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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be concerned at the number of people on MN second guessing doctors?

229 replies

Wolfgirrl · 14/05/2020 19:38

Every day I read a new thread where the poster is canvassing opinion on whether to reject medical advice.

The most common seem to be wanting to refuse a caesarean/induction and not wanting to top up fail to thrive babies with formula.

I totally agree that everyone has the right to refuse medical treatment etc, but when it relates to a baby you're not just putting yourself at risk. It just seems selfish to me? Interested to hear other's opinions.

OP posts:
ScrimpshawTheSecond · 17/05/2020 19:05

GAhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

sauvignonblancplz · 17/05/2020 19:14

@ScrimpshawTheSecond Grin GrinGrin I completely concur .

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 19:15

😅

OP posts:
FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 19:20

So, your topic sentence was that you were concerned about women second guessing doctors. You were then met with a barrage of stories about doctors who've been wrong, but have disregarded them because that's not the type of doctor you're on about, or just not the type of issue. If the GP falsely diagnoses cancer as stress, we should discount it as an example of a doctor needing to be second-guessed, but when the GP suggests formula as a band-aid for a perceived problem they can't possibly be wrong about that and must be immediately obeyed. If an OBGYN misdiagnosed a cancer that isn't relevant to this discussion, yet when they advise something in relation to childbirth they must be infallible... Ultimately, women should be able to choose for themselves, the advice of one doctor is not gospel and should not be taken as such.

bluebluezoo · 17/05/2020 19:25

Now i know the true meaning of you can’t argue with stupid...

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 19:32

@bluebluezoo

Glad to be of service Smile and you've proved my suspicion that some women put their own 'motherhood experience' before the comfort or health of their kids.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 19:40

Can it not be that a baby is getting just enough that they dont lose weight or fall too far behind their peers, but not enough that they are full and happy and growing on target?

It doesnt have to be as polarised as either they're physically starving, or they have a medical condition that is stunting their growth.

OP posts:
JamieLeeCurtains · 17/05/2020 19:40

'Kids' is such an infra dig term

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 19:42

No idea what that means!

OP posts:
Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 19:49

@FourPlasticRings I just saw on another thread you let your child go without fluids for 10 hours a day every weekday so Hmm I might disregard your opinion now.

OP posts:
jgjgjgjgjg · 17/05/2020 19:56

The importance of shared decision making is written into so many standards of care and has been for a long time. I really don't know how it has managed to pass some people by.

www.nice.org.uk/about/what-we-do/our-programmes/nice-guidance/nice-guidelines/shared-decision-making

FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:02

Can it not be that a baby is getting just enough that they dont lose weight or fall too far behind their peers, but not enough that they are full and happy and growing on target?

Ultimately, if they're happy and are producing enough wet and dirty nappies, there's not a problem as far as I can see. My EBF baby was a massive chubster above the 90th centile, so I can't speak from personal experience, but I have a friend who struggled initially and her baby is quite skinny, but an early walker and talker nonetheless and a happy little thing. I don't see why her mum should give her formula just because she might put on more weight that way. Formula feeding is linked to obesity and I was told at NCT class that it's thought to be because parents following formula feeding guidelines about how much a baby of a given age should be consuming encourages babies to eat past the point of being satisfied, rather than stopping at that point as they should, and as BF babies do. As PP have said, the curves are actually based on FF babies and therefore are not an accurate representation of breastfed norms.

FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:05

I just saw on another thread you let your child go without fluids for 10 hours a day every weekday so hmm I might disregard your opinion now.

No, dear. My child was a year old and I let her go without breastmilk for ten hours a day while I was at work. She was offered both formula and cow's milk and refused to take it. She drank water instead and breastfed when I got home. But I'm starting to understand how you form your opinions- has your reading comprehension always been this poor?

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 20:10

@fourplasticrings

Mine refused any other milk, so she literally went without for about 10 hours every weekday when I was out of the house. She was absolutely fine.

No but your written English is!

OP posts:
JamieLeeCurtains · 17/05/2020 20:14

The 'kid' went without milk, not water

FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:14

No but your written English is!

Context, darling, context. It was on a thread about a woman returning to work with a similarly aged baby and struggling to get her into a milk substitute. Thus, without refers to milk/milk substitutes, not all fluids.

FYI, if you see me advising someone on a thread about toddlers and weaning from breastmilk that mine has one feed in the morning and one at night, that doesn't mean I'm advising the mothers of newborns to only feed twice a day.

I'm quite flattered that you've searched me though to try and dig up totally irrelevant points that you think might discredit me. Suggests that you've conceded the discussion at hand.

