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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think it really doesn't matter what the rules are now?

215 replies

Ultrasoft · 23/05/2020 07:32

No-one's going to follow them.

I am a real rule follower. I've done everything by the book since day one and despite all the hysteria about people breaking rules, so has almost everyone I know.

But when the man who effectively runs the country and wrote the rules makes it clear they don't matter I feel like something of a mug for having been so "good".

I haven't seen my parents or been anywhere outside my town in weeks but he was fine with travelling all that distance with symptoms to see his.

AIBU to think whatever the next/current phase rules are it will be very difficult to get the public to comply?

OP posts:
OntheWaves40 · 23/05/2020 09:29

He should resign.

Xenia · 23/05/2020 09:30

Cummings might technically not have broken the regulations actually if he was going to check up on and look after his parents as you are allowed journeys for that. Eg my son drives out regularly when local people on a group he is on need him to drive to the chemist, pick up their medicines and drive them to their homes.

UntamedWisteria · 23/05/2020 09:32

he wasn't going to check up on his parents though.

He & his wife had the virus, he was going to use them for childcare.

Therefore putting his parents at risk - because even if 'Dom & Mary' isolated from his parents, there's every chance their child could have passed the virus on to them.

Alsohuman · 23/05/2020 09:32

AIBU to think whatever the next/current phase rules are it will be very difficult to get the public to comply?

I think quite the reverse actually. I think getting some people out of lockdown will be really difficult. Look how many people say they won’t send their kids to school, don’t want to go back to work, are frothing about people quite legitimately visiting the seaside and beauty spots.

There are people who absolutely love living under restrictive rules and are very reluctant to let go of them.

Spillinteas · 23/05/2020 09:33

Economy before lives

You are aware that less that 0.5 % off 66 million people have died from this. The rate of recovery is almost 100%. And if you catch this virus 98% will have mild symptoms.

Of course we need to look after the economy too. If we don’t there will be hospitals, schools, police force, benefits will get slashed. The economy needs to survive this. We’re not all going to die.

LondonJax · 23/05/2020 09:33

The difference between Cummings flouting the rules and people flouting rules on a beach is that, presumably, the people on a beach don't know whether they have Covid 19.

Both Cummings and his partner had tested positive or at least had symptoms. I can understand (from a parental point of view) why they decided to travel. If your parents have a property or annexe where you can isolate but are close by to take your child if you both end up in hospital it seems a solution. You may well take a chance, if the grandparents were willing, to ensure the safety of your child.

My dread, as it is with many parents, is that the adults get hit badly at the same time with the virus and the children are left to fend for themselves. Even on a basic level someone has to make the decision to call an ambulance - which a four year old can't. And this virus can change very, very quickly. So I can understand the thought process, though I'm not supporting it.

But, Cummings had more knowledge than we, mere mortals, about the virus at the time. It's not the moving in to his parents that's the real issue here. Some families did move in with grandparents - especially if there was dementia to deal with or having the kids looked after by gran/grandad meant the adults could work.

The thing with Cummings is that he took the decision to travel KNOWING he was ill, as was his partner. They were contagious. You're not telling me they didn't stop at all. OK, with petrol you could do a 'self service pay by credit card' type pump and use gloves. But I don't know any way of isolating yourself on a motorway if you need the loo. And with a four year old in the car on a 4 -5 hour plus journey you're likely to stop more often than just adults.

So he has, potentially, knowingly infected umpteen people on the motorways between London and Durham. Most of whom would have been key workers as no-one else was supposed to be travelling at the time.

That's rather different to people sitting on a beach assuming they don't have the virus and behaving like prats.

derxa · 23/05/2020 09:34

He endangered members of the public by travelling, a 275 drive requires loo breaks/fuel/snacks and from reports from the NE, he was mixing with his family, who would have been shopping for him. He did endanger people but let's not over egg the pudding. Loo breaks are the only thing necessary here.

eeehbyegum · 23/05/2020 09:34

@EmeraldShamrock Yes I believe so, first covid case in France was late December. They latterly tested. We as a country are so shit with testing, but quite obvious we had it here if they did. I know so many people I’ll over Xmas/ Jan with same symptoms

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.france24.com/en/20200505-france-s-first-known-covid-19-case-was-in-december

HandsOffMyRights · 23/05/2020 09:35

No, I would never put my parents who are in their 70s at risk of dying by asking them to take my possibly infected child.

Roussette · 23/05/2020 09:35

Exactly LondonJax

Inmyownlittlecorner · 23/05/2020 09:40

My SIL is a single parent of 4 & 2 of her DC have SEN & need lots of additional care. DH & I are her respite care. (MIL died unexpectedly a year ago). We live in a major city & she lives 2 hours away but we visit every other weekend or she comes to us so we can help out. We’ve not seen her since the end of feb. Her mental health is suffering terribly. She’s spoken to her GP & SS but they’re unable to offer anything. She has been amazing but is absolutely reaching the end of her coping ability. We have stuck to the guidelines since the beginning & I know that others not doing that doesn’t mean we should follow them but we absolutely feel we need to go & stay with her soon. DH is a total rule follower & is finding it a hard decision to make though.

eeehbyegum · 23/05/2020 09:43

@Inmyownlittlecorner you are allowed to visit / help vulnerable people. You are not breaking the rules doing so. The risk of infection is very low if you’re all staying home bar shopping etc.
In your case I’d absolutely be continuing respite care for your sister x

merrymouse · 23/05/2020 09:46

You're not telling me they didn't stop at all.

