To wonder where Boris Johnson is?

[littleblackdress04]

He’s never at the daily briefings and given that we are living through the greatest crisis in living memory, he should be there. The list of people at these briefings gets more bizarre every day.

He’s the prime minister and he’s pretty absent at the moment meanwhile the death count grows. 35,000 people - it’s truly devastating especially when you think that if there is a terrorist incident and even one person dies, it makes the headlines for days.

And before anyone says he’s on paternity leave, he’s a notoriously absent father who has many other kids and if that was anyone else on here, would get slated for not fulfilling his parental duties.

Aibu to think he’s shirking his responsibilities as PM- he should be there every day being accountable but he’s not- he’s sending in his minions. It’s truly appalling.

It’s very interesting that people are blaming the government for all care homes deaths when the bulk of care homes are for profit organisations, not government facilities. Surely these owners and managers should be bearing the blame for care home deaths From memory there was, at the time, some very conflicting information. With various public health voices sayingone thing, hospitals saying another and care homes yet another.

Eventually I suspect we will find out that some government advice was not good enough, some hospitals discharged some patients in error and some care homes didn't do everything they could have. But mostly we will realise that many things happened that should have been done better but a virus is a virus. We need to learn better for the next time - when we will have no excuse for not being as prepared as South Korea etc.

And that will include care homes, private, money making organisations who will have to accept the repsonsibility for stocking PPE, wages for care staff, training for care staff etc etc etc.

And a lot more besides - like NMW, the gig economy being shit and then, on the flip side how fucking wonderful small catering businesses are in an emergency and how much we call choose to do for neighbours when push comes to shove!

Hopefully we'll learn that it isn't a good idea to sacrifice several decades of good pandemic prep from successive governments to save a few bob.

Yup!

Can I add that I hope journalists and politicians alike learn that point scoring during a pandemic isn't such a good look.

Anyone remember what happened when Theresa May suggested we could all spend a bit more on social care? From the outcry of 'get your thieving State hands off our inheritances' she didnt dare proceed. This mess is the result of constant cuts and de-funding by successive governments. Could have been flu but turned out to be Covid. When will we accept we can't have services if we won't pay?

I worked in care homes for a while. We often didn't have enough PPE generally and when we were "barrier nursing" a patient known to have MRSA we were given the world's most flimsy apron on top of normal gloves. Most of us were paid minimum wage and had minimal training. I was told I would be trained when I applied, this turned out to be one shift shadowing another carer then i just had to get on with it. I was offered an NVQ level 1, the one they didn't have to pay for.

The care home deaths are utterly tragic but I'm really sad not to be at all surprised.

@JinglingHellsBells,Boris did not nearly die.
He was on oxygen therapy for 3 days and spent the rest of the time languishing in an NHS hospital bed.
Treatment that no regular person would get.

What makes me cross is that the NHS which is being privatised by the Tories is being used by them when needed for non essential treatment.
FFS

I feel like such as a cynic but I honestly believe that Boris and his cronies were looking at the pictures of Wuhan and Italy of patients on the corridor, panicked and thought HOW DO WE STOP PHOTOS LIKE THAT IN THE UK .

Not how do we save lives, but how do we save our own political careers. That's why the hospitals were emptied and coronavirus was exported to the privately run and local.authority managed care homes.

This has carried on with the prof Ferguson scandal being exposed by a conservative news publication and now a more wider scale blame on scientific advice.

The message, "we were just following scientific advice" came from the top and is just another example of this.

Now, instead of delaying the opening of schools and the wider economy by a week or two until the track and trace software is in place, the government is relying on newly employed, barely trained "trackers". And when that goes wrong the trackers will get blamed too.

What will it take and how many lives will be lost before the government put the public good before their own careers.

Completely agree ChickenNuggets. And it will be a bloody long wait before your last question is answered.

Can I add that I hope journalists and politicians alike learn that point scoring during a pandemic isn't such a good look.

Bollocks to that. Decisions are taken every day - they should be road tested . Without the scrutiny on care homes it would still be a dirty little secret.

Except I'm not talking about scrutiny. Not talking about asking questions, critiquing procedures, etc.

I'm talking about the lies, the obfuscation, the scaremongering - from all sides.

It is entirely possible to hold anyone to full account without all the fuckwittery we have been subjected to!

I do believe that the vote for AV in 2011 did not have a big turnout! It was more to appease the Lib Dem's and loads of people I knew didn't even bother voting or even know it was going on ! I walked into an empty polling booth and was stared at in surprise. I voted to keep the 'first past the post ' as AV isn't PR and was more of a 'half way house 'idea that wouldn't have altered that much ( based on my understanding at the time and I did do a bit of research and it was discussed on the radio a fair amount at the time as well)
P R seems to work well in other countries but I don't feel there is much appetite for it in the U.K. and a vote on PR won't happen for decades now if at all! It suits most political parties to keep the current system and is only ever addressed after a general election usually!!

@CuriousaboutSamphire can you provide examples of the point-scoring that doesn't reflect scrutiny of decisions?

