To those who make friends easily

[Binny36]

How do you do it? What are the secrets/tips?

I feel I attract 2 types of people in my life: users and clingy. I’ll give some examples so maybe someone can tell me where I’m going wrong: 1)users met a new mum friend from baby group and very early on she wouldn’t hesitate to ask for things - childcare, borrowing stuff etc I just avoided as I felt quite uncomfortable and used. 2) clingy I met a lovely girl in a baby play activity I went to every week, we quickly became friends and I went back to work 4 days a week. On my day off she would always want to meet up (I know it sounds lovely! But wait till I finish) she’s the one that used to arrange it not me and I said yes every time. I’d be waiting for her where we arranged and she would text me saying “oh so sorry hun I can’t make it xxx”. I’m not exaggerating it would happen a lot! I started resenting her as I felt she booked up my only day off and I never knew if she would follow up or cancel last minute. I felt suffocated by her and every time my phone beeped for a meet-up my heart would sink. I did carry in this friendship for 4 years! I tried so hard to just let things fizzle out but she would contact me every time. Our boys ended up in same primary school so I saw more of her. She thank god did a shitty thing so I had perfect excuse to “break up” with her. She still tries to catch my eye and is sorry for what she did but I rather be friendless than have Someone like her in my life.

Sorry I waffled on! I really want nice friends who don’t take the piss and I can have nights out with, why is it so hard? Not sure how post - covid will work. I’ll be going back to work 3 days.

Know exactly what you mean. All I’ve attracted over the years is users, people who expect money/my time and never return the favour.
I think it’s because I’m scared of imposing myself on others where as I should be thinking “do I like them? Are they a suitable friend” rather than worrying about how i come across. 😂 time we all start being more selfish.

Oh, my sisters and I are fine, @Binny -- we grew up into total ballbreakers with excellent boundaries, after spending our childhoods with an excellent example of what not to do.

And I posted not to make you feel guilty, only to stress that, if you are someone who is used to treating her own wishes as unimportant, you need to change this, not just for you but also for your children. Especially if you have daughters, because you will be contributing to what is still a gendered form of socialisation to put other people's wishes ahead of your own.

I think you need to refocus in that what other people think of you is irrelevant you can't control it, and isn't primarily to do with you YOU need to approve of your own actions, decide what is best for you. Stop looking for external validation. Provide your own. As 'What's in this for me?' when someone wants you to do something. Practice saying 'That doesn't work for me' and 'I can't help you with that'.

Can I ask how people cope with a friendship that has gone wrong , or for want of a better word " stale", particularly if you are likely to bump into that person because they live locally.

As an aside, I think friends formed via children, schools, kids parties and so on sometimes just outlive their purpose. I am in my 60's. I wonder if I'll ever have any friends again tbh.

I make friends easily. It is hard to say why. I work with some people who are trying to make friends and failing, and I would say that the difference between us is probably that they are very self-focused and dominate all conversation, while I am genuinely interested in other people, and listen and follow up what they say. I am also very easy going with friendships and don't take offense or feel slighted easily - people have other shit going on in their lives which sometimes makes them act weird. The same work colleagues who have trouble making friends seem to be endlessly offended by not very much at all. Also, I don't gossip about people. I do want to hear about how people are getting on and what is going on in their lives, but I won't participate in character assassinations, mean jokes etc.

Regarding users, clingers etc. I don't really have a problem with them. I suspect they don't try to be friends with me in the first place because they know they wouldn't get anywhere. I suspect people like that are more likely to bond with those who will give them what they want.

randomer

"Can I ask how people cope with a friendship that has gone wrong , or for want of a better word " stale", particularly if you are likely to bump into that person because they live locally."

I think this is probably more of an acute problem if you live rurally or in a small community. One of the benefits of living in a big city is that you have to work quite hard to see even really good friends so you avoid those "default" friendships. It doesn't suit everyone but if you want friendships to be based on genuinely shared values rather than convenience and proximity its helps.

I think a lot of it comes down to the aformentioned sense of self. Friendships outlive their usefulness and I don't think you should be afraid of drawing a line when they have. There are no prizes for keeping relationships up when they have passed their natural shelf life.

