To think 'cancel culture' is going way too far?

[Okeefe]

I've gone on twitter this morning to see #CancelKimmel trending, the reason.. he sang the N word when rapping a Snoop Dogg song in 1996.

Jenna Marbles being 'cancelled' due to doing blackface in a Nicki Minaj impression is 2011.

I swear every time I go on the internet, someone else is being 'cancelled'

People are digging up ancient tweets belonging to celebrities and normal people alike, searching for racist/problematic key words and contacting their employers, losing them their jobs and more often that not this content that they are 'cancelling' them for is historic

Are people not allowed to grow up? I'm pretty sure when I was in my early teens if I was singing along to a rap song, I would say the word like any other lyric. Would I now? No. Because I understand that it is offensive. Because I'm an adult now. Because times have changed.

I've had to quit twitter, it depresses me so much. You can't disagree with a word this woke generation say, or you too will be 'cancelled'.

It’s The Reign of Terror for the Twitter era.

What began with moral intent has been thoroughly derailed.

On the other hand, cancel culture in the US, for example, has largely been led by women, particularly Black women, who are - on evidence - some of the most politically under-represented, economically deprived, and legally disempowered people in the United States, if not the western world.

If cancel culture was started by black women, it has now been appropriated by white men. It doesn't matter who stared it, its a method that can be used by anyone.

This is slightly changing the subject but I get the feeling sometimes that some celebs/wannabes are trying to weaponise cancel culture because it’s almost seen as a badge of honour to be cancelled. Like if you are “cancelled” it legitimises you as a celebrity.

There are multiple little-known Instagram influencers or YouTubers who have made videos crying about how they’ve been “cancelled” and how they are “learning.” Then you look at their comments section or @ replies and the video was in response to maybe 6 comments saying “that thing you posted was kinda racist.” The wannabe makes a big hoo ha and gets lots of sympathy for being “cancelled”, when the “cancellation” was literally six people saying “kinda racist.” Then the wannabe influencer gets a piece on BuzzFeed and loads of PR as a result.

In some cases it almost comes across like the influencer deliberately said something borderline “problematic” in order to goad people into calling them out, just so they could realise a crying video.

but the reason people who are the most marginalised use Twitter as an outlet is because they don’t have any other way to make their voices heard

The most marginalised are being cancelled on twitter too. Just look at the men pouncing on women wishes to discuss issues facing women. Twitter is controlled by that most adulated and powerful of groups: transgender ideologues, and they use their power to further marginalise any who dare to disagree.

YANBU. I worry how far it'll have gone by the time my kids are grown up.

@merrymouse just as the law is a method that can be used by anyone, but is most often used by wealthy white men to protect their interests.

"The Law" does not operate in an objective vacuum, just as cancel culture doesn't.

FWIW, for the Indigenous people where I'm from, British law represents a genocidal nightmare. Cancel culture, not so much.

There can be no redemption, no apology acceptable, no pity for the slightest infraction, no matter how trivial or how long ago These a-hole social justice warriors need to be faced up to. Easy for me to say as I have no job to lose. The only light on the horizon is that they will begin to turn on each other. I think it’s already started, and there will be no escape for them

@Cornettoninja

From my point of view both words are highly offensive and shouldn’t be accepted in the U.K. in any form if the goal is to stop it being used as an insult. We’re fairly simple creatures and hearing words used by the groups who are most stigmatised by them implies that either the meaning has changed universally or it has become less offensive. Because that’s how language works - blanket rules.

You keep changing what you say, Cornetto. But anyway.

You're putting the onus on BAME people to police white people's language which is unfair,

The 'p' word has been around for along time, long before racists claimed it in the UK. Why should Pakistani people kowtow to white people by giving it up?

The 'we're simple people' argument doesn't work, educate your kids not to use it.

It was interesting to see a BLM statement within the UK talking about indigenous peoples too. I thought it was something that doesn’t translate on this side of the Atlantic where the people they are railing against, the people who are in ‘control’, are the indigenous people.

Another thing.

I have tried to politely argue with a couple of posters here, not in order to puff my chest out and act as thought cancel culture is some awesome panacea; but to hopefully remind people that ideas like "the law" mean extremely different things to different people.

Cancel culture makes a lot of sense when you think about how unjust justice systems are for so many millions of people.

Cancel culture -which thrives on spectacle and controversy - is also a strategy to get issues like racism and sexism into popular / public debate. It's so shocking and spectacular that the news picks it up, and people have to start talking about things like Blackface and offensive racial slurs, which are issues they mightn't normally pay attention to.

It's like toppling over statues. Also very spectacular. In response to statue vandalism here as part of BLM protests, our stupid Australian Prime Minister declared last week that Australia "didn't have slavery" (WRONG) and then was forced to backtrack when it was pointed out to him that yes, we did have slavery actually. This story made headlines in popular newsmedia, forcing normally pretty ignorant Australians to talk about this for the first time ever. It's brilliant.

FWIW, for the Indigenous people where I'm from, British law represents a genocidal nightmare. Cancel culture, not so much.

There are many, many problems with the British Legal process. However, it is created via a democratic process, however imperfect. We can vote for better legal aid services and for legal reforms.

There are no controls on 'cancelling'.

