School Staff. How do you feel about summer schools?

[Witchcraftandhokum]

Just watched an ex-Ofsted inspector on BBC Breakfast talk about how important summer schools will be and how they should be staffed by the same teachers students have normally.

This hasn't been mentioned in our school yet but I really don't know how it will be managed. I can't imagine a lot of staff will be happy to give up their holidays. In our school a good number of the middle leaders and TA's salaries are pro-rata'd to term time only. I've worked full-time from home so it's not like I've been on holiday since March.

How would you feel about being asked to work?

@Sinuhe
I don’t moan about my job as you are implying. I’m getting on with it because it’s what it required. I also have the greatest respect for each and every profession whose jobs have changed or become much more demanding over these past few months. However, many teachers, including me, are defending themselves because each and every day they are under attack from people who claim to know all about their job because they know a teacher. It’s all very demoralising.

@BlessYourCottonSocks

I'll volunteer for your kids. If only all parents were like you. Thanks for your support for teachers at a time when it feels like we're despised by all.

If all I can do is raise my voice to make sure teachers hear that not all of us think you're a pack of feckless grifters, then that's what I'll do!

I have spent my time on these type of threads robustly defending and sticking up for teachers who seem to get the worst kind of abuse from parents on here.

However after reading the number of bitter, unrealistic posts on here from rankly inflexible people who seem to think everything has to stay the same despite a pandemic, then I won't be adopting the same position anymore.

People crying out "my DCs deserve my time during the summer", "no fucking way", "I'm tired" etc....do you have any perspective or understanding of what other parents with DCs have been going through?

I think there'd be a lot less of these kind of back and forths on here if some teachers didn't act like they were Atlas holding up the mountain.

Holding up the world even

Most teachers/support staff/admin staff I know in schools have also been working from home and home schooling....same as every other working parent. If other careers were asked to work their holidays/work for nothing/have their terms and conditions changed without warning they wouldn't lie down and take it. Why should school staff? Oh hang on, it'll be because of our LONGGGG undeserved holidays, right? I give up.

If all I can do is raise my voice to make sure teachers hear that not all of us think you're a pack of feckless grifters, then that's what I'll do!
It's appreciated. Most parents at my school are totally reasonable too.

Unfortunately one glance at Mumsnet during lockdown and you can start to see how a minority of parents in normal times manage to swallow huge amounts of school time. They're complaining about teachers not wanting full classes of 32/33 in rooms originally designed for 30 during a pandemic now and think their DC's school should mirror what the local independent ones do, but in non-covid times they'd be complaining that their DC didn't get the part they wanted in a play or that school have starved their child because the one item their DC wanted on the menu at lunch was sold out towards the end of lunch service.

Some parents become quite well known for their endless unreasonable complaining (for the benefit of the inevitable 'eeeh teachers think they're gods' cries, the key is unreasonable, not those raising perfectly legitimate concerns).

I think there'd be a lot less of these kind of back and forths on here if some teachers didn't act like they were Atlas holding up the mountain.

You over egged your hand at the end there.

You are also pretty much ignoring that
all of these "back and forths" haven't been started by teachers.
And
Teachers are not paid for the holidays. There is only so much good will that you can expect, 6 weeks of unpaid voluntary work is a bit much.

@frippenos

And if they were paid for the holidays?

@GinDaddyRedux

And if they were paid for the holidays?

What you you expect them/us to do? the holidays cannot be moved so the next break would be?

my mum is a nurse, she has 150+ hours in lieu from scheduled overtime. (She won't get paid for it as different system to NHS) Currently, there is no way for her to take this time off, if anything she is adding more hours every week due to staff shortage.
Not once does she moan about it. It's only teachers on MN that work hard, above and beyond... other professions may not about as much, simply because they are working!

The difference is nobody is calling nurses lazy, claiming that they've been on holiday, or telling them that they should be expected to work unpaid for 6 weeks.

The difference is nobody is calling nurses lazy, claiming that they've been on holiday, or telling them that they should be expected to work unpaid for 6 weeks

This.

do you have any perspective or understanding of what other parents with DCs have been going through?

You do understand that a lot of people who work in school (not just teachers) have children too? That they have had the same struggle of juggling working at home with children to care for as other people have had.

Summer school is not happening at my school because we have delivered a full on-line curriculum.

Parents have even joined some of our online MFL curriculum clubs to learn a some Mandarin and Italian and a couple are on the photography club.

