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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Scottish school return 11 Aug

206 replies

TheGlaikitRambler · 21/05/2020 13:06

How do those in Scotland feel about the plan for Scottish schools to return on 11th Aug part-time only?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52745643

OP posts:
RaraRachael · 22/05/2020 18:06

I have heard mention of a mixture of home learning and time in school, but don't understand how that is going to work. If I'm in school with half my class, who provides the online work for those at home? I can't do both Confused

Dinosauratemydaffodils · 22/05/2020 18:07

I have kids if differing ages, work in community nursing already on flexible working with a DH who works away a lot (unlikely to change) how will this work?

A lot of my friends feel similarly. Husbands work away, work can only be so flexible. Getting childcare especially if it's one week on/one off would be a nightmare. Ds is just going into primary 1 and I don't see how remote learning works for that age group without full adult participation which won't be possible for lots of his friends (siblings, work etc).

ssd · 22/05/2020 18:08

This will be a nightmare for working parents. What employers will be that flexible, when there's unemployed folk champing a the bit for a job
The government need to set legislation so parents can't be let go if they continue to need flexibility.

AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii · 22/05/2020 18:12

@Dinosauratemydaffodils we do have a childminder for during the holidays but she has young kids herself and probably won’t want to have other kids and try and homeschool her own?

AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii · 22/05/2020 18:13

@Dinosauratemydaffodils plus then there would be the extra costs of having to pay a childminder for even more care, we budget for the holidays but it will cost a fortune having to pay all year round

MurrayTheDemonicTalkingSkull · 22/05/2020 18:20

@RaraRachael - Education Scotland are putting resources together, I hear. I’ll not hold my breath for those...

midnightstar66 · 22/05/2020 18:21

I have heard mention of a mixture of home learning and time in school, but don't understand how that is going to work. If I'm in school with half my class, who provides the online work for those at home? I can't do both

From what I understand class sizes will be small - so for example at my DD's school there are 3-4 teachers per year plus extras for SFL, M&T PE plus SLT teams. If only 20 from 90 are in from one year group that leaves the excess teachers to provide the online content. For smaller schools it might mean groups from more than one year taught by a different teacher and the other providing the at home learning. I also have read that they will be recruiting more teachers

Subsume · 22/05/2020 18:23

Maybe the government/councils could hire unoccupied office buildings and staff and facilitate this blended ‘home’ learning for small groups of children, say roughly the same age, for the weekdays that they’re not in school? And may, I dunno, pay for it out of a tax they charge on citizens? ... oh ... hang on ...

Mistressiggi · 22/05/2020 18:34

Well you're a rare teacher @midnightstar66 who has had no home learning to prepare! There must be exceptional circumstances around that. Fancy imagining that that was the case for most of us though? ConfusedConfused And posting about our extended "holiday" on the internet?

midnightstar66 · 22/05/2020 18:39

I am not a teacher and have never claimed to be. I am school support staff.

Mistressiggi · 22/05/2020 19:43

Your posts did not make that clear I do not believe. Don't you think when you post talking about staff being paid to stay at home, in the current climate it would be wise to mention that your role is different?

midnightstar66 · 22/05/2020 19:58

All I said was I work in school, if I was a teacher I'd have stated so. I've no idea how you assumed that from what I said, I thought it would be obvious. I'm sure you and others are aware there are many more roles in school than a teacher. Fwiw I work incredibly hard in an extremely challenging role for very little money usually, and have stated I'm happy to give up my DC's second ruined holiday as I feel so guilty that I haven't been able to help more. I've volunteered often but as a lone parent I've been instructed to stay home as providing a key worker space for 2 dc when they aren't short of staff would be counter productive . The majority of my colleagues are in the same position.

RidingOn · 22/05/2020 22:09

This thing affects us all differently, and it's not people's fault if they're furloughed or laid off. Nor is it something to boast about if you have to work from home, imo. We're only doing our jobs, after all. But just because this is definitely harder on some than on others, it doesn't mean anyone should feel guilty. It is what it is. Anyone who is educating their own children and staying at home is also doing their bit.

RaraRachael · 22/05/2020 22:27

midnightstar66 I don't know where they think they're going to recruit extra teachers from. We can't even get supply for odd days.
Maybe they think lots of retired teachers will come flocking back. Any I know who have retired recently wouldn't come back for love nor money.

FirTree31 · 22/05/2020 22:42

So pleased to at least have a date to work towards. I assume schools would have been planning for this prior to the announcement, and have time to August. I just really hope the councils do their bit in assisting schools get set up and acquire more spaces. It's so important children go back to school. And I'm sure teachers will be pleased.

Pootle40 · 22/05/2020 22:49

I'd consider a Fife the central belt and we weren't due to go back as early as the 11th or 13th.....

Pootle40 · 22/05/2020 23:02

Also I hope the 'science' proves limited transmission from children to adults to avoid the madness of part time school going ahead. What a joke. Send them back to school.

midnightstar66 · 22/05/2020 23:06

@RaraRachael I don't know either- I'm only repeating what I've read in various reports. So many now I've lost track from where I've seen it.

jacks11 · 23/05/2020 00:04

I’m very disappointed by this decision. Not based on any assessments of actual risks posed to children (or indeed teachers) based on current evidence. It is possible there may be a slight increase in r rate- but most projections suggest this is small (and short-lived). I also think effective track and trace systems are important- but no a million miles away from that. I understand the return of schools might not happen immediately- but it could be done even for a short period. And why can’t schools who have longer terms re-start and work through to their beginning/mid-July end of term (if they wish to)?

