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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Hoarder in laws and childcare

67 replies

Sunshines21 · 27/06/2020 00:43

Hi there

I’m about to return to work after maternity, the plan was always for nursery 4 mornings a week and my in laws who live locally agreed to look after my baby 2 afternoons a week.
However with Covid the nursery is closed and after much phoning round nurseries where we are most are still either closed or only taking children who have two key worker parents.
Our in laws had a chat with my husband and offered to take our baby to their place while we work at home (we have a small flat).
However I’ve never been in their house due to my in-laws hoarding. My mil is really embarrassed so doesn’t want anyone to see. My husband and his brother used to be welcome but neither have seen inside in over a year. I don’t think it’s a safe environment for a baby and have asked to see inside prior to agreeing if my baby can go there. My in-laws have unfortunately responded defensively. My FIL actually spoke to my husband on his own after and reduced him to tears. We both feel awful about the situation but I just can’t agree it’s suitable for my baby. The alternative would be me muddling along with work at home and childcare and they could maybe take him out in the afternoon so I can get along with some work. However they are so furious that they are now not wanting to look after the baby at all. I feel I’ve caused a bit of a rift, I’m wondering if I’m being unreasonable?

OP posts:
headlock · 27/06/2020 00:56

YANBU. If they hoard enough stuff to be embarrassed enough to not let anyone in the house, there's a good chance it's not the most hygienic.
If it were me I wouldn't let my baby go to their house either.
Also, the fact they reduced your DH over it and won't make any effort to see your point of view is ridiculous.

Beldon · 27/06/2020 00:56

So they are too embarrassed for adults to see house, including their own sons but think it’s a suitable environment for a vulnerable child. Yanbu and there isn’t a chance I’d let them take my baby

TheVanguardSix · 27/06/2020 00:59

You need to muddle along and work from home, for the safety of your child. You'd never ever forgive yourself if any harm came to your baby. Hoarders have no sense of safety. You may as well watch your child walk across a minefield and hope for the best.
This isn't about making people happy and avoiding conflict. Your child is EVERYTHING here, OP. Your child is ALL that matters. You could have the PILs come to yours to look after your little one. But sending him/her off to theirs? No way.

SissySpacekAteMyHamster · 27/06/2020 01:00

Do not put your child in that situation.

Unfortunately, you are going to have to work a way round you and dh looking after dc. Child minders/babysitters are available, and maybe you could look into that as an option.

Blondebakingmumma · 27/06/2020 01:01

YANBU It’s not up to the ILs to decide if their house is safe enough for your baby. I wouldn’t be sending them until I’ve had a look. There could be any number of dangerous items within reach or rubbish not thrown out. It must be pretty bad if they don’t let their own family in.

My feeling is that they will stick to their guns. Because in the end their hoard is more important to anything else

ArriettyJones · 27/06/2020 01:02

What did your FIL say to your DH? What is the gist of their position?

giantangryrooster · 27/06/2020 01:05

If you are not allowed to see, it might be really bad, mold, rodents, things stacked that can fall down, knee deep waste, who knows? Don't let them babysit for walks in the afternoon, chances are they take your dc to their house and say see it was alright.

Sorry about the rift, but this is your dc's safety that is at stake. Talk to your dh about a non-safe environment versus his parents mh.

nevermorelenore · 27/06/2020 01:08

Having had a family member who was a serious hoarder, I'd say hell no. Most hoarders don't feel embarrassed about their hoarding until it reaches really bad levels, so god knows how unsafe and unhygienic it is at the moment. Many hoarders also claim that their place is clean, but it's impossible to properly vacuum or dust in a hoarded home.

They're obviously getting defensive because they know it's an issue. Hopefully they will get help one day.

alexdgr8 · 27/06/2020 01:14

agree with all the above.
and you do too, don't you OP.
also why would you want your child around bullying people who reduce their own adult son to tears.
what kind of behaviour is this. hardly a good example of family love.
there is a term for this kind of thing. a form of abuse. like when someone raises a reasonable query with their partner/friend who is then so outraged and indignant, making the person feel bad, while side-stepping the original issue, shifting the attention, or victim blaming.
you will have to proceed without them.
just as well you found out how hazardous their place is before your child came to harm there. you cannot trust their judgement. hoarders minimise/ excuse/ are blind to the situation.
don't let their defensiveness adversely affect you or your baby, or indeed as far as you can, your dear husband.
they probably put him down when he was younger.
you can big him up. he's got away from them now.
you and baby are his family now. lucky him.

