Children are not super spreaders, but answer me this...

[Happymind]

We can contract Covid 19 from objects so must take precautions... but not so much from children?

And children can go to school and be in contact with teachers, as they're not "super spreaders" but can not be around family members or grandparents outside their household?

The UK are following guidance from other countries regarding sending children back to school. They are reassured that there will be little or no covid outbreaks judging by other countries success. Yet the UK appear to be the only ones not providing PPE for students and staff?

Am I missing something?

A German study showed that children spread the virus the exact same way as adults do. The viral load is the same. So they not be super spreaders but they are still spreaders.
There's no logic at all to sending them back to school with no PPE, sharing toilets, etc, and not expecting the virus to spread. The school isn't a magical building with different rules from everywhere else.
It's also nonsense to say it's about emotional support and MH. It is much more disconcerting for DCs to be in a familiar place (school) and not able to act in a familiar way eg play with friends, hug them, stand beside their teacher, read books, bring in their own pencil case. At least, at home DCs can act how they have always acted (unless a parent is shielding).
I'd love to see a risk assessment on the psychological impact of putting DCs back to school in this way.

Right lets agree that nobody knows exactly what might happen and all we can do is get back to normal step by step and not let the NHS get overwhelmed.

It wasn't overwhelmed at the peak so we have every chance of that.

Yes, it wasn't overwhelmed because all other treatments and services were cancelled (which isn't sustainable and can't go on for much longer) and also, many people weren't allowed in to hospital despite actually needing to be there. Look at Germany and the treatment given to.people, at much earlier stages of the disease, and reflected in their death rate.

I agree other service need to resume but we've however many nightingales sat empty...

What is it you want? Lockdown to continue indefinitely?

Again, where's the data to support this? Maybe they don't die in the same numbers, but not as likely to catch it? Where's the data to show this

The point is they don't die in the same numbers. It's safer for younger healthy people to catch it.

I am still not convinced by the year 6 argument.
Realistically, what transition will happen?
Will secondary schools be letting them come round to take a look?
Will the secondary school staff be visiting them in their current school?

We already know that the children are not returning to what they left - in most schools at least half of these children will be (a) in their original classroom, (b) with their original teacher and (c) with all of their friends.

And if it really was about transition, surely then it wouldn't be just year 6 across the board - in various places across England transition happens ar Year 2, Year 4, Year 6 and/or Year 8. Surely our own Government and the DfE knows the transition years can vary in their own country.

What is it you want? Lockdown to continue indefinitely?

Not at all. We need to look at other countries that are doing much better and then following them - test, track, trace properly, have everyone wearing masks and only start opening up once this is in place. Then open up with cohort's who can follow social distancing much more reliably.

The point is they don't die in the same numbers. It's safer for younger healthy people to catch it.

The pupils might not but how about the staff and their families or the students families?

So they not be super spreaders but they are still spreaders.

As above - even the Government's own scientific briefing sheets says pretty much the same. They acknowledge there is low confidence in the thought that children don't spread the disease in the same way adults do.

Everyone needs to assess their own risk don't they?!

The school I know of isn't having staggered breaks - they aren't having breaks.

We won't be having official breaks but each group has an allocated area of outdoor space which they can use throughout the day. We only have reception returning (plus KW children) and they will have two adults with each group of 15, to allow for toileting, cleaning, teacher breaks/lunch, etc. With reception outdoor time is common throughout the day anyway so specific break times are needed for them.

ncase.me/covid-19/?fbclid=IwAR2U4F3XHp6zNPIr8vWtRsAkn2OnO6uUPRACuw9bms1Jk-Q2v54iWEk2AMg

Just going to leave this here. It's long but an interesting read.

ncase.me/covid-19/?fbclid=IwAR2U4F3XHp6zNPIr8vWtRsAkn2OnO6uUPRACuw9bms1Jk-Q2v54iWEk2AMg

Clicky link this time....

Because your child could give an infection to her grandmother, especially if she's been in school. Keeping children away from their grandparents is more often to protect the grandparents, not the child. Having said that, I don't think it's time for schools to re-open to any children except the ones at most risk of abuse or ones whose parents have to work in front line jobs.

You can assess your own risk until you're blue in the face, but you cannot CONTROL what risk others are to you. Even the most,'sensible' , 'alert' or whatever person cannot necessarily keep themselves safe from this virus because they don't know what infection level other people have or how careless they are, in some cases.

Well yes but surely you take other people into account when assessing your own risk?

This is why people are shielding because they are at bigger risk and others are still going to work etc because they're not...

Aragog

Different schools will obviously make different arrangements. The school I'm referring to has R, Yr1 and ye 6 plus KW children going in. There aren't enough staff to have more than one per class so no lunch breaks for the staff. No cleaning of toilets etc as no staff. Timetable being drawn up for each bubble to go to the toilet, all together, not as needed. No normal playtime. Only one bubble will be allowed out at a time, if possible, but not regular playtime or lunch break. All toys and equipment has been removed from the classrooms.

How will R and Yr1 children manage sitting at desks all day?

Use your brain. It is not that there is NO risk of children catching it or spreading it to their teachers, or each other, but that the risk of it being deadly is practically nil. That also goes for the majority of young (less than 60) healthy teachers.

In my situation, working in school does not mean I do not need childcare as there is travel time so my 72 year old parents with some health issues do that- they also look after my 92 year old grandparents. We don't have anyone elderly or with underlying health issues at home but many children and school staff do. Children might not be super spreaders but they are normal, run of the mill spreaders and bring together loads of extended families who it might be deadly to

Children might not be super spreaders but they are normal, run of the mill spreaders

There is not evidence to support this statement, unless you have access to emerging research you can share? The evidence base is early and shaky but currently points away from children transmitting at the same rate as adults.

How will R and Yr1 children manage sitting at desks all day?

My concern would be why they’re being asked to. Has the guidance changed to require this?

upthewolves yes I agree the 17 year old who gave an undiagnosed virus can’t be verified. Although her doctor parents are pretty convinced it was. That’s the problem - there’s limited data and so many anecdotes. And there’s a sixth form of 400 attached to the school.
However there is talk of Year 12s going into schools in small groups from 1st June.

How will R and Yr1 children manage sitting at desks all day?
Why should they do that?

Because all of the toys and play equipment has been removed (no one available to clean it) and in many of the classes there won't be teachers in charge of the class, they will be having tas overseeing the class who can deliver work set by teachers but won't be teaching.

Toys don't have to be removed the be chosen to do that because they don't want to clean it. That won't be the case for all schools.

Lunawuna didn’t read it in depth but enough to get the gist. Very interesting indeed!

Toys don't have to be removed the be chosen to do that because they don't want to clean it. That won't be the case for all schools.

It's not that they don't want to clean them, they don't have staff to clean them. And yes, not all schools will be like this. Some are saying they have two staff members per class but also some can't do this.

Cassgate you are way too logical and non hysterical to be on Mumsnet, don’t you know we are expected to lockdown forever ?
Alternatively we could realise this is no more devastating Illness to the vast majority of people than other illnesses ( 2017 50 000 flu deaths in England and nhs coped and no one social distanced and children did spread it ) and with enhanced hand washing and hygiene let people get back to normal