To say I'm half Irish

[Winederlust]

Just wanted to settle a petty argument between DH and I.
I was born in England. As was my mum. My dad also. However both his parents were born in ROI. They moved to the UK as young adults and met, married and settled with a family in England.
I think that, although my dad was born in England, he is full blooded Irish. Which in turn makes me half Irish. My DH reckons I'm quarter at best.
Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things but just interested in the general MN population's thoughts?

Informal abortion was common in the past, although often they might be relatives so still family.

I’m guessing you meant adoption here, yes very food point.

*good

Chandler - YES!

Your dad was half Irish therefore you are a quarter.

@serenada That is really awful. I am genuinely sorry you're not the first to say they have been treated like that. It is unacceptable.
I hope in the future you get to experience kinder more modern Irish not the bigots you met.

I think most Brits are familiar with London Irish as a distinct third culture concept. 🤷🏽‍♀️

Why are you allowed to make sweeping statements about British people’s cultural perceptions but I am not? I strongly disagree that it is a well-known concept. Unlike the concept that someone could be British with Irish parents, which presumably you are saying is not the same thing as London Irish? 🤷‍♀️

I wish I knew who Dermot O'Leary is.

If your grandparents are irish and your dad was born in England then you have Irish blood

@gwenhwyfar, my god you must be very young.

He was very popular on british tv, a presenter. On saturday night.

I don't have a tv but I still know who he is!

Dermot O’Leary literally is English with Irish parents and I said that most people would assume that. I can’t get my head around why you are so desperate to argue that the majority of British TV viewers would make a wrong assumption about him?!

He was on the radio for years as well, with his english accent.

So many londoners have parents from Greece, India, Poland, Italy. I don't think London demands that its londoners be second generation london. It doesn't. I know that. Not sure about little england though.

I notice even from friends who emigrated in 1993, the Ireland they think of as 'home' it NO LONGER EXISTS really See I think this is ridiculous. Yes Ireland has evolved and become multicultural as has most places unless they're living on a desert and not evolved in 27 years. Infrastructure, same sex marriage, abortion were all things people wanted. Teenagers are doing the same today as they were when I was a teen in 1995 except with iPhones and expensive shoes.

You only have Irish grandparents, which makes you one quarter Irish. Your parents are British.

You are English with Irish grandparents. Your father is English with Irish parents. "Irish" isn't a race. It isn't a blood type. It's a culture. A nationality. You have links to it through your grandparents so, if you wish, you can acknowledge that heritage. Equally you can claim to be just English. There is no fraction or percentage involved. It depends how far back you look. Even the Irish aren't pure Irish.

Saying that London Irish is understood by most people as a distinct third culture concept sounds like it is falling into the classic trap of assuming that the whole country thinks like London.

Although I have lived in London for decades and was only vaguely aware of the term as being something to do with rugby...it really isn’t as well-known as you think. I was, however, fully aware of huge communities of Irish people who had emigrated to the U.K. and had children here.

I think it's complicated.

I do think disapora populations are different to those who stay in the home country, and I think that can be a positive thing (two different cool kinds of heritage) but also leave people stuck between two worlds. I have a friend who was born in London to Irish parents and definitely always thought of herself as Irish but since she's moved here (Ireland) she's said she's become really aware of how English she feels in comparison. I think she's slowly building a composite identity but it's definitely a different thing to the identity of someone who, for example, was born and raised in County Donegal.

On a slightly bigger and more global scale, my mum was from India. I absolutely view that as an aspect of my heritage, and, of course, racism means I can't totally forget it, but I'm not Indian in the way my cousins are. Where you live and where you're brought up impacts on your culture and self and base assumptions too. Nationality isn't something that just exists in your DNA.

Your dad was half Irish therefore you are a quarter.

My understanding of half Irish, or whatever, is having one Irish parent and one parent who is not Irish. As her df had two Irish parents, he could be described as Irish, or English with Irish parents, or just English. However he could not be described as half Irish.

@EmeraldShamrock

Thanks. And I mean it - I know most are like you. I respect the history and need to distinguish but when it comes directly down to people who are trying to show they are in union with you, like you, understand you and want to be friends most people aren’t so viscous.

And I know it’s only a small group of people. X

I see Dermot as Irish. He has Irish parents. I asked dh and he said he's English with Irish heritage.

I'm Irish, born in Ireland, lived there 30 years. Dh is English. We live in England. Dc born in England. They say they're half- Irish: half-English. Just asked them and they said they're more Irish though because they came from my tummy. They've also only ever had an Irish passport.

I have friends here in England who were both born in Ireland, lived there 30 years before moving. They have 4 kids and if you ask the kids they all say they're Irish and are very passionate about it. I can't see them ever identifying as English despite being born here.

Op as you have a mixed heritage you can identify however you like, but I don't see you the same as my dc (50:50) as they have a parent who was born and lived in Ireland and their heritage on one side of the family is all Irish- as far back as 6 gens at least. Your grandparents lived in Ireland, not a parent which means culturally you will probably not have been exposed to the same things as you would've with a parent.

Viscous. Quite right, most people aren’t so viscous.

Viscious , I meant

Look, just learn to do Irish Dancing, then you'll definitely be half Irish (I'm also half Irish, btw)

@Olliephaunt4eyes

Yss Es- composite is a good word. Multidimensional. It’s like the bilingual kids who grow up with parents speaking one language at home. The preference becomes the everyday norm but only out of experience. The other isn’t ignored or seen as inferior and can be reignited and build up another time depending on resources.

To reduce all people to a simplistic , nationalistic ‘home’ identity’ is really dangerous. It keeps people small when people who travel, grow, develop are expanding ideas of identity. They are all relevant, those in one place, those in many. I think many Irish who stayed in Ireland felt drowned out by returning voices? And needed to assert their identity (quite rightly) but it shouldn’t be seen as the only ‘correct’ one.

Ironic really as when English people do that it is right wing, xenophobic and racist.

Should say expedience, not experience.

@onegirlandherdog

I’d fail that one

Kicked out of first lesson.

Ethnicity and nationality are not the same thing, although many European countries are often very much ethnonational states where there is not much distinction between the two.

I’m from a country where there is a significant difference, in that we’re all the same nationality but have different and recognized cultural roots.

So to me, your ethnicity is half Irish but your nationality is British. Very simple.