Personally I recommend staying off Twitter. It's full of overly woke arseholes who can't stop banging on about their causes.

It's like toppling over statues. Also very spectacular. In response to statue vandalism here as part of BLM protests, our stupid Australian Prime Minister declared last week that Australia "didn't have slavery" (WRONG) and then was forced to backtrack when it was pointed out to him that yes, we did have slavery actually. This story made headlines in popular newsmedia, forcing normally pretty ignorant Australians to talk about this for the first time ever. It's brilliant.

Just checked. You still have the same PM.

Tweets and likes are easy. Real change is difficult.

"Cancel culture" is horrible, but I must admit that I find a certain grim humour in it when the ones participating in the cancelling suddenly find themselves pulled into the vortex of "cancellation" for their own past (perceived) misdeeds.

I'm happy to let them eat themselves. Just wish they'd leave everyone else alone. They're not making the world a better place.

@Aesopfable I haven't seen that statement. Sounds interesting.

I gather it may be referring to the millions of Indigenous people who have been displaced due to effects of British colonialism, and are perhaps now residing in the UK under difficult circumstances as a result of those histories.

BLM use a global framework because international capital (and therefore power) moves internationally.

One example is the British government and royal family's ongoing revenue collecting from mining on unceded Indigenous lands in Australia. It is a great source of distress for communities who've been tasked with protecting these sites for future generations, for 50 000 years. You may have heard, for example, about Rio Tinto blowing up 50 000 year old Indigenous cultural sites in Western Australia last month. I understand your queen is their biggest shareholder.

@merrymouse

It's like toppling over statues. Also very spectacular. In response to statue vandalism here as part of BLM protests, our stupid Australian Prime Minister declared last week that Australia "didn't have slavery" (WRONG) and then was forced to backtrack when it was pointed out to him that yes, we did have slavery actually. This story made headlines in popular newsmedia, forcing normally pretty ignorant Australians to talk about this for the first time ever. It's brilliant.

Just checked. You still have the same PM.

Exactly. Powerful men almost always stay powerful, regardless of the stupid shit they say.

@merrymouse

Yes.

Ah, so the only measure of political change is if a Prime Minister is overthrown for making an incorrect statement. Brilliant!

I'm arguing with a pack of angry and confused white women here.

I'm out.

I'm arguing with a pack of angry and confused white women here.

There is whole bunch of assumptions in that statement!

I think we are collectively stupid - there are so many examples in history of what happens when we take this route and we are blithely ignoring every single one. My take on it is that we have created the modern times Tower of Babel with our social media and we are heading for some really rough times unless we can find good leaders to help us out of our current quagmire.

I would rather cut my hand off than sign any petition or use any hashtag that is calling for people to be punished or fired. Anyone who takes part in this will find out to their cost that they are on their own when the mob turns on them.

What really, really irks is that no apology is ever good enough, sincere enough or comprehensive enough.

The echos of Mao's Cultural Revolution get louder every day.

This isn't hysterically digging backwards through people's stuff. These are posts that caused hurt/ offence but the people hurt were not listened to / had no platform. Now there is a speaking out going on about times that celebrities took the piss for their own ends.

You keep changing what you say, Cornetto. But anyway

I don’t feel I am, I’m simply expanding on my points when you raise them. My point had been consistent. A word is offensive or it isn’t regardless of who uses it because language is important and it isn’t easy to change the rules that have existed for all languages everywhere for millennia. I’m still waiting on another example of a word that is subject to similar restrictions.

You're putting the onus on BAME people to police white people's language which is unfair

No I’m aiming for clarity and understanding because that’s what eventually leads to cohesion and peace rather than ambiguous rules that lead to people with otherwise no harmful intent being demonised.

The 'p' word has been around for along time, long before racists claimed it in the UK. Why should Pakistani people kowtow to white people by giving it up

Where did I say Pakistani people give anything up? My point is, and always has been, either a word can be used by everyone or it’s unacceptable because it has a definition and meaning which is racist and intended as an insult. At this current point in time it’s offensive in the U.K. and there is no hiding from what it means when the majority of the population hear it regardless of who says it.

The 'we're simple people' argument doesn't work, educate your kids not to use it

My kids wouldn’t use it, along with many other common slurs/insults precisely because I educate them that words have meaning and power. How we communicate indicates to people what exactly what kind of person we are and has repercussions beyond our own interpretation.

CathyComesHome I am not defending the the crimes of convicted rapists at all. If someone has served their sentence they have to feed and house themselves somehow or should we hardworking tax payers fund their lifestyle for the rest of their lives ? I for one dont see why we should when that money could be used for people that can't work. As for those that have never been convicted even if they are as guilty as hell that is a different story.

@eaglejulesk

I have a solution:

#CancelTwitter

Best advice!

Yep - and TBH I wouldn't miss Jenna Marbles or Nicky Minaj :)

People do not have enough to do at the moment as a lot are on furlough or unemployed so these things tend to get a bit over the top particularly during the summer, sometimes known as the "silly season". It will calm down in the Autumn. Just be careful what you say in the mean time.

If people can be kind to others and treat everyone fairly which I think my family has tried to do for at least 100 years and probably much longer you cannot go far wrong in life.