Evidence is that children under age of 15, and especially under age of 10, rarely become seriously unwell (even when they have underlying health problems). They usually have mild illness or no symptoms at all. Children are also far, far less likely to spread the disease when they do have it. For instance, one case study suggested an infected child had over 170 contacts before 1 transmission. Population studies of the Italian village of Vo (extensive serial testing when whole village in isolation) also suggest children less likely to test positive for the illness even if they live with an infected person and no obvious cases where a child was the index case. I will concede data is not extensive, but it is consistent. Data regarding the rate of infection (I.e. do children get the virus just as often as adults or not) is a bit less clear.

If children are less likely to pass it on to each other or to teachers (and therefor less likely to take it home as unlikely to pick it up at school), and are less likely to become ill if they do catch it (you are statistically more likely to have an RTA both on the way to school and then again on the way home than of your child becoming seriously unwell due to Covid-19 infection).

The main risk is teacher-teacher transmission and if parents congregate at drop off/pick up time. The focus needs to be around making plans to mitigate these risks, but it really is not impossible to do- it does require planning and quite possibly additional resources. I accept those plans hard to put in place in a week or so for all schools- but those that can show they have workable/safe plans should be able to so.

I’ve heard quite a few teachers say “it’s too risky to children”- evidence doesn’t support that. There is, however, a very real risk to children of damage to their future prospects if their education suffers. Disadvantaged children are going to be disproportionately affected, this is going to take a long time to rectify- if it ever can be (for these cohorts). Many children are suffering psychologically from the isolation from their friends. We risk our fear becoming more damaging than the real risk posed.

I’ve also the heard quite a few teachers say they didn’t sign up to teaching knowing they would have to put their lives at risk. This is true. But neither did many, many key workers- I guess teachers wouldn’t be happy if we all decided to stay at home. I suppose you could argue clinical staff are aware they may come into contact with infectious diseases, but hospital porters, cleaners, frontline NHS admin, bus drivers, workers in food production and retail, delivery drivers etc most certainly did not sign up to a job which posed a risk to their lives. So why is it ok to put these people at risk (and far greater risk than teachers), but teachers can’t be?

EachDubh · 23/05/2020 00:06

Fife kids were due back 19th, staff on 17th now 11th. However holidays will be honoured, at some point and the teaching year will stay at 195 days. So who knows?

Unsure how it will look in schools just now but all staff will be needed to teach smaller groups, not sure where these excess staff will appear from. Teachers in Fife will be expected to teach and provide online work, they just haven't yet figured out how to do it within 35h week.

My childcare will be grandparents, high risk group but have covered me to work in hubs and when i am in school I can't leave the kids alone so I am lucky grandparents are willing.

All support staff in our school have been working, if not in hubs then with set tasks, all in my department have been doing amazing work, none have had a paid holiday 🤔

June staff back in, but not all at once due to hub kids in, social distancing etc etc, but planning for return, setting up classrooms etc.

Can't wait to get back in and can't wait until it is school as normal for everyone. Not lookingvfirward to lunches in classroom. Carpets are only ever vacuumed, and poorly so food will remain for many years 😖 but will be good to see the kids again and not be recording myself daily and looking and sounding like a prat🤣

EachDubh · 23/05/2020 00:16

Scottish school holidays always start by the beginning of July, so they would never work until the end of July?

There isn't yet enough data to say children don't spread it or at what rate. The study of the 1 child returning from the ski trip didn't even test thosebin contact who had symptoms. Also in most places chikdren have been in lockdown so are far less likely to have been exposed and prior to lockdown were ess likely to show symptoms that wouldnhave resulted in a test. There ia hope that with schools re opening in Europe, in areas with lower R numbers that we can get more data, perhaps even prove that children don't catch/spread it very much and then we can review the guidelines.
For just now, with our numbers and data available this is a way to get all children back into school for at least part of the week.

midnightstar66 · 23/05/2020 07:03

I'm not sure why everyone is twisting what I said in order to get angry. Never did I claim or imply I was a teacher and never did I mention I was on holiday. I say sitting at home because that's pretty much what we've been told to do. I leave to take exercise but not even every day because it's so busy on the usually quiet paths near my home and to go to the supermarket when necessary. Even when I'm on a zoom meeting or doing my self led study or home schooling my dc - one of whom has ASN and it's been incredibly challenging I am at home so yes I am being paid to stay home. If it's a holiday then it's really shit and I want a refund! The only time we were set tasks was on the inset day after Easter break. That is not down to me so the anger and disbelief needs to be directed elsewhere.

RaraRachael · 23/05/2020 07:09

I hope ASN teachers are not going to be used to cover classes. Surely children are going

RaraRachael · 23/05/2020 07:11

....to need more support once they return. A lot of pupils haven't engaged in any home learning so the attainment gap is going to be even bigger.

MurrayTheDemonicTalkingSkull · 23/05/2020 08:55

@midnightstar66 - I misunderstood also and thought you were a teacher. Apologies for my sharp tone - obviously this is a bit of a touchy subject for me just now!

If you haven’t been given any work to do, that is definitely not your fault and you shouldn’t feel guilty. (Easy to say, I know the school guilt is real!)