To think that it is crazy to be ending lockdown now, and that this will definitely lead to a disastrous second wave?

[Staysafer]

Given that the UK currently has 8,000 new cases of coronavirus a day and numbers now appear to be rising, and given that the 5 tests the Government insisted would need to be met have not been met, AIBU for worrying that ending lockdown now will inevitably lead to a hugely dangerous second wave?

Four members of SAGE, including Jeremy Farrar, the director of the Wellcome Trust, are now openly disagreeing with the government decision to ease lockdown.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52858392

I'd like people to vote on this because I think that it is still possible to avoid a second wave. But that requires action to be taken now, and also for everyone to be aware of their continuing need to socially distance and take precautions as before.

So YABU = you think ending lockdown will not lead to a second wave, it will all be fine.
YANBU = you think ending lockdown now will lead to a second wave.

NB This is one IABU where I really, really, really hope IABU. Unfortunately I don't think I am. But time will tell.

[shinynewapple2020]

@Biglittlethings sorry I don't understand where the increase due to VE Day is on that graph ?

[EmeraldShamrock]

There'll be a uptick next week and the next based on the Durdle Door pictures.
I'm unsure if people are fearless or foolish.

[Cornana]

I think there was a specific window in which lockdown could have been toughened up and people would have cooperated. I think that window has now been lost, and it’s too late now. They had a chance to get it down, didn’t and now people are tired of being indoors.

[OneNewName]

I think there will be a second wave but not sure if this timing is to avoid it being in the winter.

[2468whodoyouappreciate]

It's people not the government at the end if the day.
People cba.
People don't care.
They're bored.
They're impatient.
They want normal and they want it now.

People should be able to be responsible for themselves but in reality lots are taking the piss (out of themselves ultimately).

We all want the world and our lives back on track blah blah but too many people are now just pulling in their own direction. Doing what suits them. The more people that please themselves the more others think, why should I be the the sad Fucker staying at home.... and so it spreads (the relaxation of attitude and to the rules). That's why you get rammed beaches, buses, people feeling too relaxed with social distancing.

It's on mumsnet 20 times plus a day ..... People saying its so hard to catch the virus outdoors. I'm not saying EVERY one of those people no longer stick to the 2m rule but some don't and again, the more that don't means even more don't bother.

It's an absolutely shit show. Lots of people pissed off with Covid living and doing what they feel safe with regardless of anyone else or the guidelines. Bending and flexing the guidelines to make their life better, to suit their needs.

It's so typically British and arrogant. So Many people thinking they are above the virus. We will allpay for it, but it's ok because let's just remember that lockdown was about making the NHS cope and not being over run, so now we just need to get on with life.

[Titsywoo]

What @Chessie678 said

[cornish009]

Btw opening schools in Denmark hasn’t made situation worse so hope it goes the same way here

Children in Denmark do not go to school until they are 7. And it is far easier for a 7 year old to understand, social distance and wash their hands than it is for 4 and 5 year olds in reception here. So I'm not sure we can compare.

[Kokeshi123]

The countries which have relaxed their lockdowns are mostly seeing no signs whatsoever of any second wave. As mentioned above, Sweden's laissez-faire approach, while it has certainly resulted in more deaths, does not appear to have made much difference to the PATTERN of deaths over time---their curve is a remarkably similar shape to that of other countries.

Many East Asian countries never had a lockdown. We never had one in Japan, just lighter social distancing. Few deaths and the virus appears to be more-or-less under control. Other Asian countries like Taiwan, S Korea and HK did even better. And Taiwan never even closed its schools, just masked up, pushed lighter restrictions, and did good test-trace-centralized quarantine from early on.

[Biglittlethings]

And today they’re announcing the shielded can leave their homes and meet up with one someone from another household

Are they crazy?!

[Bakedbrie]

Guy lives next door to me - has a heart condition. Sitting in garden today BBQ with chums all next to each other dead close - complains about having to cancel 6 holidays this year! 🙄

[skeptile]

@Chessie678 I agree with everything you said, and could have written an identical post had I the capacity!

[Papatron]

Yes, well said @Chessie678.

[Namenic]

I think some regions in the country would be ok to exit lockdown because they have low cases. I think it is better to do local easing of restrictions dependent on local infection rate rather than a global lifting of restrictions and subsequent local lockdowns as Matt Hancock suggested. A travel restriction rule to prevent low infection areas from being swamped would also help.

[PineappleUpsideDownCake]

Not the point- but it is harder ti catch it outdoors isnt it ? We've been out more for walks thinking the odd person close for a second and keeping to one side of a path was okay.