I feel I attract 2 types of people in my life: users and clingy
Those types are looking for people who are not assertive and not good and making or enforcing boundaries. If you can find a good assertiveness class you might a few things change for you.

I make friends very easily too, I am interested in everyone and believe everyone has value and something to offer the world. I love nothing more than to hear their stories, experiences etc. I enjoy laughing and humour, so I am considered good company. Being positive and cheerful are character traits that leads to many new friends I find, and open to meeting up.
My problem is a lack of time for everyone, and probably I don't like to overshare very personal information. I have boundaries in place, definitely, so I quite cheerfully turn down many invites/demands on my time and do not expect anyone to take it personally. If you are turning things down, do so with extreme kindness and you won't go far wrong.

You should never have to feel taken advantage of/drained/exhausted or poorer for friendship. If I start to feel any of the above that is generally an indicator that the friendship isn't for me. I will distance myself when this happens.

Also knowing that friends are not always for life, they blow in and out of our lives like passing clouds, and if we are very blessed some will stay throughout, but that should never be an expectation. In my experience many are there for part of the journey, and there are many roads and mountains to travel. Let them go when it naturally comes to an end with no hard feelings.

If you have a small treasure trove of real friends, even just one or two and they are friends that can be truly counted on, that is far more important than a portfolio of fake friends. Think Quality over Quantity.

Both the situations that you've described, you've ended up ghosting the person, which is really hurtful, rather than being more assertive and discussing the issues in a firm, but non aggressive way. You've tried to avoid an unpleasant situation, but have actually created an even more unpleasant one.

From the context, its clear that you don't wish to be unkind.

You need to find some inner strength, and set clear, healthy boundaries.

For someone who is asking more than you want to give, then decline firmly but politely. Don't agree to do something you don't want to do. No need to end the friendship, but put in place healthy boundaries.

For someone who is flaky and lets you down, it should have been addressed, assertively, but politely, after the first occasion. No need to end a friendship, but be clear about your expectations.

I really appreciate everyone who had taken their time to respond to me. Thank you so much! I found a really good thread called
“ To ask whether you’ve ever regretted a kind gesture?”. That really helping me see how much people struggle with boundaries and the CF that take advantage. Thank you so much everyone x

Good luck.

I make friends easily. I treat people with kindness but I have boundaries and, although I don't need any new friends, I'm always open to an interesting person. Also, I'm genuinely curious about people, and women friends in particular.
If a friendship flourishes, I really cultivate it properly. Maintaining regular contact, offering support in hard times, being a cheerleader for that person generally. I value my friendships very highly and I believe strongly in taking care of the women around me. Friends are the only people you get to choose, aside from your partner. I'm less good at romance...

One other tip (although I suspect it's not easy to follow) is not to give a shit what people think of you - put out clear friendship signals to the people you like. I have no worries about rejection, which is born of a general self-assurance. I know this is really a gift from my parents and not everyone can tap into it.

Some great points on here, totally agree with Pigeon some friends aren't always for 'life' but you can have good times whilst they are around, I had a wonderful friend in my 30s, we had a lot of fun together, weekends away etc etc - but we drifted apart and don't even exchange birthday or Christmas cards anymore ... a bit sad but I look back with very happy memories on that friendship.

I have other friends I have known from nursery school (we are all over 60 ), again, good times over many years but if I am brutally honest and I met them now, would we be friends? Maybe not. A lot of the friendship is bound up in past shared experiences.

And as Chloe says, don't worry what other people think about you, just like you don't get on with everyone, not everyone will like you or want to be your friend. I've met people over the years that I would have loved to get to know better but perhaps they didn't feel the same about me. The funniest experience was when I met a woman I really warmed to, we had boys the same age and arranged a play date, she sent her DH with her DS on the day, he was perfectly pleasant, but not someone I wanted to make friends with .

@ChloeCC and @ragwort sone good points thank you. I do think it’s my self conscious ness that makes it more difficult for me and also people can sense I’m a people pleaser so the users n boundary pushers come into my life!

I would love to have a good network of friends as one day my kids will be bigger and won’t need me so much. I need to get my issues into order first and work on myself and yes you’re right not to worry what others think of me but it’s hard! I have few hours sleep at the moment with my little ones so that makes it worse as I’m too exhausted half the time

People will value you at the worth you place on yourself, OP.

