post wondergirl so true!

Great post wondergirl. Binny be firmer with people. I found I was a people pleaser. I suit myself alot more now. If you work x days well your day off is errands. I found few school mams bit clicky. Was glad as mine got older didnt have see them! Hate users too

I find it easy to make friends, if I meet someone I think I like I make an effort to listen twice as much as I speak and to ask lots of questions about the person. I then decide if I think they could become a friend. I take things slow and think of things we both like to do. So one friend and I go to the cinema or meet for coffees a lot another we go shopping or for a walk etc.
I review my friends every couple of years and if someone makes me feel negative or brings me down I phase them out. This rarely happens and most of my friends have been in my life for the last three to forty years.

I make friends easily. Without sounding up my own arse, I tend to attract people to me. I think it's because I'm outgoing, I'll talk to anyone and I have a positive attitude and I'm funny. My work colleagues say I make the office a nicer place because I'm always upbeat.

I also genuinely don't care what people think of me and I think that attracts people. I am kind but I am not a people pleaser. If someone says something I disagree with I will say so, not in a nasty way but with confidence. I don't fear rejection either.

I wish I wasn’t a people pleaser, but I am completely. I had a very very good/best friend and I literally did so much with her and for her but realised, she was having all the fun with other friends and moaning about things with me.... I no longer speak to her as I just felt used and didn’t like several aspects of her personality, but now I am just very lonely. Not sure what to do - so I can sympathise OP

I agree with the poster who said that making friends is not about "being nice". I have made friends easily all my life, and I don't think anyone would put "nice" in my top ten characteristics. Women have been socialised too much into thinking that being nice is the most important thing. Not being nice does not mean that you are nasty. It means having boundaries, daring to disagree, saying no when you want to. These are all good things, in friendships and in life in general.

@PeonyRose80, look at posts on this thread by @thepeopleversuswork, @ShebaShimmyShake and me. What you term ‘people-pleasing’ has meant that you wasted years of your life rushing around doing things for someone you didn’t even like, and, far from being a good thing that shows how nice you are, is actually likely to be what is preventing you from making friends.

Be honest, would you want to make friends with someone who had such poor boundaries and low self-esteem that they termed a ‘best friend’ someone who saw them only as a sounding board for complaints?

I totally agree @Limpid - I am a shell of my former self, will read this thread and take it on board.

Sorry if that sounded as if I were putting the boot in, @Peony -- I recognise that it involves a lot of work to reprogramme yourself when you've learned a certain way of being, even when it's deeply unhealthy and makes you unhappy.

@PeonyRose80, @thepeopleversuswork, @ShebaShimmyShake, @Limpid and anyone else!

I’m a people pleaser and have put everyone else before me. I suffer from anxiety and some depression. Can you help me deal with a workplace issue please:

I’m starting new job in September, will be getting paid from 1st September. Already I’ve spent time doing meetings and producing documents etc. They keep emailing me on my personal email address and now I have further emails listing extra things I have to do with deadlines by when! I don’t want to piss them off before even starting the job! I don’t want them thinking I’m lazy either - how to deal? Just to note the person whose sent the recent workload has previously ignored my email when I’ve asked them for some Information in order to complete previous task.

You can say no in a nice way.