Ladida01 · 27/06/2020 01:17

My Mum was a hoarder and it was horrible. We very rarely visited her as her house was not safe, clean or hygienic. I only took the DC's once to see her but there was broken glass on the floor, dirt, dust and mould everywhere. It would be a big No from me. Don't let them persuade you otherwise.

giantangryrooster · 27/06/2020 01:24

Best case perhaps this could be the push that made them confront their problem, they should seek cbt. As far as I know being aggressive when questioned/confronted is very normal behavior for this mh issue.

GreenTulips · 27/06/2020 01:28

Fire trap!

ittakes2 · 27/06/2020 01:34

I have found some of these replies with people’s perception of hoarders interesting.
I have a major hoarding problem due to my childhood for which I am getting therapy. But my house is not unclean or unsafe. But to be fair I do have a cleaner who comes a few times a week to help keep it clean.
There are different levels of hoarders - it is not true that hoarders only stop people coming in when things are really bad. Hoarders stop people coming in when they feel they will be judged by that person/people. My family and my best friend have come in my house but I will do an extra tidy up if anyone is coming in who I think will judge me.
Regardless, if your in-laws do not want you in their house that would ring alarm bells for me. Having them babysit outside / taking her places is not a long term solution. If you don’t trust them with her safety in their house what is the difference with them taking her somewhere? They will be the same people. I think you are going to need to sort out a different childcare option and hope time heals this family rift.

Desertislanddreamer · 27/06/2020 01:34

Absolutely not. My ILs are lovely but they are horders so my dh and I don’t allow them to babysit our kids. We don’t go into their house anymore as it was awful, having to climb over piles of junk and nowhere to sit. Mades me shudder just thinking about it, not a chance in hell would I let my baby lie around any of that 🤢

Sunshines21 · 27/06/2020 07:58

My FIL spoke to my husband about all the ways they’ve helped him over the last few years with money. My husbands grandma was a hoarder too but she allowed people in the house so my husband went there when he was young. So that was a lot of the basis of my FILs argument. He’s made my husband feel like a disappointment to them which is just ridiculous!

OP posts:
Allmyarseandpeggymartin · 27/06/2020 08:02

Could they come to your house op to do the babysitting?

TheresABearInThere · 27/06/2020 08:06

You can’t let a baby go into a horder house, they are varying stages of unsanitary, dirty and dangerous. No way!

Spinakker · 27/06/2020 08:09

But they aren't letting you in the house to see what it's like ? Seems they are upset but probably deep down they are upset with themselves but have tried to flip it around so they don't have to face the problem. I would not let them either. Also even if this kind of childcare arrangement was going to take place at their home it would be normal for you all to be invited in regularly for your child to get used to it. If none of that can happen they are being deluded if they think you'll let your child their unattended. If they really want to help they'd be happy to come to your flat and entertain their grandchild or take them out to the park or somewhere. It doesn't sound ideal. Good luck ! I'd try and keep things on good terms with them but tactfully say no to childcare in their home.

Bluemoooon · 27/06/2020 08:16

You can't risk it - imagine huge piles of books or just stuff toppling onto baby. Maybe there are mice.

Sleepingboy · 27/06/2020 08:20

Can you not explain you wouldn't let your child go to a nursery you haven't visited so why would you let them go to a house you haven't visited? Turn it round on them and ask why you cannot go and visit their house? Why not, every time. If they dont let you then the only answer is because they also know it isn't suitable for a baby so you have proved your point.

GreenTulips · 27/06/2020 08:21

Hoarders stop people coming in when they feel they will be judged by that person/people

Sorry but PPs have been clear that they love their relatives but that environment is unsafe for their child. They are responsible for that child’s safety and well-being even when in the care of others.