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 20:14

I dont think you see babies as people, real human beings that need to feel full and nourished and quenched. You would rather a baby was slightly under fed than topped up with a bottle. Which is cruel.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 20:16

Nope, and neither have 54% of the voters on this poll Grin

First dear, now darling. Can I suggest cupcake as the next nn? Always thought it was cute 🧁

OP posts:
FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:23

OK, cupcake, whatever you like.

I dont think you see babies as people, real human beings that need to feel full and nourished and quenched. You would rather a baby was slightly under fed than topped up with a bottle. Which is cruel.

See, now you're just derailing your own thread further by trying to draw me into an emotive discussion about whether I view babies as people or not. Believe what you like, cupcake, I'm not fussed. Suffice it to say that women are and should be entitled to second guess the advice health care professionals offer and weigh up the pros and cons with their own situations in mind. In all issues. Whether you agree with that or not.

ScrimpshawTheSecond · 17/05/2020 20:23

I think that's the anti-breastfeeding bingo card full, now.

We've had allergies, low quality milk, undersupply causing dwarfism, repeated attempts to shame women for their choices, ignoring of the medical evidence and insistence that FTT will be solved by magical formula, anything else?

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 20:29

Well to be fair from you weve had allergies as well, breastmilk being vastly superior, repeated attempts to shame women for bottle feeding, ignoring the fact the benefits are negligible and that breastmilk can magically cure everything.

Anything else? Hmmm. I do agree people should have autonomy over their bodies. I was not proposing inflicted medical treatment (apart from maybe vaccines, but that's for another time). My question was more: do you find it concerning that women consult strangers on an internet forum when making decisions about their child's health.

You have proved my point that with the breastfeeding thing it is feels over reals - you and the bf brigade get so emotional and neurotic over it, you instantly leapt at that part rather than looking at my question as a whole. Hence the thread derailing as otherwise you wouldve accused me of ignoring your post.

OP posts:
FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:29

@ScrimpshawTheSecond don't forget, 'Breastfeeding women are doing it for themselves, not their babies.'

Original poster
Wolfgirrl · 17/05/2020 20:30

Sorry can you quote where I said that..?

OP posts:
FourPlasticRings · 17/05/2020 20:39

My question was more: do you find it concerning that women consult strangers on an internet forum when making decisions about their child's health

Well, you could have said that in your OP. That's a totally different question to your thread title. And no, I don't, providing it's not their only source of advice. After all, breastfeeding websites and YouTube tutorials, which you've cited as sources of support for breastfeeding mothers, are also strangers on the Internet. If you look at breastfeeding support groups on Facebook, they're also strangers on the Internet. Invaluable for support though.

Also, as for jumping onto that one part of your thread, I think you'll find I didn't mention breastfeeding until my fourth or fifth post on here. The others were about general medical professionals making mistakes (ignored by you) and the risks of induction (also not responded to by you). You'll note that I didn't hop on to complain about not getting a response to those. My first breastfeeding post on this thread was in direct response to one you posted further down the thread. You can't blame me for the derail, OP. That's all on you.

EveryDayIsADuvetDay · 17/05/2020 20:39

About ten years ago I went to my GP because of heavy periods; she gave me drugs to reduce the bleeding - they caused a blood clot. Eventually insisted she do something more - after a year she finally examined me and thought I had fibroids, which turned out to be only part of the problem.
I then spent six months being bounced between gynae/cancer unit.
In all, I was prescribed eight different drugs, one of which specifically stated on the patient info leaflet not to take it with one of the other drugs I was taking. Queried with GP and Consultant - the consultants response was "oh, really, I didn't know that" - this at a top London teaching hospital. Insisted on transferring to another hospital for treatment, and made a formal complaint.
One of the drugs I was prescribed caused incredibly high blood pressure, which I'd never experienced before or since. The migraines that came from that drug resulted in my needing a brain scan.
One consultant insisted I needed to have a hysterectomy; in debating that they decided that I'd been prescribed warfarin for six months longer than I needed to be.
Eventually I was admitted after attending A&E because of heavy blood loss - all resolved with a minor procedure, no hysterectomy needed.

Separate occasion - I was diagnosed as diabetic. I reversed that with a low carb diet; the diabetic nurse was discouraging throughout, and said this was not possible. If I'd listened to her I'd still be on medication, although my GP was supportive on that occasion.

No - I don't bloody trust Doctors/Medical profession - I always do my own research now before meeting any discussion, and question, question, question.
That said - I do question the medical professional, rather than post here for medical advice.