Like a lot of women, you've been conditioned into a Cinderella complex. But like I said, there's no fairy godmother. And there isn't any virtue in enabling someone to treat you badly. Their behaviour is obviously not on you, but you're not somehow a better person for putting up with it. If anything, it makes you a tool in perpetuating it.

I'll be honest, I don't like "people pleasers" very much. I understand that they're frightened and worried, but I think it's the wrong label. Their motivation isn't really making people happy, but just not being disliked, even if they themselves don't like the person in question. It's not really about being kind and compassionate.

It's very hard to overcome this mindset, I know, and I'm certainly not saying you should yourself become rude or exploitative, or that you shouldn't be nice and respectful to people. Just ask yourself if this is an acceptable way to treat someone and if not, don't imagine that it scores you celestial points to accept it for yourself. It doesn't. It really doesn't.

Thanks @ShebaShimmyShake. Yes it makes sense what you are saying, it is hard to overcome mindset but I’m getting there!

I'll be honest, I don't like "people pleasers" very much. I understand that they're frightened and worried, but I think it's the wrong label. Their motivation isn't really making people happy, but just not being disliked, even if they themselves don't like the person in question. It's not really about being kind and compassionate.

Yes, exactly. Perhaps this is a useful message to get out there for people who are stuck in this cycle of behaviour but justify it by saying ;Oh, I'm a terrible people-pleaser!' -- not only are you not a 'good person' for endlessly placating other people, including people you don't like or respect, you are actually engaging in behaviour which pther people (the ones who aren't invested in exploiting you) are repelled by.

Your ''people-pleasing' is actively preventing you making friends.

I'm not unsympathetic, because women are still socialised into this kind of nonsense to an extent, and many people had role-models that taught them this, but after a point you need to take responsibility for your own behaviour.

Limpid makes a very important point: it’s not only that people pleasing isn’t helpful for the person doing the people pleasing and leaves them open to exploitation. It’s also a big turn-off for others.

I have a “friend” who I have known for years who is lovely, caring, intelligent and an all round good person. But she tries way too hard with people. There’s something about it which people can smell and it’s really irrationally off putting. Very unfair, but true.

OP I do think counselling would be a good first step to help you unpick your approach to this.

@thepeopleversuswork

But she tries way too hard with people. There’s something about it which people can smell and it’s really irrationally off putting. Very unfair, but true

Yes that is me! I think my people pleasing comes from low self esteem coupled with growing up in a really small village (moved to a big city now). I have really tried to drop this. Is being smiley smiley a sign of people pleasing too? I’m always trying to be really nice and smile at everyone!

[quote Binny36]@thepeopleversuswork

But she tries way too hard with people. There’s something about it which people can smell and it’s really irrationally off putting. Very unfair, but true

Yes that is me! I think my people pleasing comes from low self esteem coupled with growing up in a really small village (moved to a big city now). I have really tried to drop this. Is being smiley smiley a sign of people pleasing too? I’m always trying to be really nice and smile at everyone![/quote]
It's not being smiley or pleasant or respectful to people. That's something else. It's more a kind of feeling that you never know who this person is because they never show you...because they can't stand the idea that someone might not like them. Even if they don't like the person themselves! It feels like a lack of gumption and far, far too much investment in what other people think. It leaves you not knowing if they genuinely like you or not, and realising that it wouldn't make a difference either way. I just can't warm to those people because, like I said...I don't know who they are!

And of course, because they're not actually robots, they DO get resentful and angry when people treat them like crap, but they....still keep putting up with it for no good reason. You can't really trust that this person would have your back in a situation where you were being exploited, because they haven't even got their own...they're so scared of someone not liking them.

It's hard to describe, and I'm sorry because I don't mean to do a hatchet job on anyone. It's obvious that you're very nice. I'm just trying to explain why I don't really like "people pleasers" and don't think it's the right term.

OP the other thing to factor is that often people have an established circle of friends and they simply can't be bothered with new ones.

That's what I found living in Yorkshire. People here are locals, they have friends they know from childhood that are close to. They don't have the inclination to let new people in.