Even if they didn't stop, the general public were told that they shouldn't travel far from home because if they broke down they would be endangering the lives of anybody who had to come out and help them.

People have undergone real hardship because they were told that they must follow the rules to save lives and protect the NHS.

Now we learn that one should only follow the rules if convenient.

Peregrina · 23/05/2020 09:49

‘ If the fine weather holds and with a Bank Holiday this Monday, it will be OK then if everyone goes to the beach?’

This Bank Holiday Monday is still the future and as people have pointed out to me, the rules have now changed and yes, it will be OK. But the time Cummings was travelling from London to Durham, those weren't the rules, as far as I know.

eeehbyegum · 23/05/2020 09:54

@Peregrina you’re taking your own post out of context. Yes it’s fine to travel to the beach under current rules, and yes you did set a timescale. Please don’t gaslight me!

Roussette · 23/05/2020 09:55

I shall be carefully watching the Press Briefing tonight. I hope it's Little Matty Hancock.. given he was 'speechless' that the scientist Neill Ferguson broke the lockdown rules, far less spectacularly than Cummings.

There is so much wrong about this. His wife, a journo for the Spectator, was writing about looking after 'Dom' , intimating that was happening in 'London lockdown' all whilst he was dancing round the garden to Abba in the North East.

FFS Cummings was instrumental in throwing Neil Ferguson to the wolves.
The lying and hypocrisy does my head in.

Peregrina · 23/05/2020 10:00

I am not 'gaslighting' anyone.

Look at how many people have been criticised for flouting the lockdown rules by going to beaches and beauty spots, yet when Dominic Cummings drives half the length of England it's apparently only his business and no one else's.

What were the rules at the time? Was Cummings breaking them? Who set those rules? It wasn't you or me! It was a Government for which Cummings is the key adviser.

If the fine weather holds and with a Bank Holiday this Monday, it will be OK then if everyone goes to the beach?

And as people have pointed out, the rules have now changed, and yes it would be OK now.

At the time, Cummings was breaking the law. Do we all break laws because they might change in future? Or is it only Government Ministers and Advisers who are allowed to break the law?

Ultrasoft · 23/05/2020 10:01

Also the arrogance Roussette, although no surprise there. He knew he'd done this when he was throwing NF to the wolves. He must have known there was a good chance it would come out, but has complete confidence that his position won't be threatened in the same way.

OP posts:
Smellbellina · 23/05/2020 10:04

a 275 drive requires loo breaks/fuel/snacks

If you’re a toddler!

Peregrina · 23/05/2020 10:04

The Scottish health minister resigned when it was found that she had visited her second home. What time did that happen?

Peregrina · 23/05/2020 10:06

If you’re a toddler!

Isn't his son about 5. How many five year old's can go that distance without a loo break, or wanting a snack, or needing to run around?

Roussette · 23/05/2020 10:06

Ultrasoft personal feeling at this moment in time is... this will not die down. Anf so it shouldn't. There are a lot of very angry people out there. Let's hope that arrogance takes a bashing

TazSyd · 23/05/2020 10:08

I’ve just nominated Dominic Cummings as my role model. So I’ll be doing whatever the hell I like 😁.

HandsOffMyRights · 23/05/2020 10:15

amp.theguardian.com/politics/2020/mar/22/no-10-denies-claim-dominic-cummings-argued-to-let-old-people-die?__twitter_impression=true

This article talks about Cummings' alleged lack of care for older people.
It says he then did a 360 and became an advocate of a strict lockdown. For everybody else!

LondonJax · 23/05/2020 10:24

Well, according to Mary Wakefield, his wife, he went down with corona virus within 24 hours of coming home to help her as she went down with it and was ready for an ambulance by day 6. So either they had travelled up to Durham before they were symptomatic (which begs the question why?) or they were both showing symptoms when they travelled. Apparently he was confined to bed after the first day or so with fever. How the hell do you decide to travel - even if you were allowed to - at that point.

And, as they live in a £1million plus house I would imagine they'd have room for his parents to stay with them or found a hotel nearby if they were very worried about child care if they became more ill and the parents were willing to take the risk. They're both not short of a penny or two. Surely, under those circumstances, it's better for the well to travel to the sick than vice versa?

Here's the Spectator article where Wakefield tells how ill Cummings was. And this man travelled - this wasn't just feeling a bit 'icky'.

www.spectator.co.uk/article/getting-coronavirus-does-not-bring-clarity