FPTP suits the Tories and Labour usually get a disproportionate number of seats out of it too. Even in 2019, where it artificially created that massive Tory majority, Labour still ended up with a close match in percentage of votes cast and seats won. It has also suited most nationalist parties lately.

It is perfectly reasonable to question where the PM is during a national crisis regardless your political views.

I find it astonishing that posters lack depth in critical thinking to the degree that they can only see this in party political lines.

He's a Tory, I vote Tory so I must defend at all costs.

Some of the decisions made, particularly in the early days of the pandemic, need to be scrutinised with reference to the scientific information available to the decision makers at the time. In particular, the decision to ignore advice to Test and Track the virus, the decision to keep borders open with no quarrantine, the decision to allow mass gatherings to continue, the reasons for the lack of PPE, and the decision to send patients back into care homes.

With over 35,000 deaths and counting there ought to be an independent Public Enquiry.

Asking if another government would have done better is entirely irrelevant and is a deflection, what matters is if THIS government has acted appropriately.

For balance I think there are some things that they have done right, the furlough scheme being one of them.

Yes Ritz I can. Starting with almost any question asked by Laura Kuhnsberg, Robert Peston and Beth Rigby over the last week or 7. Especially the ones where they got shouty, or when Peston argued from a point of total ignorance with an epidemiologist.

Oh, and the opposition MPs who, when asked if they could try talking about what was happening now said no, they couldn't because they wanted to continue to talk about what happened in January or February. Including the one who talked over the BBC news woman because she wouldn't let him carry on.

That sort of crap, along with the lying headlines, not just the obvious ones but ones like those about Piers Corbyn's 'mass protest' and the close cropped pictures. All designed to scare, incense. Like there weren't enough real occasions, like the London bridge gathering.

Add that to the general obfuscation, hesitation and reworking of plans, strategies etc. All sides, all parties. Because, as I keep on saying in threads like these, I am not a Tory voter, I was a life long card carrying Labour Party Member for 30+ years.

I don't want party politics at this time. Or sensational headlines or post truth bollocks.

I want level headed analysis and accurate reporting, on the good and the bad ideas.

I accept and expect that a lot of things done won't have been the best option, some will have been flat out errors of judgement. That's inevitable with a pandemic.

I don't accept the hyperbolic shoutiness or the impossible comparisons, mainly because the obfuscate the realistic comparisons and lead to more disinformation.

And I don't care if someone disagrees with me, thinks my perspective is bollocks. We all have varying degrees not knowledge of epidemiology, human behaviour, NHS and care home etc etc.

I don't mind discussing things where I can learn, add to my understanding. But I do mind having to put up with being berated for not agreeing with A N Other, not sharing their politics etc.

And far too many threads like this descend into that.

Demands, sneering, dismissive and rude responses. The internet version of sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting ner ner nee ner nee

He's an incompetent twatwaffle. Kermit the frog would do a better job.

There you go, the very first journalist question... Laura could not resist a dig. What was the point? She could have made a much more powerful point had she phrased that non question better.

And some disinformation from Beth... That's 48 hours not 24. Whoever you've been talking to was wrong.

However the journalist after her asked a bloody good couple of questions that led to a pretty extensive, still, going, set of responses.

Somehow the more regional reporters continue to ask the best questions!

I know some people with covid have been knocked out for weeks, months even with it.
I wonder if he’s still ill.
Didn’t he say he was taking paternity leave later in the year?

I wonder if he's still ill as well - but I also think he's a reputation for being a lazy shite - hard to know. If he's still ill he should step down and allow someone with more energy to lead the country.

I was quite relieved the journalists were asking probing questions given parliament weren't sitting at the time -someone had to, but I must admit I have stopped watching the daily briefing, the politician not answering the questions they were asked over and over again just gave me the rage. Interesting that Laura is now being seen as anti-Tory, the opposite accusation was being levelled at her last year, you think she has over-corrected?

"Somehow the more regional reporters continue to ask the best questions!"
Did you see the guy from the teesside gazette yesterday? I actually sent an email thanking him. Sad thing is I don't remember what the answers were but the two points he raised were spot on.

@CuriousaboutSamphire

We've got a death toll around 60k (one of the highest in world, however you count the numbers) i think having a so called dig at a govt that told us all in Feb we were very well prepared, indeed admired for our pandemic preparedness & allowed community spread is the very least Journalists should do.

Even now, we are not offering care homes routine testing, took weeks to order antibody tests and now have introduced a 14 day quarantine for anyone travelling into the UK... bizarre considering europe has had this sort of restriction for months and is now lifting it.

I don't see political point scoring from the opposition but i do see ministers who cannot or will not answer questions on their decision making, so its lead by the science and we just have to accept it.

I'm annoyed that Parliament is still taking their 2 week break next week despite the currant crisis.

jasjas it really isn't worth your while belaboring the obvious at me.

I know ... I am not stupid. I just don't have the same perspective as you. The point I was trying to make is that it would be far more constructive to be able to discuss what is happening without having to defend those different perspectives.

Talk to me, not at me. We may agree far more than you think!