To not want to ask?

[rabbitheadlights]

DP will do anything I ask of him, clean the loo, change nappies, even clean the oven!! However I have to ask every single time. He used to do little and after a few yrs of me resenting it, it unfolded that apparently he just didn't realise (I'm not so sure) but he said, just tell me what you want doing and I will do it! So now I do, but I hate it! I'm not his mother, I have no inclination to"mother" him, I want a partner, an equal and not a puppet and it's really doing my head in!

DH and I have been married for decades, he has his jobs and I have mine and it works very well.
You need to spell it out - split the jobs between you so that he is clear on what he Is expected to do and when it has to be done by. Don’t compensate - one of my DH’s jobs is taking the bins out - he knows if he doesn’t do it it won’t get done. Be strong.

Great article @justkeepmovingon and cartoon strip @nellodee

The links some others have posted it here sum it up perfectly. It's not about the physical carrying out of the tasks - it's the mental load. That is extremely wearing and issuing your partner with a list feels very emasculating.

If I don't think of things, they don't get done. I'm not a genius. The things that need to be done can clearly be spotted. It's described as an invisible burden and that's so accurate. The weight of always having to be the one to remember everything is overwhelming.

This isn't my post but I identify very strongly with this. It makes me feel resentful and taken for granted, and as if my DP isn't really involved in the home or our family. It feels like he just doesn't care - which I know isn't the case.

I liked the links etc posted on here. And I totally "get" what the majority of PPs are saying.

But....

What they don't take account of is the desitlre of one partner- usually the wife - for stuff to be done in a certain way at a certain time.
And, usually, the one complaining has a higher standard of cleanliness which they expect their partner to learn and adhere to.

Is the glass by the dishwasher still a problem if it's loaded tomorrow without prompting?

After years of doing nearly everything, my dh now does lots of the house work/cooking etc. However he lets me know every little detail of what he’s done. Whereas I just get in with jobs that need doing.

However he lets me know every little detail of what he’s done. Whereas I just get in with jobs that need doing.

I'd start doing the same as he is doing. 'I've emptied the dishwasher '... Reply with 'I've cleaned the bathroom' (or whatever). The implication in announcing every detail, imo, is 'I did this job FOR YOU'.

apparently he just didn't realise (I'm not so sure) but he said, just tell me what you want doing and I will do it! So now I do, but I hate it! I'm not his mother.

OP, I agree with you. 'What you want doing'...'eh, we both live in this house, I'm not the manager and you the staff.'

I suppose it's worth trying sitting down and drawing up a list and dividing tasks. And don't fall for the 'he doesn't see dirt/ untidiness etc'. Really, really?

Or 'he does the bins, and looks after the garden'... no comparison to the relentless drudge of housework.

Interested to know what people’s list of divided chores looks like ?

Do you spell out everything ?

He should know.

Saying that, I have to ask DH what to do in the garden because I just don't know....all the "jobs" he talks of aren't immediately visible to me...but maybe that's because gardening is more of a hobby and not like housework?

DH doesn't ask me what to do in the house....if he sees something to do, then he does it.

That's not the majority if men, that's taking the mick. My situation is different as my partner doesn't live with me (though been together years) but if he started treating me like his mum and needing me to write him lists I would dump him 😂

Of*

Same here. WHY do I have to ask? WHY don't you realise it needs doing and just do it?

Point in case from today : mattress needed putting onto bed and bed needed making. Sheets and mattress were dry by lunchtime. WHY did it take DH till 5pm to do it? WHY??

(I was working, BTW)

It's every single thing : fold the laundry, make the bed, etc etc, ad nauseum.

I voted YABU. because you already said, that your partner will do stuff for you if you tell him what needs doing, This is good. But you have to realise, that a lot of men, do not think about things that need doing, like women do. It is not because they had Mother's who did everything in all cases,, it is because they just don't think about some things, like you want them to think as such.

Some men can see what needs doing and get on with it, others can't. Your DP is one of the latter, so just ask him to do things - is it really so hard?

Saying that, I have to ask DH what to do in the garden because I just don't know....all the "jobs" he talks of aren't immediately visible to me...but maybe that's because gardening is more of a hobby and not like housework?

Gardening is the same as housework, it just happens outside the house. Unless you want to live in an overgrown ugly jungle of weeds of course!

I’d stop seeing anything related to him that needs doing, his laundry, his cooking, his anything.

If he asks tell him you’ll do it he needs to ask you clearly to do these things.

I’m always astounded when people declare ‘men don’t see these things’ ‘you’re lucky he does chores when asked’. I’ve got a couple of petulant teenagers on my hands already without my partner behaving like one too.

No where has OP said she doesn’t like the way her DH does housework. He doesn’t do it which is her issue.

I would certainly tell him the current situation is the biggest turn off for you.

And I pitch in with the garden (why is that man work? Because it doesn’t need daily care?), I can see if plants need watering and the lawn needs mowing, leaves need raking etc we both share tasks there too if he’s doing one thing I’ll do another.

I doubt he arrives at work and just sits there until someone tells him what to do? Or maybe he actually does have a job like that?