I have one in my family and they don’t see the dangers of objects lying around that may affect small children.

Florin · 27/06/2020 08:23

I wouldn’t let my baby in there either if I wasn’t allowed to see where my baby would be. Could you set up a desk in your bedroom and then they look after your baby in the main part of your home?

Disfordarkchocolate · 27/06/2020 08:25

Firstly, ignore all the emotional blackmail. They are being very unreasonable and you all know it. You would not leave your child anywhere at this age without seeing it. Family help does not change this.

Secondly, your job as parents is to protect your child. Other people don't get to decide how you do this without good cause. Family help does not change this.

Good luck managing working with a baby, it will be hard for you both. I may have missed what your husband does but don't fall into the trap of thinking you have to make all the changes. You both need to speak to your employers so see what you both can arrange.

glitterelf · 27/06/2020 08:26

When was the last time you were in contact with any nurseries ? Nurseries are now allowed to be open for non key worker families. If the nursery you had chosen is not now open the likelihood is that it never will be. There will however be nurseries and childminders who are fully open and with available spaces so I suggest you try contacting them again.
Hoarders or not no child of mine would be going into somebody else's home for regular childcare without me ever stepping foot in it.

TheVanguardSix · 27/06/2020 08:30

My FIL spoke to my husband about all the ways they’ve helped him over the last few years with money. My husbands grandma was a hoarder too but she allowed people in the house so my husband went there when he was young. So that was a lot of the basis of my FILs argument. He’s made my husband feel like a disappointment to them which is just ridiculous!

It's also really manipulative. My mother is a hoarder and a guilt tripper. She uses guilt as a last resort when not getting her way, pulling out the 'bad daughter/look how much I've done for you card' when she's unhappy with not getting her way. It's a total bummer. My mother has 8 grandchildren ranging in age from 31 to 6 years old. They never see her house. I grew up without grandparents. So to have a mother- an available grandmother- who has chosen to hoard over being a loving, living grandmother, has been an incredible source of pain for all of us. She has grandchildren who literally live nearby and don't know her at all because inanimate shit taking up every corner of her house and garage has taken precedence over loving her family on real terms. Pictures of her grandchildren on her mess of a fridge is enough. Her hoarding stems from her own pain. I am so sad that, at 84 years old, she's not ever changed. It was very stressful growing up with her but because of my dad, the hoarding was not allowed to get out of control. It got worse in later years and it's become impossible since my dad died 16 years ago.
My eldest is 18. The last time he was in my mum's house, he was 3. Of course he's seen her over the years because she has come to stay with us. But we're never allowed to see her on her turf.
But I remember when he was small (he's the only one of my 3 who has been inside her house), the choking hazard (from all the shit like staples, screws, bits of glass, paper clips, embedded in the carpet) was just unbelievable.
I see there's a hoarder on this thread. Get help! You can justify your actions all you want, but it's misery for others. And here you are OP, your DH is the 'bad guy'. Unbelievable. But if that's the spin your FIL wants to put on it, screw him. How dare he guilt trip and humiliate his own son. I've been there. It hurts. Your FIL is not being loving or understanding here. You do not have to protect his embarrassment. It's his damn problem he's a hoarder. And if he's embarrassed, well, he needs to get help, not dump on others and pass the buck by making your DH out to be a 'disappointing son'. I am sorry to sound harsh, but I put up with years and years and years of damaging guilt. I've spent my entire life worrying about my mother, sleepless and in despair over her. I've been trying to fix her my entire life. I've worn her hair shirt on her behalf and I'm done. Don't let your PILs put their burden onto YOUR marriage.

I am so sorry to get on my soapbox, OP. But the pain of my mother's hoarding has been a heavy burden. If I were in your shoes, I'd use this as a perfect time to reach out to your DH, who will be carrying around a lot of unresolved shit thanks to being raised by hoarders. This is a great opportunity to purge himself of the guilt he's carried, the shame, the anger, the sadness. Sorry if I've gone off on a tangent. Your post touched a nerve. Grin But I've been there with the baby in the hoarder's house and it's definitely not worth the risk.