The difference is nobody is calling nurses lazy, claiming that they've been on holiday, or telling them that they should be expected to work unpaid for 6 weeks.

This!

‘Teachers are shattered they need a break. They have been working extremely hard, ‘

Glad to hear yours have been, ours have done sweet FA. That being said there’s no way they’d work over summer - even if you paid them I do t think they’d be happy to

People crying out "my DCs deserve my time during the summer", "no fucking way", "I'm tired" etc....do you have any perspective or understanding of what other parents with DCs have been going through?

Yes, we do. We didn't cause Covid and nor can we solve it.

In my opinion children badly need some time to step away from the screen and a holiday from the incessant home schooling. Or even the feeling that they should be being incessantly schooled.

My sons ex was a newly qualified nurse and she had 7 weeks leave a year allocated to her straight away! She worked long shifts 3 days a week , but I was amazed at the time off she had. Nobody would begrudge them this annual leave. Teachers are bashed but many work extra time unpaid and work over the holidays too, all unpaid. The wage bill to have everyone in over the summer would be huge.
I feel they are value for money as they are educating our young. This virus affecting everything isn't their fault. Many are doing their best.

Glad to hear yours have been, ours have done sweet FA. That being said there’s no way they’d work over summer - even if you paid them I dont think they’d be happy to

Same here 🙄

@GinDaddyRedux erm...many teachers are also working parents who have also had to juggle their job whilst caring for and educating their own children.

I’m not a teacher.

I DO NOT believe teachers should work during the holidays. They are not paid for this time, but even if they were paid overtime to work I don’t believe they should have to.

My year 4 sons school has been amazing, but even if they hadn’t they SHOULD NOT HAVE TO WORK IN AUGUST.

It’s not their calling or a vocation. It’s their job! NOT the same thing

I also WFH. It’s difficult to do my job from home but it’s difficult for others too. I also struggle to home school my year 4 son. BUT THAT IS NOT THE TEACHERS FAULT and they shouldn’t have to work in August just because it would make my life easier.

I wonder how many of the teacher bashers on here don’t even bother with homeschooling because “it’s not my job”. Not all - but lots I’m sure

To all teachers - look outside of these threads and you will see there are plenty of us who appreciate what you’re doing.

To put this first: I don’t think summer school makes any sense - the kids going won’t be the ones who really need it. If anything, summer school will make the gap bigger.
But
in my opinion children badly need some time to step away from the screen and a holiday from the incessant home schooling
Sorry, no. a recent study showed tgat 17% of kids havecdone nothing, and only 17% more tgan 4 hours per day. I’ve done several studies combining questionnaires (as used above) and behavioural observation (so looking what parents and kids actually do), and i’m confident that parents over estimate what their kids do for school by about 1 hour per day. which approximately doubles the number of kids who have done nothing...
I don’t think summer schools are the solution, but it is an educational disaster.

And making teachers work over summer isn’t going to solve the problem- its going to destroy the school system (or what is left of it)

It is very hard to be fair for everyone. Eg my teacher husband used to work eg a month in the summer holidays on a paid summer camp for extra money - we had a daily nanny for our children and he also did private individual teaching. so not all teachers are normally simply looking after their children in the summer - some have summer jobs

On the other hand plenty of private sector workers have had massive pay cuts and increased hours imposed on them and we now have over 2m unemployed and most of the 500,000 state school teachers and 1.4m NHS workers have not had pay cuts and extra hours forced on them.

Just watched an ex-Ofsted inspector on BBC Breakfast talk about how important summer schools will be and how they should be staffed by the same teachers students have normally.

What about getting Ofsted inspectors and ex Ofsted inspectors to do it?

Agreed.
All Ofsted inspectors should come in and teach all the classes.
Seeing as they know it all, it should be no bother to them. Easy peasy.

Doubtless their classes will be outstanding on every level and i'm sure i'm not the only one who would like to come into their classes and observe their excellent teaching style.

They're paid pretty well too, so they'll not mind doing it for free.
Sorted.
I'm looking forward to it.

I've been working from Feb without a break. That means working from home, in school with the key worker children, helping to clean the school, shopping in supermarkets (putting myself at risk) in addition to my own shopping to provide food for our most vulnerable families via the food voucher scheme, delivering learning packs, online learning etc.

If people were more appreciative and valued school staff I might consider it, but since I won't get any thanks for and it will be unpaid then, no thanks.