Most people have SOME initiative. What if you went away for a week.... Would the curtians stay closed, post gather on the door mat, bins not get emptied, pots build up, bathroom just get dirtier and dirtier etc....

A firm chat is it order, YANBU.

I bet your husband is not coming home after work and tells you: I’ll give the oven a clean and then I’ll quickly run the hoover and do the dusting.

No, he doesn’t need to announce that he’s doing cleaning. You know absolutely nothing about me or my relationship so bugged off with your pathetic assumptions. Dh literally did all the cleaning, shopping, life admin etc for three years when I was very unwell.

All this men that manage to hold down jobs but can't work out what needs to be done to keep a home and family running...

Yes. They are capable of doing the job they have been doing for years because they have learned what needs to be done to make it happen. That has nothing to do with doing things at home.

OP wants things done her way and wants him to do them. He will clean his oven when he think it needs cleaned. Why should he do it when OP wants it done? Why is she the one who decides it needs cleaned?

Interested to know what people’s list of divided chores looks like ?

Do you spell out everything ?

Yes
I do school, he does the clubs.
I do meal planning, he does cars
I do dry-cleaning, he does the dish washer
I do the kids GP, he does the vet.
I clean the house, he does bathrooms and toilets.
I do the ironing, and water the plants, he walks the dog and do the last-minute bits of shop we seem to constantly need... He does the pack lunches.

We are not robots, we actually talk and do things together, but for example clubs: I don't give them a thought, I am not in charge of childcare, of kits of anything. When there's a competition or show, of course children and Dh tell me and I go as well ,and if DH needs help with something he asks. It's just not on my flipping mental load.

Same with school, we juggle shows and outings but I am the one who goes through the school communication and planning.

it sounds worst than it is, it's quite smooth and it works for us.

"men are very simple creatures, they need clear instructions."

No, no no. This is exactly why we are in this situation. If we perpetuate the idea that they are incapable we are making a rod for our own back.

Our division (our DCs are adult so it’s now somewhat different to when they were young and he worked full time and I was part time):

His jobs, he’s retired - gardening (although he often gets a gardener in - that’s his choice), cleaning/dusting/vacuuming (apart from bathroom/toilets), majority of cooking, emptying bins, all marital bill paying & finances.
My jobs, I work 12hrs pw - driving (he doesn’t), laundry & ironing, clean bathroom/toilets, very occasional cooking when the fancy takes me, change beds.
We share loading/unloading dishwasher/washing up and meal planning/shopping.

I would stress though that his jobs are HIS jobs. I may occasionally help out, but if he doesn’t do them, he knows they won’t get done. I refuse to make a fuss about doing things to a certain standard and consequently doing it myself - that’s making a rod for your own back.

No, no no. This is exactly why we are in this situation. If we perpetuate the idea that they are incapable we are making a rod for our own back.

Of we get arsey because they don’t do things exactly the way we want them done, that’s the rod we are making for our backs.

Point in case from today : mattress needed putting onto bed and bed needed making. Sheets and mattress were dry by lunchtime. WHY did it take DH till 5pm to do it? WHY??

Well, WHY did it need to be done before 5 ? Was anyone planning to go to bed at 4pm ?

I agree with a pp (sorry, can't remember who) if you want jobs to be shared equally between adults in the house, then you have to allow them to be adults, and manage their time as they choose. If you are micro managing what they are doing, then there's no wonder they won't want to do anything.

I don't notice the same things that need to be done as my husband, people aren't always tuned into the same stuff.

Usually all jobs have a person who is mainly responsible and who manages, and a helper. If you want your husband to take on more initiative, I'd turn some jobs right over to him - they are his to manage and do, unless he asks for help. Often it makes sense to divide jobs that are related - like all car related things go to one person, or bills, or cooking and shopping often go together.

I'd pick something either you hate or which you think he'd do well at, and then go over what it includes and let him get on with it. Just keep in mind that there may be a learning curve for him at first, and he won't necessarily do the job the way you would. It's better usually not to shift too many jobs at once.

But you have to realise, that a lot of men, do not think about things that need doing, like women do. It is not because they had Mother's who did everything in all cases,, it is because they just don't think about some things, like you want them to think as such.

What a load of sexist bollocks this is.

The reason that many men don't do stuff is precisely because they weren't taught to do stuff. It's not necessarily the case that mum did everything, simply that the men weren't taught.

Me being born with a vagina does not mean I knew how to do housework before leaving the womb.

All of this, the housework and associated mental load is stuff that can be taught to both men and women. I am teaching my DS the same lessons that his sister is getting, about what is needed to run a house.

The pair of them (late teens) are doing fine, and in fact both can do any of the necessary chores and frequently do without being prompted.

Men who "can't see" what needs doing are falling back on what they have learned in childhood. Some of them can't see because they weren't taught, and the others can see, but choose instead to play dumb.

My ex was never asked to do chores as a child (although his sisters were), and grew up to be a self centred twat who specialised in palming all chores off onto someone else. One of many, many reasons he's an ex.