[MGMidget]

What I have noticed is that some people flout the rules but as relaxations are lifted they flout them further, stay ahead of the curve. Neighbours around me are doing this! Also the parks nearby are now looked quite packed, like a normal summers day. I am in London where there are many flat dwellers so parks used for sunbathing and outsdoor socialising by many and, of course, outdoor socialising is the only type allowed at the moment. On top of this the rule breakers around me have been having visitors round their houses for weeks and now this is growing into bigger indoor parties! I am worried about what is coming next winter but I think the government and taxpayer cant afford lockdown to continue. I think they are hoping to create some immunity in the population reduce the winter crisis in the NHS and want to keep it circulating so they can trial the vaccine asap and keep developing their knowledge of this illness over the summer months before the real demand on the NHS starts to bite in November. Meanwhile we get a few months of trying to keep the economy going before lockdown stage 2 in the winter. The second wave is undoubtedly coming, the question is whether complete protection now with a strict lockdowm is better or worse that a gradual spread in the population. The virus may mutate and get worse. I an not sure there is a good choice to make. Things are going to be grim for different reasons whether we ease or not - either we have extreme poverty/hardship, looting riots etc but less virus spread or a bit less poverty and rebellion but more spread of covid over the coming months. The second wave will come anyway, in my view, but its hard to know if strict lockdown now would make it less bad in winter or worse (eg because of lack of progress of vaccine or less oppotunity for Doctors to try different tratment methods now or because virus mutates to become more effective at spreading where spread has been limited).

[IDontLikeZombies]

The UK's schools aren't all open this week - Scottish schools aren't going back until August. That might be because we finish up for summer in June and it might be because Nicola has us creeping out of lockdown at a very prudent snails pace.
I never thought I'd say it but I really hope Westminster is right. England is looking pretty scary right now and I fear for you all.

[twinnywinny14]

The infection rate is still high though isn’t it? Many countries eased their lockdowns when the infection rate was lower than ours didn’t they?

[DomDoesWotHeWants]

People are so damn selfish. You see it time after time on here that people know they and their families are low risk so will push the boundaries. They want more easing of restrictions to suit them and to hell with the vulnerable.

No sense of community, no feeling of us all being in it together.

[Iggly]

It's people not the government at the end if the day

I completely disagree.

The public followed the lockdown guidance very well. Very little non-compliance actually.

then this government lifted the guidance, talked about re-opening schools, their advisors broke the rules, they’re winding down the furlough scheme...... making noises about track and trace to give the impression that they’ll be able to monitor cases (which is a lie, they aren’t there yet and have no concrete processes in yet).

So what do you expect?

The government have indicated that things can be eased 🤷🏻‍♀️

I’d agree if the line was still stay at home.

But it isn’t.

The government are pulling a fast one here, getting ready to sow the seeds of blame.

They do it all the time, blame immigrants, blame the poor scrounges, blame teachers and now it’s going to be blame the “public” for breaking the rules of lockdown.



Why doesn’t the government take responsibility?

[DreamingofSunshine]

@Chessie678 wrote it perfectly.

@cornish009 my nieces and nephew are in preschool/nursery equivalent in Denmark, it's very similar in terms of small group bubbles etc. They are 1,2 and 4.

One of my consultants told me that a second wave was inevitable, and she felt it'd be preferable to happen in Aug/Sept before the normal flu season starts.

I'm on immunosuppressants for an autoimmune disease RA. With they way things are going I won't have had an appointment since December (not even a phone call) and no monitoring beyond one blood test. I'm overdue an x-ray, and a scan for a heart condition. I'm just one person but an example of the many who aren't receiving normal care which could mean that serious medical issues isn't being diagnosed. This could be causing more deaths than CV19.

DS is in the process of being diagnosed with SEN but it all stopped due to lockdown. He's desperately missing school and I can't get him the additional support he needs until he's diagnosed. Again, there will be lots of children who are struggling away from school.

I think we should have locked down harder to begin with, but there's no way they'd be able to reintroduce restrictions now. After the DC fiasco I think most people would shrug and ignore the govt.

[dottiedodah]

I think the Govt is in a difficult position .On one hand letting everyone (Including some of the Shielded) out seems hasty .However on the other side we will have a flattened economy if it goes on too long.

[Iggly]

The government’s public health messaging on this has been poor and I couldn’t work out if it was deliberate or not.

When Boris first announced lockdown - it was on TV, but not everyone watches tv and not everyone saw it (I remember speaking to my mum for example who hadn’t seen it).

The only place to find guidance was on their website, which is clunky to navigate and again - not everyone would see it.

Why don’t they put out a proper mass media campaign about these things?

Too much was being allowed to spread by hearsay especially in the early days. I remember being struck by that.

[twinnywinny14]

@EasterIssland why does everyone compare our education system to Denmark? Their death rate is far far lower than ours at 97 per million compare to ours which is 569 per million. Their schools have older children than ours do, and we are sending the pungent 2 year groups back. They have much larger spaces to separate children and have invest heavily in additional sinks and toilets etc which our government have not. They are in groups of 10 compared with 15 in this country. There are strict social distancing measures in place and children are never less than 2m apart, the guidance for schools in this country is ‘maintain 2m between children if possible’ and if it’s not possible? Carry on regardless, not good enough reason for not opening! Our education system is nothing like Denmark and we cannot sensibly compare it or think because they’ve done ok we can? The government have regularly told us in the beginning we cannot compare countries yet now it suits them they want us to compare ourselves to countries we couldn’t be more different from

[Aridane]

Yes, @DomDoesWotHeWants

And you see it time and time again here with the rallying cries of let the healthy out, the rest can shield

[FrodoTheDodo]

@PineappleUpsideDownCake Yes, don't waste a second worrying about that.