As an immigrant here I have found it extremely hard, as I have genuinely tried to integrate and belong. But I am simply not allowed to do so.

I don't have loads of close friends (I like it that way as I don't have the time to dedicate to intense friendships) but I have a lot of general friends. I'm outgoing, chatty, friendly and generally like to have a laugh. I can adapt to any situation and will talk pretty much to anyone. If you show people you have confidence but you don't rely on their friendship people generally gravitate to people like that as there is an air of intrigue that I think most people like to try and get to know.
I've cut people out who treat me badly and I try and make time for those who make time for me. Treat those how they treat you and how you want to be treated.

@ShebaShimmyShake thank you. No I understand exactly what you mean

@Immigrantsong yes it is difficult moving into a small village as people have close
friendships. But don’t let that put u off! Keep trying and maybe join a few groups?

@heidi1976 - If you show people you have confidence but you don't rely on their friendship people generally gravitate to people like that a that’s good advice thank you!

[quote Binny36]@ShebaShimmyShake thank you. No I understand exactly what you mean

@Immigrantsong yes it is difficult moving into a small village as people have close
friendships. But don’t let that put u off! Keep trying and maybe join a few groups?

@heidi1976 - If you show people you have confidence but you don't rely on their friendship people generally gravitate to people like that a that’s good advice thank you![/quote]
I live in a city in Yorkshire, so not village. But it has a village mentality.

I did try to join a lot of things: groups, local church...but nothing worked for reasons mentioned above.

I am reminded every day that I am foreign and not wanted. I now know my place here and have given up trying.

These are the things that turn people to radicalism. Consistently being made to feel like an unwanted.

I have just turned into a misanthrope. I am only sad about my kids missing out on social interactions.

People have already pointed out you are far too compliant and a people pleaser which I was going to write.

I make friends easily, I’m told I’m amusing plus I can spin a yarn. I have quite a small life these days but DS says Mum you could describe how you make a cup of tea sound interesting. When younger I trained for three distinct careers, tried many sports and hobbies and travelled a lot met a lot of politicians and was involved with political campaigning, so there is a lot of yarn to spin.

I have relocated twice in my life and am mixed race and have experienced racism. I live very much in one of the sort of areas that people write they would be worried to move to on MN as won’t leave a big mixed metropolitan area.

I’m also brutally honest when asked a question, it has got me in to trouble a few times in my life but so many people are not truthful. I think people find that refreshing. I know people are often untruthful because they are actually nicer than me and don’t want to hurt people’s feelings. I have currently annoyed a long standing friend who is back in touch with an ex lover who treated her like absolute dirt, her marriage is breaking down. He is sniffing about like the scum he is. He was married when she saw him and is an absolute user.

Making friends really isn’t about being nice at all, it doesn’t mean people want you to be nasty though. DS can be an arrogant know it all sometimes, he is very competitive, a talker, motivator and a striver. Nice is not a word I would ever use to describe him, but my goodness he is popular. I have however heard him talk on zoom to his friends in this lockdown who are suffering and heard real kindness and concern.

OP I think ShebaShimmyShake has hit the nail on the head with this:

"It's not being smiley or pleasant or respectful to people. That's something else. It's more a kind of feeling that you never know who this person is because they never show you...because they can't stand the idea that someone might not like them. Even if they don't like the person themselves! It feels like a lack of gumption and far, far too much investment in what other people think. It leaves you not knowing if they genuinely like you or not, and realising that it wouldn't make a difference either way. I just can't warm to those people because, like I said...I don't know who they are!"

Whether you're smiley or friendly has nothing to do with it really. It's to do with being authentically you. If being smiley and nice is your thing then do smiley and nice. If being direct and assertive is you then do that. You shouldn't ever be in a position of trying to project an aspect of your personality which is not real.

What I think people recoil from is a feeling that you are keeping your real self at one level of remove, either because you don't trust your instincts or because you don't have enough confidence in yourself. Any person who is in touch with what they are genuinely feeling and is able to express that in communication will be attractive to others.

This is why I think counselling is quite important, because it helps you get in touch with your own emotions and needs and express them in an authentic way.